White flakes

[Sn00py]

Me again
Didn’t want to hijack someones thread.. so I apologize for one more about white flakes.

2 days into SWG and today I’ve noticed white flakes. I’ve started using pool math few weeks ago and my CSI is always between -0.15 and -0.3
Currently -0.3
I was planning to bring CH to recommended 350 but not sure? Also wondering if these flakes are ‘leftovers’ hmmm

 

[drsipe]

It's hard to tell, but since you just switched to SWG. Could the flakes be pvc pipe from cutting and installing the SWG.

To test if the flakes are calcium scale, you can collect some and drop them into a small amount of muriatic acid,,,, if it bubbles, it calcium scale.

 

[Newdude]

Me again
Didn’t want to hijack someones thread.. so I apologize for one more about white flakes.

Please ask anytime. If you do something you're unsure of we could have multiple problems to fix. And rest assured we'll help with those too, but it's better for all parties to only have one rodeo at a time.

If it's remotely related, keep it in the same thread as it's something that may arise for others also when they're reading your previous thread and contemplating how their story might go.

If it's entirely unrelated, start a new thread.

TIA for not stealing anyone else's thunder with a hijack.

I believe the answer to your question is to lower the TA to stop the flakes, but I have low CH fill water and speak vinyl so let's ask @mknauss.

 

[mknauss]

Your water chemistry does not show the propensity to create scale in the SWCG. But the best way to eliminate it is to lower the TA as NewDude stated. The issue will be that will lower your CSI even more. You can try raising your CH along with lowering the TA. Just odd to have you creating scale flakes with your current chemistry.

 

[Sn00py]

Yes, it is odd. They are definitely flakes, did an acid test. I used to have TA around 60-70 but did bring it up to 80 a few days before I switched to SWG. Will monitor them today and tomorrow and if I will still see them, I'll start lowering TA first.
@Newdude my fill water is also CH low because I have a whole hose softener installed.

 

[Sn00py]

I lowered TA to 70 and still fighting white flakes. I've noticed that I'm not getting flakes when PH is around 7.4-7.6 but my CSI is then between -0.42 and -0.33
Also PH will go up in 2 days from 7.4-7.8. or maybe from 7.6 -8.0
I have a really hard time reading a PH difference between 7.8 and 8. If PH is 8 it will bring my CSI to 0 - 0.1, depending on the water temp.

Maybe I should lower TA back to 60?

TA 70
CH 325
CYA 70
SALT 3600
Temp 81 morning, 88 evening

 

[mknauss]

Maybe I should lower TA back to 60?

Try it. I suspect some test value is not as accurate as it could be.

 

[mgtfp]

Very odd, particularly for a new SWG (from your other thread, looks like you just installed it).Are you sure your're not getting any of the test volumes muddled up (like 25ml sample with 10ppm/drop and 10ml sample with 25ppm/drop for CH and TA test)?

Is the chlorine output matching the expectation?

If the problem doesn't go away you could try borates.

Unrelated with scaling: Looks like you are doing the FC test with a 25ml sample and 0.2ppm/drop. It's sufficient to use 10ml samples with 0.5ppm/drop. Will save you lots of reagents. The high resolution FC test is really only required when maintaining a pool with no CYA with very low FC targets, which is outside of TFP land.

 

[Sn00py]

The only thing that might be off is the PH. As I said...those color shades are difficult to read for me. So I might have higher PH than I reported here. Will have to ask a friend to double-check, my wife is color-blind too lol
I did only 25 ml samples because of a new SWG install and wanted to track values as precisely as possible. Chlorine output is matching the expectation, 1.5 ppm @40% in 6.5h. I'm slowly rising my min FC level. Now is at 5.0 ppm (6 am)

 

[Sn00py]

Ok just tested water with my friend (4.30PM) and
PH 8.0
TA 80 ( went up?? )
CH 300
CyA 60
Pool temp 87
CSI 0.18

Will bring PH down. SWG is showing water temp 94 which brings CSI to 0.24

 

[mknauss]

TA increase is due to fill water added. Monitor pH and lower it to 7.4 when it rises to 7.8.

 

[Sn00py]

If it will rise to quick should I try borates to ‘stabilize’ it or maybe run SWG on higher setting for less hours first (less bubbles)?

 

[mknauss]

It rises because of the TA. Changing the run time of the SWCG will not matter.
You can add borates if you wish. It will not change how much acid is used in the aggregrate. May change from having to add acid every few days to once a week.

 

[Sn00py]

PH 7.4
TA 70
Temp 87
CSI -0.44

Ok, will monitor for few days and then try with BOR if it will go up to quick.

Thanks again for all the help!

 

[mgtfp]

The main benefit of borates is that they buffer the localised pH rise close to the cathode within the cell. The overall pH-rise will slow down a bit, but TA has a much bigger influence there.

 

[Brian PacNW]

As I said...those color shades are difficult to read for me. So I might have higher PH than I reported here. Will have to ask a friend to double-check, my wife is color-blind too lol

I often ask my wife for pH values. Seems like she has a superpower. If she's not around, I have a color-meter app on my phone ("Color Assist" I believe). It names the color that I point the camera at. Works pretty well for matching the water's pH color to the printed colors on the vial.

 

[Sn00py]

PH went up to 7.7 from 7.4 in 24 h huh

 

[mknauss]

At your TA level that is unusual. Any water features?

 

[Sn00py]

At your TA level that is unusual. Any water features?

None:/ just a small overflow from spa (2 in high, and 10 in wide)

 

[Sn00py]

3 people tested PH with same results just in case