Strange Sound Coming from "deck"

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GreatCanadian said:
Yeah it would bother me too. If he turned off the power and could hear it AT THE SAME level as before, it would bother me less. But if it's quiter with the power off, i would be weary.
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So to clarify, with the power on or off, the noise did not change. When I went out to turn off the power, it was a bit quieter from the video. When I turned the power off, no change.

When I turned the power back on (5 min) no change.

I am still leaning toward lighting discharge excess energy somehow or other....

OK, I guess I am also not sure exactly where the transformer is...guess it could be somewhere that I am not sure about...
 
I'm gonna guess that the rain is causing air to be forced through a little hole in the vapor barrier under the rocks. Here's a simple test, take a wooden dowel or something similar and drive it through the gravel and puncture the vapor barrier and see if it stops.
 
toofast said:
Power transformer is "miles" away, all the power lines are underground (mmm, perhaps this is a clue), but the transformer is say 5 miles away.
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You have a transformer close enough to see from your house. There is one for every other house most likely. Either gray can on a pole or a green box on the ground between houses.
 
toofast said:
Well - guess what, no more noise. Yep, nothing changed other than it is the next day and dead silence.
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and a day dryer.

toofast said:
I talked to the PB and they did a pre-dig electrical check, and nothing runs behind the house, it all terminates on the side. I agree.

He though electrical, but since having the breakers off to the house did not change it he was stumped.
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did he do the check or did he have "digsafe", "underground" or whatever utility locate service in your area handle this. I would suspect he had a service do this.

toofast said:
If it is a massive underground water way, well we've never heard it before.

I have a new theory....have not checked the science yet to see if feasible.
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Don't know too much about this but from what I have heard from well drillers, water does not "flow" in rivers under ground like it does on the surface but more a slow migration thru the layer of rock that it is in.

toofast said:
Remember, we had a MASSIVE storm yesterday, with lightening strikes everywhere and close. Could all that "juice" going into the ground, somehow be "discharging" into this grid. Remember this is totally bonded, with a 10 ft or whatever copper rod going in to the ground. And it was slowly getting softer due to the energy dissipating ?
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The massive storm was what discharged all this "juice" that was built up. The lightning strike is what put both the clouds and the ground into the same potential. The bonding grid you have does not have enough capacitance to continualy accept or discharge enough current to cause a constant buzzing sound. The fact that your grid (rebar) is tied to the ground rod puts both in the same potential anyway so there should be no current flow between them. This is why the grid exists in the first place

toofast said:
It did not show any power on the meter or touch because it was grounding to the earth, so it was harmless. Think of it like big static electricity finding its way back home ?

Is there any way this explains it ?
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There is no way to use a meter to check this as everything is in the same potential. Think of trying to see how much power is in a battery by touching both probes to the same terminal. If it was a slow discharge from the bonding grid to the ground you should be able measure a voltage by probing the ground and the grid. This would also only be posible if the grid was isolated from the ground.


I was just looking at Google maps of the Butler PA area. I see a couple of pretty big power lines running south of the city. Are you anywhere near those?
 
Good evening....

Well day 2 and no more noise...still silent.

I am baffled...to say the least

I actually do not live in PA, but NE Ohio, no power lines anywhere near. danpik - thanks for all the details, glad my grid is protecting me like it should.

Not in earthquake territory and if it is a sinkhole, my house and pool are doomed.

I now have no idea....and the concrete is being poured tomorrow...PB said it must have been a bug...oh well, hope it was.
 

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toofast said:
Good evening....

Well day 2 and no more noise...still silent.

I am baffled...to say the least

I actually do not live in PA, but NE Ohio, no power lines anywhere near. danpik - thanks for all the details, glad my grid is protecting me like it should.

Not in earthquake territory and if it is a sinkhole, my house and pool are doomed.

I now have no idea....and the concrete is being poured tomorrow...PB said it must have been a bug...oh well, hope it was.
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Not sure where in NEOH you are, but I used to live in Youngstown OH & was in the insurance industry for a number of years in that area. There is a definite issue in that area with mine subsidence. I have no idea what kind of noise might be noticed from a situation like that, but with you mentioning what part of the country you are in, I felt I had to say something. If I were you, I might take a quick peak at my homeowners insurance to see if you have mine subsidence coverage. It is mandatory in a few counties in Ohio, and is optional in a number of others (at least that is how it was a few years ago). Hopefully it is just something odd in the layout of the deck, but just in case, it would stink to find out that for $5 you could have had coverage for it.

And, just out of curiosity... any chance they are fracking near you? Perhaps it is nothing more than frack vibration? That is my very uneducated vote on it.
 
Does not sound like any type of water to me. Possibly could have been electrical. Before anything is poured, I would have a utilities locator service like dig rite check it out first. I know you said your PB did this but I would go ahead and have it done myself anyways. Personally, to me it sounds as if someone dropped something that vibrates while laying the gravel and the battery ran dead. Especially if the noise became softer then went dead. I would dig around and find it or it would drive me nuts!!! Its better to have a piece of mind than to always wonder or, possibly have to break up the concrete to fix something.
 
I did not know where you lived, one of the people who replied must have seen Butler in my information and got us confused.

Ohio, as glitter&guns mentioned, is mining country. I am linking ODNR just for you take a look at: http://www.ohiodnr.com/mineral/subsidence/tabid/10427/Default.aspx.
This specific part of the ODNR site will show you Abandoned Mine Information that could be very informative as it relates to what is going on on the land you own: http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/tabid/8101/Default.aspx
This is a map on Karstic Areas (it's older and I am sure there are possible changes, but it gives you some information): http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/geosurvey/tabid/19292/Default.aspx

It wasn't a "bug" and I am not an alarmist ~ I have worked in the industry now for 14 years and have seen some unbelievable occurrences as it relates to ground control. With that being said, had you been away from the home after this storm & not putting this pool in, getting ready for the pour you might not have even detected the noise. It didn't work out like that and you are aware of it so I am directing you to the information the State of Ohio puts out there so landowners can begin to collect information if they feel so inclined to do so.

I realize you are going on with the pour and your PB has somewhat dismissed the issue. I am sure many other people excited about getting their pool area finished would do the same. Had I not been in the line of work I am in, I might also fall into that group "It was a noise, it's gone ~ pour the cement ~ we're ready to swim!" If it were me, I would seriously consider getting to the root of that noise before continuing. At this point you are feeling like there could be a possible risk with your pool deck, but what you heard could be an indication there are problems and should that be the case the deck really is going to be the least of your worries. It might not be a problem this weekend, next week, next month or next season for that fact, but if there would be an AML issue the problems will involve much more than your pool and deck area. If you go through with the pour today and down the road notice any changes please don't ignore them. Please check all of your structures (home & outbuildings) for any changes, small cracks, fractures, etc. Be very vigilant. If you notice anything act upon it immediately.

Best of Luck and please keep us posted ~ I'll be anxious to see what everything looks like when finished.
 
DKT113 said:
I did not know where you lived, one of the people who replied must have seen Butler in my information and got us confused.

Ohio, as glitter&guns mentioned, is mining country. I am linking ODNR just for you take a look at: http://www.ohiodnr.com/mineral/subsidence/tabid/10427/Default.aspx.
This specific part of the ODNR site will show you Abandoned Mine Information that could be very informative as it relates to what is going on on the land you own: http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/tabid/8101/Default.aspx
This is a map on Karstic Areas (it's older and I am sure there are possible changes, but it gives you some information): http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/geosurvey/tabid/19292/Default.aspx

It wasn't a "bug" and I am not an alarmist ~ I have worked in the industry now for 14 years and have seen some unbelievable occurrences as it relates to ground control. With that being said, had you been away from the home after this storm & not putting this pool in, getting ready for the pour you might not have even detected the noise. It didn't work out like that and you are aware of it so I am directing you to the information the State of Ohio puts out there so landowners can begin to collect information if they feel so inclined to do so.

I realize you are going on with the pour and your PB has somewhat dismissed the issue. I am sure many other people excited about getting their pool area finished would do the same. Had I not been in the line of work I am in, I might also fall into that group "It was a noise, it's gone ~ pour the cement ~ we're ready to swim!" If it were me, I would seriously consider getting to the root of that noise before continuing. At this point you are feeling like there could be a possible risk with your pool deck, but what you heard could be an indication there are problems and should that be the case the deck really is going to be the least of your worries. It might not be a problem this weekend, next week, next month or next season for that fact, but if there would be an AML issue the problems will involve much more than your pool and deck area. If you go through with the pour today and down the road notice any changes please don't ignore them. Please check all of your structures (home & outbuildings) for any changes, small cracks, fractures, etc. Be very vigilant. If you notice anything act upon it immediately.

Best of Luck and please keep us posted ~ I'll be anxious to see what everything looks like when finished.
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I tend towards "life will work out", but I agree with you on this one. Laying out a giant grid that is now getting enough vibration to hum would make me nervous. Also, I wanted to correct one thing that the OP said - you stated that you are not in earthquake territory, but that isn't true. NEOH has fault lines fairly close together. If I remember correctly (and again, it has been years since I was up there) the one that is named for Akron (Akron Fault Line maybe?) has been responsible for earthquakes over 5.0 in recent history (like since the 1980s). Ohio tends to have very small earthquakes, but they are on the rise. In fact, it looks like there was one in your general area on July 1 of this year. Here is a link for you: http://www.wcpo.com/dpp/news/state/32-m ... n-lake-cou Putting together fairly regular low level earthquakes, injection wells, heavy rains/snow melts and a lot of long abandoned and lost mines would make me nervous enough to look into it.
 
Hmmm... a few years ago I dropped my cell phone in a rocks for a french drain I was preparing and did not know until next day when I called it to ring it and find it. Possibly lost cell phone stuck on vibrate and battery ran out or rain killed it? Although, the video sound was a bit louder than i would expect from a cell phone, but may be vibrating against rocks amplified the sound a bit? Crew have any unaccounted for tools?
 
My final thought:
Remember the scientist-inventor Tesla? He invented microwave technology, sonar, radio, and radio controlled devices including remote controls, all in the early-to-mid 1900's.

He also posited that a power company could send electrical power deep into the ground, and everyone with a copper grounding rod could get the electricity out and use it for free. A reverse lightning rod, as it were.
Of course, electric companies realized they wouldn't make any money, so they all went with wire delivery systems and meters.

Your comment about your grounding rod, the significant lightning, and that "possibly electrical" hum made me think of Tesla's proposed discharge system. Not that it necessarily applies to your situation.

As your deck will be grounded, and your rebar/grid encased in concrete, I see no cause for concern. We all live with wires that can come loose, and grounding rods, and very few of us have lightning rods on our homes anymore, yet we all pretty much survive just fine.

Good luck, and enjoy your new deck! :party:
 
Finally an update...

I delayed the concrete pour a day to try and find a plausible solution.

1) Contacted the utility company, they verified there is nothing buried anywhere close to the deck.
2) The stone/grid was in place for 2 weeks and dead silent...the big storm came and the noise came...so can't be phone or any device buried, unless controlled by an alien.
3) Can't be water, because now I remember the PB dug trenches for wiring on OPPOSITE ends of the deck, 4 ft deep...and came across no water.
4) Could no find any faults/mines/etc. close enough to matter....at least according to what I know about these things....
5) I could list nearly every option, but we checked everything.

So after a day of trying to confirm many of the thoughts...and after 4 days of no more sound (it just was there that one day and then slowly went away)....we poured concrete on Saturday.

NOW - the interesting twist, is that in talking with the power company - they indicated IT IS POSSIBLE that I was hearing back feed from discharged lighting coming back up through the grounding rod into the grid. They said it is harmless and just "electrical noise" and not to worry about it.

So - it appears the only two theories that still hold weight are:

1) BIG BUG of some sort that hatched and could not dig out of the rocks (cicada, etc.)
2) Electrical back feed noise from the storm.

Anyways...there is the story.

I will still listen every once in a while to see if I hear it again, it was so loud, I don't think 4" of concrete could stop it.

I agree - while still strange - I feel I am safe.
 

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