That is incorrect.The removal of this dissolved CO2 from the water will have a direct impact on the total alkalinity, and will cause its value to fall."
That is incorrect.The removal of this dissolved CO2 from the water will have a direct impact on the total alkalinity, and will cause its value to fall."
Not really relevant to this thread whether CO2 outgassing lowers TA but I have provided some sources that back up the claim. If we stick solely with the reasons you posted we can still agree that the TA is going to drop and I'm back to the original reason for my post, looking for a way to keep the TA in check on more of a schedule. I think the discussion was good for convincing me that its not going to happen in the same Stenner as the acid, though it would have been convenient. So I'm looking at trying to accommodate another Stenner or continue doing it manually. The thing I like about the Stenner is the PH holds pretty solid on a daily basis. Its not pour a quarter gallon of acid and drop it into range and then proceed to climb back up on a daily basis. I'd like to incorporate this type of daily control over the TA as well.If you are adding acid, the pH and the TA are being lowered.
Aeration raises the pH without affecting the TA.
So, you are raising and lowering the pH simultaneously, which results in a relatively stable pH but a dropping TA.
We can agree to disagree on that, its not really relevant to the thread.That is incorrect.
I think the point of the comments were that your TA should not be drifting down all that much if it’s in the right range to begin with. What value are you targeting? Your pH shouldn’t be drifting up if the TA is 50-60. Once the TA gets down to the 50 or 60 range you shouldn’t even need this stenner pump to dose the acid so much.We can agree to disagree on that, its not really relevant to the thread.
As the carbon dioxide outgases, the pH rises with no change in total alkalinity.
CO2(g) + H2O <=> H+ + HCO3-
Carbon dioxide added creates an H+ ion and an HCO3- ion.
The H+ ion reduces the TA by the same amount as the HCO3- ion increases the TA.
So, the net result is zero change in TA.
When carbon dioxide is removed through aeration, you lose an H+ ion and a HCO3-.
So, again, the result is zero change in TA.
H+ + HCO3- <=> CO2(g) + H2O
No particular objection, other than it sounds expensive, I thought it was used more commercially but I'm going to do some research on it. Anyone here using this type of system for residential pool ?Maybe if you get a container that has a mixer built in to keep the baking soda mixed in the water, you can use a Stenner type dosing system to inject the baking soda, but you don't want to have the acid and baking soda dosed at the same time.
Many people use carbon dioxide to manage pH; is there any reason you don't want to use carbon dioxide?
It is actually very relevant to the thread.We can agree to disagree on that, its not really relevant to the thread.
Yes, thank you for catching that typo, I want to increase TA not reduce. Not sure what you mean which TA ? I haven't figured out the 'schedule' of the TA drift as I have with the ph quite yet, It seems to be somewhere around 10-20ppm per week but that's just a guess at this point.
He meant what TA value are you regularly targeting?Not sure what you mean which TA ?
Not sure what you mean which TA ?
I'll start by saying I'm reconsidering everything at this point based on the feedback received above and the change in season.I wanted to ask which TA value are you aiming for? At which TA level do you add baking soda and to which level do you raise TA then?
James, I see PH meters range from under $100 to up close to $500. Obviously I'd prefer the lower end of the range but don't want junk thats going to cause me more problems. Do you have a recommendation ?As long as the CSI is in the -0.3 to 0.0 range, you can allow the pH to go up to about 8.0 and the TA to go down to about 50, which should stop most pH rise and it should eliminate the need to add acid.
Maintaining the pH at 7.9 or 8.0 will usually require a pH meter to get an accurate read on the pH as the reagent test can begin to get difficult to read.
The TA is the problem in that case. If you let your TA drift down to 60ppm your pH rise will significantly slow and drop. I’m not familiar with the differences between CSI and LSI so would need to let someone else deal with rhat. Assuming they are closely related I keep my CSI very close to zero while maintaining a TA of 60 and pH of 7.8.I'll start by saying I'm reconsidering everything at this point based on the feedback received above and the change in season.
During the 'swim' season, which for me ended this week since I don't have a heater, with water temps from 80-88 I like to keep the PH around 7.7/7.8, Stabilizer around 50, salt 3500-4000 and play everything else off that to keep LSI in range. I had been hesitant to bump the CH up over 400 because I'm not that experienced with pool chemistry and its a pain in the Rear to bring back down vs. other chems. I would prefer to keep my LSI on the plus side between 0-+30 because its where I feel comfortable against chemistry 'mistakes'. All that said, with CH under 400 I have needed need my TA around 100 or higher to keep that balance and that's what I've been aiming for., I try not to let it go below 80/90 before bringing it back up, which, with all the other variables being discussed has been close to weekly/semi-weekly.
If I bump my CH up closer to 500 then lower target TAs fit better. From everything I've read a PH of 8 or higher has the potential to cause skin problems in those who are sensitive so I'd prefer not to go above 7.8 in the swim season but... from now through April I can put the PH as high as I want to test out some of these theories and see if I can slow the acid consumption and the TA drift and maybe kill the need for any automation related to the TA.