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- Thread starter Wylie2016
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Do you have a wrought iron fence or aluminum fence? I see the terms being used interchangeably, but they are different materials. Aluminum fencing will hold up really well whereas wrought iron will rust if the powder coating gets damaged or wears off over time. We're putting in a heavy aluminum fence around our soon to be installed pool and have no worries. Most people in this area use SWG in their pools and have aluminum fencing.
Wylie (putting a first name in your signature or user name makes communication so much more,personal),
I agree with Matt's comments and I'll tell you, he is our best "science guy" here at TFP.
You are one of tens (maybe hundreds) of Texas/Southwest US hopeful pool owners who show up each season who pool builders sway with salt water scare tactics. They try to push you to tab chlorinators (like the one you have been quoted) or alternative systems (UV or Ozone) for one main reason, the stone available in your area is soft. At times there can be issues with it degrading and folks blame salt water systems. Is it true? I'll be darned if I know. What I do know, is that the alternative systems don't keep your pool clear and safe. The tab chlorinator you have been quoted will work for a season, maybe two. Then the stabilizer in the tabs will build up to such a high concentration in your water that no amount of chlorine will keep you pool clear. It's simple, Trichlor which is what the tabs are made of are almost 50% stabilizer.
So, what can you do. Salt really isn't the problem many pool builders are making it out to be. Any chlorine you use in your pool leaves salt behind. You will,have salt,water weather you want it or not. Will it harm your fence? If Matt says probably not, I believe him. Is there a guarantee on that? No, there never is in life.
The pool builder is looking out for his rear end and his checking account, not yours.
Read around our site a while and look for,the folks who show up,with green pools. How many of them are surprised that the tabs they are using have so much stabilizer and that it has made their pool unmanageable.
As others have said, do what you think is right.
I agree with Matt's comments and I'll tell you, he is our best "science guy" here at TFP.
You are one of tens (maybe hundreds) of Texas/Southwest US hopeful pool owners who show up each season who pool builders sway with salt water scare tactics. They try to push you to tab chlorinators (like the one you have been quoted) or alternative systems (UV or Ozone) for one main reason, the stone available in your area is soft. At times there can be issues with it degrading and folks blame salt water systems. Is it true? I'll be darned if I know. What I do know, is that the alternative systems don't keep your pool clear and safe. The tab chlorinator you have been quoted will work for a season, maybe two. Then the stabilizer in the tabs will build up to such a high concentration in your water that no amount of chlorine will keep you pool clear. It's simple, Trichlor which is what the tabs are made of are almost 50% stabilizer.
So, what can you do. Salt really isn't the problem many pool builders are making it out to be. Any chlorine you use in your pool leaves salt behind. You will,have salt,water weather you want it or not. Will it harm your fence? If Matt says probably not, I believe him. Is there a guarantee on that? No, there never is in life.
The pool builder is looking out for his rear end and his checking account, not yours.
Read around our site a while and look for,the folks who show up,with green pools. How many of them are surprised that the tabs they are using have so much stabilizer and that it has made their pool unmanageable.
As others have said, do what you think is right.
I am in the middle of season 5 with my current pool. Saltwater and OK flagstone. I have no regrets and no issues with my flagstone that is attributable to pool salt. There is more info in ppm build thread, link in sig.
I know folks in the FL with Wrought iron fences within feet of the ocean. Saltwater pools have about 3500 ppm of salt. The ocean has about 35,000 ppm of salt.
I know folks in the FL with Wrought iron fences within feet of the ocean. Saltwater pools have about 3500 ppm of salt. The ocean has about 35,000 ppm of salt.
- Jan 4, 2016
- 5,392
- Pool Size
- 44000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
Lots of information to absorb, Wylie, hope your head is spinning less 
DE filtration is a good decision, filters the finest of particles, and will work very well for you if you choose to use Trouble Free Pool Care (TFPC) and avoid ever letting your pool become a swamp. Even if you do, it's just slightly more effort to clean the filter. If you get a lot of dirt in the pool for some reason, such as being next to a big source of dust, people also have good success with other filter types.
One of the great things about this forum is that there's experts here who will correct advice if it's incorrect or misleading. TFPC is based on decades of real pool experience across 1,000s of pools. The history behind TFPC is a great story, and the passion of the people supporting TFPC revolves around keeping people safe, having beautiful pools, and never having their pool turn unexpectedly cloudy or green the day before a party!
In addition, the reasons why TFPC works reliably has been backed up with thorough explanations of the CYA/FC relationship and other water chemistry. The vast majority of the information is backed up by peer-reviewed sources. The "deep end" explanations usually highlight if something is believed to be correct from broad experience and/or has been backed up by peer-reviewed research.
The reason I mention this is that you won't hear much hogwash here like you do on other forums. "It works for me so it must be good" doesn't happen very often. People here are entirely free to share their experience and offer alternative perspectives. If such statements sound like advice, and there's good evidence to the contrary, or risks you need to be aware of, then those will get covered. TFP is not an exclusive club even though our passion might get strong at times.
I hope we can help get your pool as good as it can be
By the way, your layout back in post #14 looks like an inviting oasis to me! There's some great pool construction and landscape experts here too that might have some ideas for you.
DE filtration is a good decision, filters the finest of particles, and will work very well for you if you choose to use Trouble Free Pool Care (TFPC) and avoid ever letting your pool become a swamp. Even if you do, it's just slightly more effort to clean the filter. If you get a lot of dirt in the pool for some reason, such as being next to a big source of dust, people also have good success with other filter types.
One of the great things about this forum is that there's experts here who will correct advice if it's incorrect or misleading. TFPC is based on decades of real pool experience across 1,000s of pools. The history behind TFPC is a great story, and the passion of the people supporting TFPC revolves around keeping people safe, having beautiful pools, and never having their pool turn unexpectedly cloudy or green the day before a party!
In addition, the reasons why TFPC works reliably has been backed up with thorough explanations of the CYA/FC relationship and other water chemistry. The vast majority of the information is backed up by peer-reviewed sources. The "deep end" explanations usually highlight if something is believed to be correct from broad experience and/or has been backed up by peer-reviewed research.
The reason I mention this is that you won't hear much hogwash here like you do on other forums. "It works for me so it must be good" doesn't happen very often. People here are entirely free to share their experience and offer alternative perspectives. If such statements sound like advice, and there's good evidence to the contrary, or risks you need to be aware of, then those will get covered. TFP is not an exclusive club even though our passion might get strong at times
.I hope we can help get your pool as good as it can be
By the way, your layout back in post #14 looks like an inviting oasis to me! There's some great pool construction and landscape experts here too that might have some ideas for you.
Okay, okay, after many lectures, much studying and speaking to two brother in laws, one (HAPPY) with a SWG and the other(Not so happy) with CO3,UV puck system (I believe this is what you call it) I have changed my mind and going with a SWG.
Next question, we were looking at a flagstone coping and an washed aggregate deck. Is this a bad idea, is flagstone too soft, should it be sealed or is there another material that would cost about the same as flagstone? I have read there is no issues but there are some material talking about natural stone being to soft in Texas.
Also, I have been told that the fact the pool will be about 4' lower than my pool equipement there could be some issues down the road. Any truth to this?
Next question, we were looking at a flagstone coping and an washed aggregate deck. Is this a bad idea, is flagstone too soft, should it be sealed or is there another material that would cost about the same as flagstone? I have read there is no issues but there are some material talking about natural stone being to soft in Texas.
Also, I have been told that the fact the pool will be about 4' lower than my pool equipement there could be some issues down the road. Any truth to this?
The washed aggregate is quite a bit hotter than a brushed or rocksalt finished concrete deck. Those little rocks get HOT! Pics of my rock salt deck in my build thread, link in sig. Same for flagstone, also HOT! The flagstone coping is 20+ degrees hotter than the concrete deck. On days like today you can't stand on the flagstone but you can stand on the concrete. Not for too long though.
The key to flagstone coping is picking out stone that is not flaky. Flaky flagstone will flake with salt or not. I have some flaky flagstone away from the pool that is pretty messy. My flagstone coping is great. But, it's HOT!
Being 4' above the pool will be a little more difficult with priming the pump and holding prime but, no big deal really.
The key to flagstone coping is picking out stone that is not flaky. Flaky flagstone will flake with salt or not. I have some flaky flagstone away from the pool that is pretty messy. My flagstone coping is great. But, it's HOT!
Being 4' above the pool will be a little more difficult with priming the pump and holding prime but, no big deal really.
Placing your equipment 4' higher than the water level simply means you should a install a check valve to prevent losing prime. Make sure that it isn't under grade so it can be serviced/replaced if ever necessary. Make sure the PB primes the pump at startup. NBD.
- Jan 4, 2016
- 5,392
- Pool Size
- 44000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
and the pool is a circulation system, so there's no energy cost difference either. Some energy is needed to lift the water, but it's offset by energy gained as the water falls back down. Like anything, I suppose, there's plenty of "old pool's tales"
- May 22, 2013
- 2,796
- Pool Size
- 12000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Hayward Aqua Rite (T-15)
I don't think I can agree with that "no energy cost difference" and "energy gained as the water falls back down". You're pushing water through the filter and still pushing it all the way to the return jets. The longer the run horizontally or vertically the more resistance you have. Likely not very much but there is some.
If I were building from scratch I'd sure try to find a way to have the equipment pad down near water level. That's just my 2 cents.
I did go back and look at the layout, where is the equipment pad going to be ??
If I were building from scratch I'd sure try to find a way to have the equipment pad down near water level. That's just my 2 cents.
I did go back and look at the layout, where is the equipment pad going to be ??
- Jan 4, 2016
- 5,392
- Pool Size
- 44000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
OP's question was about the lift, not the distance, and I stand behind my comment regarding energy cost.
needsajet is correct, the cost of lifting the water 4' will be offset by the "free" fall of 4'. Clever right?
- May 23, 2015
- 25,794
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
needsajet is correct, the cost of lifting the water 4' will be offset by the "free" fall of 4'. Clever right?
But there is friction loss (head loss) for any length of piping. So, in a roof top solar system, the lifting of the water may be offset by the falling if the water but the frictional loss of all that extra pipe length still exists.
To the OP's original question - 4ft isn't a huge deal but, as others have said, add a check valve to make sure the pump doesn't drain back into pool. You don't want the pump having to prime itself every time it starts up.
The equipment is on the right side of the house. Not sure where to put it near the water. I will have to consider it. A check valve sounds like a good option.
So a PB came to the house today and stated they do shotcrete instead of gunite. Any words of wisdom as to if one is better than the other?
They also proposed using pavers instead of concrete. Any issues with settlement or weeds growing through them?
There is aso a life time warranty on inground plumbing and the shell (including settlement). They said they install an in-floor cleaning/circulation system that also has a lifetime warranty on the plumbing.
Any direction or knowledge from the TPF world would be appreciated.
They also proposed using pavers instead of concrete. Any issues with settlement or weeds growing through them?
There is aso a life time warranty on inground plumbing and the shell (including settlement). They said they install an in-floor cleaning/circulation system that also has a lifetime warranty on the plumbing.
Any direction or knowledge from the TPF world would be appreciated.
Pavers on what type of base? Crusher run? Sand fill? Grouted? LOTS of options there. If he is proposing a non solid substructure, then landscaping fabric and weed prep is a must.
- Jul 16, 2012
- 7,284
- Pool Size
- 27000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Hayward Aqua Rite (T-15)
Virtually identical for the end product. The difference should not be a decision point in your PB evaluation.
When properly installed pavers should have almost no settlement. Weeds however will grow eventually even with polymeric sand (which hardens but breaks down over time). Then you need to redo the sand which has some details to it but is straightforward. That would be after 5-8 years in my experience. Maybe a bit sooner around a pool as the repeated wetting of the sand causes it to lose its binding property.
In floor cleaners have come a long way but in most cases are not worth the money, except in areas with a lot of dust such as the dessert southwest. Otherwise a good robot is all you will ever need. A thousand dollars vs many thousands.
These are the general sentiments I've seen here over the last few years. There will be individuals who have other opinions on each one perhaps though.
When properly installed pavers should have almost no settlement. Weeds however will grow eventually even with polymeric sand (which hardens but breaks down over time). Then you need to redo the sand which has some details to it but is straightforward. That would be after 5-8 years in my experience. Maybe a bit sooner around a pool as the repeated wetting of the sand causes it to lose its binding property.
In floor cleaners have come a long way but in most cases are not worth the money, except in areas with a lot of dust such as the dessert southwest. Otherwise a good robot is all you will ever need. A thousand dollars vs many thousands.
These are the general sentiments I've seen here over the last few years. There will be individuals who have other opinions on each one perhaps though.
So for the North Texas TFP community we are thinking of signing with Gold Medal Pools. Has anyone had any experiences with them?
There is a recent post here that made me stay away from them. Also, my neighbor did not like them at all. Just FYI, you have to make your own choice, but go here and read.
New Pool Build Frisco, TX - Page 3
I saw this post and reached out to them. In the post they mentioned their neighbor had a great experience. Am I correct in assuming this was you? If so who did you use?