SWG switch failed (CLOSED) 2nd day of operation

[jonpcar]

I am in the process of bringing up my SWG and running some experiments. Yesterday, in the 2nd day of operation, my SWG flow switch locked ON (closed position).

What I found was a tiny 1/2" length of "like a pine needle" had wedged itself into the location shown by the red arrow in the picture below. This is NOT the exact same flow switch in use on my Circupool RJ60+ but it gives a pretty good idea of what happened. This tiny needle prevented the switch from opening up all the way when there is no flow. Because I am in the midst of doing some pump testing, the SWG continued to produce chlorine/hydrogen while there was no flow in the pipe. I wasn't actually testing for a flow switch failure (I didn't expect it) and was lucky to catch it when I saw the gas was collecting and bubbling inside the SWG cell even though the pump had stopped.



Anyway, just last week I cleaned my filter so that needle might have been slowly making its way through the filter. It's also possible that I finally have to replace my cartridges after 8 years because there might be some spots that have opened up between the input/output, in particular I am worried about the seam where the paper filters are wrapped around and then glued together? Don't know how I could check that. Any thoughts on that?

Needless to say, I am a bit nervous about relying on the flow switch as the only backup to indicate flow is occurring in the system...my ECOStar pump is a bit past its expected failure date, haha. Any other threads where this occurred? Thanks!

 

[ajw22]

In the future set your SWG to 0% output when you are doing pump testing or other equipment work that effects the water flow.

 

[proavia]

With 8 year old suspect cartridges, it may be time to just replace them.

Do you have a separate timer for the SWG?

Don't forget to update your signarure with your new SWG.

 

[Bperry]

I am in the process of bringing up my SWG and running some experiments. Yesterday, in the 2nd day of operation, my SWG flow switch locked ON (closed position).

What I found was a tiny 1/2" length of "like a pine needle" had wedged itself into the location shown by the red arrow in the picture below. This is NOT the exact same flow switch in use on my Circupool RJ60+ but it gives a pretty good idea of what happened. This tiny needle prevented the switch from opening up all the way when there is no flow. Because I am in the midst of doing some pump testing, the SWG continued to produce chlorine/hydrogen while there was no flow in the pipe. I wasn't actually testing for a flow switch failure (I didn't expect it) and was lucky to catch it when I saw the gas was collecting and bubbling inside the SWG cell even though the pump had stopped.

View attachment 561555

Anyway, just last week I cleaned my filter so that needle might have been slowly making its way through the filter. It's also possible that I finally have to replace my cartridges after 8 years because there might be some spots that have opened up between the input/output, in particular I am worried about the seam where the paper filters are wrapped around and then glued together? Don't know how I could check that. Any thoughts on that?

Needless to say, I am a bit nervous about relying on the flow switch as the only backup to indicate flow is occurring in the system...my ECOStar pump is a bit past its expected failure date, haha. Any other threads where this occurred? Thanks!

Ideally your SWG doesn’t have any power when the pump is not moving water. The reason for that is exactly as you’ve discovered. Can you rewire it or is that pump not supportive of secondary outputs?

 

[jonpcar]

In the future set your SWG to 0% output when you are doing pump testing or other equipment work that effects the water flow.

Allen, good idea...will do!

With 8 year old suspect cartridges, it may be time to just replace them.

Do you have a separate timer for the SWG?

Don't forget to update your signarure with your new SWG.

Gene, I don't have a separate timer but was effectively using the filter relay as a power enable for the SWG. Today, I have updated to make sure that if I am "asking the pump to run" that it is responding with "I'm running" before powering up the SWG. I doubt if most systems have that option though...asking the pump to run is not the same as it running. I suppose power glitches, dying pumps, pump "stalls" happen rarely enough that the secondary flow switch check is sufficient.

If my flow switch gets stuck again, I will definitely look into replacing my filter cartridges. They still look in pretty decent shape though, so I was very surprised that something made it through AND happened to impact that flow switch. The pool water still looks clear up to and including my latest cleaning of the filters, which I do once a year.

And yeah...I would have forgotten to update my signature, haha. Thanks.

Ideally your SWG doesn’t have any power when the pump is not moving water. The reason for that is exactly as you’ve discovered. Can you rewire it or is that pump not supportive of secondary outputs?

@Bperry, I have now included a change that effectively does that, see my answer to Gene above. My pump doesn't support this option but I would definitely look into including that feature if it did. Is that a widely available option on pumps? Because if it is, that is definitely the way to go rather than relying on the filter pump relay to power up the SWG.

Thanks all for the comments!

 

[Bperry]

Allen, good idea...will do!

Gene, I don't have a separate timer but was effectively using the filter relay as a power enable for the SWG. Today, I have updated to make sure that if I am "asking the pump to run" that it is responding with "I'm running" before powering up the SWG. I doubt if most systems have that option though...asking the pump to run is not the same as it running. I suppose power glitches, dying pumps, pump "stalls" happen rarely enough that the secondary flow switch check is sufficient.

If my flow switch gets stuck again, I will definitely look into replacing my filter cartridges. They still look in pretty decent shape though, so I was very surprised that something made it through AND happened to impact that flow switch. The pool water still looks clear up to and including my latest cleaning of the filters, which I do once a year.

And yeah...I would have forgotten to update my signature, haha. Thanks.



@Bperry, I have now included a change that effectively does that, see my answer to Gene above. My pump doesn't support this option but I would definitely look into including that feature if it did. Is that a widely available option on pumps? Because if it is, that is definitely the way to go rather than relying on the filter pump relay to power up the SWG.

Thanks all for the comments!

Seems the newer variable speed pumps have options like that. Mine does, but I run the pump 24x7 so technically not using it at the moment.

 

[proavia]

Gene, I don't have a separate timer but was effectively using the filter relay as a power enable for the SWG. Today, I have updated to make sure that if I am "asking the pump to run" that it is responding with "I'm running" before powering up the SWG. I doubt if most systems have that option though...asking the pump to run is not the same as it running. I suppose power glitches, dying pumps, pump "stalls" happen rarely enough that the secondary flow switch check is sufficient.

If my flow switch gets stuck again, I will definitely look into replacing my filter cartridges. They still look in pretty decent shape though, so I was very surprised that something made it through AND happened to impact that flow switch. The pool water still looks clear up to and including my latest cleaning of the filters, which I do once a year.

And yeah...I would have forgotten to update my signature, haha. Thanks.

In the mainstream pool automation systems you use the pump relay to power the SWG. When the automation calls for the pump to run, the SWG will also be powered at that point. I wasn't sure how your DIY system works.

Stuff happens - hence the need for a primary and secondary (flow switch) to control the SWG getting power or not. Hopefully your experience was a one off and you won't have any further issues with the float switch getting jammed in the ON position.

I clean my filter yearly aswell. Hoping to get to that this coming week.

My Ecostar lasted over 9 years - with running it 24/7 the entire time. Don't talk about yours being past its prime, you will only hex yourself.

 

[jonpcar]

In the mainstream pool automation systems you use the pump relay to power the SWG. When the automation calls for the pump to run, the SWG will also be powered at that point. I wasn't sure how your DIY system works.

I have been rushing a bit to get my SWG up and running because we are heading out tomorrow for a couple 2-week trips over the next month and an half. Eventually the automation will have some more safeguards built in, including a check that the flow switch is not stuck and is operating as expected.

But, I still was really surprised at this “2nd working day” flow switch failure. The automation had been monitoring that switch for the previous couple weeks as it has been running in the system with the “blank SWG cell.” The flow switch worked flawlessly over all RPMs from 600 to 3000+, closing and opening appropriately…until, as you said, STUFF happened.

And I hope the “unnamed” pump in my system lasts as long as yours did…haha.

 

[Newdude]

Rare as the failures are, and usually much further down the road, it's a 19 cent moving part. We should all trust it as such and be pleasantly surprised when it continues working IMO.

Glad you caught it.

As to how it happened with no visible damage to the carts, do you drain the filter before pulling them ? Or do you pull them with the bottom full of yuck water still ?

Or maybe a couple pine needles blew in the empty vessel while you were cleaning the carts last with a perfect shot worthy of blowing up the Death Star.

 

[Newdude]

Ooooooooo. You drained the filter before pulling the carts but there's always 3/4 of a gallon left in there and either some pine needles fell off the carts or were floating in the sludge and went right down the exhaust pipe.

 

[jonpcar]

As to how it happened with no visible damage to the carts, do you drain the filter before pulling them ? Or do you pull them with the bottom full of yuck water still ?

I actually haven’t paid attention to whether a bit of that gunk gets to the exit…in the past I guess I haven’t really had to worry about it…so possible. But I was checking the operation of that switch (not as part of the SWG but just reading open/closed with the automation) for a week AFTER the filter cleaning (and before the SWG cell insertion) and it was working fine. So not sure of how that “delayed” effect might occur. I’m thinking the needle was slowly penetrating its way through the filter like a sewing needle might.

Or maybe a couple pine needles blew in the empty vessel while you were cleaning the carts last with a perfect shot worthy of blowing up the Death Star.

That’s what I was amazed at…when the needle did get through, it WAS perfect.