Swim University now says fc/cya 7.5%

gregsfc

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May 27, 2014
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Cookeville,TN
Swim University is probably the biggest Youtube channel teacher of the traditional method of pool care in video. They are also probably the best for thoroughly teaching the traditional method to the highest standards. I've been commenting on all their uploaded videos this year telling them where they are wrong and where TFPC is right whenever the methodologies conflict. Yesterday, from out of the blue, they released a video on cyanuric acid, and they recommend the exact same ranges as what is taught here. Not only that, but they recommemded the all-important ratio (7.5% fc/cya). They did not, however, address how to manage fc/cya at 7.5% usong trichlor or not using trichlor, so I don't know if they are also going to do a turnabout on the best chlorine forms to recommend to maintain these ratios or how and when to add or how to test or offer tfp's chart or their own chart or maybe no chart and just leave it to the pool owner to figure out.

I've got a feeling though that the fc 1-4 recommendation regardless of the cya level method of pool care is getting ready to crash like the former Soviet Union did starting in 1988. Firstly, we've got more and more pool owners discovering this site and the ratio is being talked up in other circles as well. It's started to be argued for everywhere I go to help argue for tfpc methodologies. There are others besides me doing this; most-especially those who were angered by a green pool incident who got caught with high cya via following pool store advice. There are folks out there with a mission to help right this ship. I'm not one of those. I was told by a pool store clerk to stop adding pucks because my cya was 68; switch to cal hypo pucks. I went home curious to try and figure out how my cya got to be 68 and found tfp. The rest was history.

Secondly, Robert Lowry llc is teaching a variation of this ratio in his books but with some weird add ons amd take aways from TFPC like a maximum 1,500 TDS and an allowance for a 5% ratio when borates are maintained in pools.

Thirdly, and most importantly, we've got Richard Falk out there getting ready to change public pool regulating to include a cya/fc ratio rule in the near future for states and municipalities; and lastly, more and more traditional information outlets, Orenda, SU, Swimming Pool Tips channel, and others are either endorsing BBB or TFP. as a good and proper method of pool care or are introducing the ratio and acting like it is their idea. That's what SU has done. I congratulated them in the comments for finally endorcing BBB that's been widely communicated and growing for almost thirty years. I wasn't the only TFP subscriber/member who did this. Anyway, TFP followers are becoming less weird suddenly. Within a few years, I'll predict they'll be far fewer green pools; but there is some up and coming, new, weird stuff out there like Orenda's lsi system of pool care that they say is endorsed by Richard Falk, and we've got Dr Lowry still talking up TDS as if it's ultra important; and we've still got that overplayed phosphate remover thing going on, so it will be interesting how fc/cya falls in with all of these marketing schemes if it gain traction like it seems to be doing; and also, will they try to suggest a way to manage these ratios and adequate and more precise chlorine levels with pucks, as liquid use is strongly resisted by some for whatever reason; or are the days for regular pucks use numbered?
 
Although I like being weird lol At least it’s some progress in the right direction.
I have a feeling before liquid chlorine becomes mainstream over calcified pools will take the place of over stabilzed ones as they push their cal- hypo. 😩 time will tell.
 
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I just went over Orenda’s LSI / Scientology site. What a bunch of horse hockey. I mean, calcium is real issue for some, and their science is deceivingly on-point, but to say low calcium will ruin your vinyl lining is just irresponsible.

And then I ran into their hundreds of snake-oil products available for the expected seriously-nauseating premium prices, and realized they’re just another fashionable online pool store.
 
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Yes; but Orenda champions 7.5% fc cya, and anyone who is doing that dispite their other flaws in lesser pool chemistry issues needs to be held up, because that should be our biggest fight. It's always been the biggest fight or should be. No one was agreeing with fc/cya just a few years ago. Now its popping up everywhere; and it doesn't even matter whether they give Ben or Richard credit; just that they change to teaching it for the sake of millions of pool owners.

Just think...if Ben Powell hadn't once suggested the chlorine/cya chart, this site probably would have never existed and become the comprehensive authority on all things pool related that it's become.

That's ironic what you said about Orenda. I've been joining swimming pool fb groups one at a time and catching folks with green pools; giving my BBB/TFPC spill and directing them over here. The one I'm on now is run by the guy who runs the YouTube based podcast channel Swimming Pool Tips. His name is David. He's got most things right, but just like Orenda and Robert Lowry, none of them is like TFP. They don't have everything right. Anyway, there are some members on there that, every time someone comes on there asking for help to fix a green or cloudy pool; they'll suggest LSI. I was taken aback. What does that even mean. I mean, I know what it stands for but what does it mean as a pool care method or for fixing pools with algae. Finally, someone from Orenda's management showed up on there; he and I went back and forth. I'm no chemist, so I can't really do anything except refer him to articles I've read on here, but I finally got to him a little when I suggested that his subscribers and their basis for existing are not helpful to the industry, because when people have green pools, which is 95% of the chemistry issues that occur, they need to focus on pH, CYA, and chlorine and that's it. They need to get the first two in range and SLAM. So if someone comes on to a forum wanting help; and someone comes back and suggests that they should fix his or her saturation index; that's not only not helpful, but it's confusing, and it causes frustration to go even higher. I told him that no pool owner ever comes to a forum or channel mad at the pool store because their liner lasted eight years instead of ten. No; it's always either about electric powered hardware or an algae infested pool, and so I could not understand how someone could know that, but decided to base a new pool care methodology on something so minor as a saturation index. He had already thrown Richards name out to me a time or two. That he reviews their articles and methods and agrees with them. I had said just because he thinks they are valid, that doesn't mean he thinks they are necessary or important. He also wrote about manufacturer warranties amd all of that. Anyway, after I ranted about the issues owners are having with algae and how lsi does nothing to reduce these issues, which is the oberwhelming issue by far, all he could say was that he agrees that the number one problem in pool care is the fc and cya vudu chemistry advice problem (that's a paraphase), and that they are champions of the 7.5% fc/cya. So I'm thinking but didn't reply; then why is your mantra lsi when it's alot to do about nothing?
 
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I agree on all points: Swimming Pool Tips is great. Orenda, I agree: Not so much.

Another YT channel that's possibly the awfulest: Pool School. They recommend a CYA level of 130; what the heck? The host is smarmy son-of-a-gun who really needs to be knocked down a peg or two.
 
There are some other interesting developments at "Swim University":



Looks like Swim University is definitely a lurker here, if not a hidden member ...
 
It should also be noted that Swim University is not some big company or some entity that is deeply entrenched in the "traditional pool industry". The guy who runs it is a serial website/youtube/podcast entrepreneur who has several of these small website businesses. He runs (or has run) tons of similar small online business on coffee, homebrewing, and various other topics I can't keep up with. He even runs a podcast all about running small businesses like that. I've been a listener of some of his podcasts for years. I really enjoy some of his other stuff.....but I come here for pool care.
All that is to say - Swim University making some videos about fc/cya relationships is unlikely to be a sign that the traditional industry is catching on. He has probably just found some new content that makes sense and he can make videos about and keep his cash cow business making more $$$.
 
Yeah but they're still recommending test strips, which is TFP heresy.

Yep. And they still stick to a max of 3ppm FC, which means that CYA is implicitly limited to 40ppm. And the 7.5% is actually our min. level (or the SWG target). But it's a start...
 
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