New to Pool Ownership and Decided We Are Our Own Pool Boys

[KayyLo]

Hello from Southern CA,

We just finished our 18x23 11,500 gallon pool and spa build with plenty of ups and downs and lots more landscaping and decorating to go. Biggest down is probably the discoloration, mass splotch, scale, or whatever it may be in the Stonescapes Mini Black Pebble w/abalone shell finish in the hot tub. PB stated it happens with dark pebble which I’m fine with the natural color variance but this seems overboard and possibly due to lack of balancing regularly. The pics are from day 10 after fill. We brushed the pool as directed and when we mentioned the issue, PB said either an acid bath or drain and acid wash but nothing was set in stone and it was again mentioned that this happens with dark pebble. PB handled chemistry once a week for the first 3 weeks and we were told to check it weekly from there but I have since learned that may not exactly be correct. Aside from the huge discoloration issue in the hot tub, we are loving our pool. I’m trying not to freak out about it and have pretty much accepted the issue but would like to work to prevent further issues.

I checked chemistry levels myself for the first time today and woah, I had no idea I needed to be a chemist. I actually found it a little fun once I got the hang of things. I used the Taylor K-2006 and input the results into Pool Math and I now know that once a week is NOT going to cut it thanks to reading Pool School and various posts as well as learning that even though the PB balanced the pool on Thursday, we jumped in with friends Sunday and found that we have no chlorine today. I’ll be working on balancing tomorrow and am grateful for the app and it’s ease of use after initial hiccups on my end with not knowing what anything meant and what types of chemicals we would be using. Once I figured that out it was an Easy process and so grateful the app gave me the info I need to help balance my pool. I also appreciate the wealth of knowledge this website, including the forums, provides.

My results:
Temp: 75*
FC: 0.0
PH: 8.0
TA: 125
CH: 350
CYA: 25
CSI: 0.59 (potential for scaling) <—— *cries*

 

[PoolGate]

Hello from Southern CA,

We just finished our 18x23 11,500 gallon pool and spa build with plenty of ups and downs and lots more landscaping and decorating to go. Biggest down is probably the discoloration, mass splotch, scale, or whatever it may be in the Stonescapes Mini Black Pebble w/abalone shell finish in the hot tub. PB stated it happens with dark pebble which I’m fine with the natural color variance but this seems overboard and possibly due to lack of balancing regularly. The pics are from day 10 after fill. We brushed the pool as directed and when we mentioned the issue, PB said either an acid bath or drain and acid wash but nothing was set in stone and it was again mentioned that this happens with dark pebble. PB handled chemistry once a week for the first 3 weeks and we were told to check it weekly from there but I have since learned that may not exactly be correct. Aside from the huge discoloration issue in the hot tub, we are loving our pool. I’m trying not to freak out about it and have pretty much accepted the issue but would like to work to prevent further issues.

I checked chemistry levels myself for the first time today and woah, I had no idea I needed to be a chemist. I actually found it a little fun once I got the hang of things. I used the Taylor K-2006 and input the results into Pool Math and I now know that once a week is NOT going to cut it thanks to reading Pool School and various posts as well as learning that even though the PB balanced the pool on Thursday, we jumped in with friends Sunday and found that we have no chlorine today. I’ll be working on balancing tomorrow and am grateful for the app and it’s ease of use after initial hiccups on my end with not knowing what anything meant and what types of chemicals we would be using. Once I figured that out it was an Easy process and so grateful the app gave me the info I need to help balance my pool. I also appreciate the wealth of knowledge this website, including the forums, provides.

My results:
Temp: 75*
FC: 0.0
PH: 8.0
TA: 125
CH: 350
CYA: 25
CSI: 0.59 (potential for scaling) <—— *cries*

Lowering your pH with acid will reduce your CSI. Which is not bad anyway you are fine. I would also work on lowering your TA. Increase CYA too. Also FYI: CYA is not linear so a reading of 25 just count as 30.

You got a new pool too bad you didn't go with a SWG. Would have made your life a lot easier.

Plaster surfaces are rarely evenly colored. Your pic looks like one side might be in the shade. If not and that is actually the difference in color, that is worse than usual. And interesting that the mottling is on that side.

 

[Sunny Blues]

“…even though the PB balanced the pool on Thursday…”

Yeah well see anyone using a different method than TFP is never really balancing your pool. They will always be using too little chlorine for the amount of present cya and you will always be out of it, constantly testing at 0. And if they are using any other products other than straight, unadulterated liquid bleach, muriatic acid, borax,and cyanuric acid, like products and mixes and concoctions from the pool industry, then they are introducing things into your water that will eventually cause chaos. Your perfectly balanced water lasts only for a single day,but that’s because it never was perfectly balanced - it only appeared to be. I’ve learned that truly balanced water is stable for far longer needing only an occasional addition of liquid bleach.

Sure after a heavy swim it’s good to check your levels, but FC shouldn’t be 0 that fast unless the PB is trapped in the industry philosophy that for safety of swimmers chlorine should always stay between 1-3ppm no matter what the levels of anything else is. That philosophy is what keeps people a slave to chlorine and having to always stay on top of their pool not just daily but hourly.

 

[KayyLo]

L

Lowering your pH with acid will reduce your CSI. Which is not bad anyway you are fine. I would also work on lowering your TA. Increase CYA too. Also FYI: CYA is not linear so a reading of 25 just count as 30.

You got a new pool too bad you didn't go with a SWG. Would have made your life a lot easier.

Plaster surfaces are rarely evenly colored. Your pic looks like one side might be in the shade. If not and that is actually the difference in color, that is worse than usual. And interesting that the mottling is on that side.

Thank you for the info on the chemicals. It’ll help me navigate this new world.

The lighter white side is the side where the sun hits first. My mind is reeling with the reasoning it’s so bad there. Plaster dust settled? After day 7 we were gone for a few days so possibly dust settled.

I had no idea what SWG was until the other day. I didn’t do my homework before signing the contract last year and after combing the website last night found out SWG would have been a better choice.

 

[KayyLo]

“…even though the PB balanced the pool on Thursday…”

Yeah well see anyone using a different method than TFP is never really balancing your pool. They will always be using too little chlorine for the amount of present cya and you will always be out of it, constantly testing at 0. And if they are using any other products other than straight, unadulterated liquid bleach, muriatic acid, borax,and cyanuric acid, like products and mixes and concoctions from the pool industry, then they are introducing things into your water that will eventually cause chaos. Your perfectly balanced water lasts only for a single day,but that’s because it never was perfectly balanced - it only appeared to be. I’ve learned that truly balanced water is stable for far longer needing only an occasional addition of liquid bleach.

Sure after a heavy swim it’s good to check your levels, but FC shouldn’t be 0 that fast unless the PB is trapped in the industry philosophy that for safety of swimmers chlorine should always stay between 1-3ppm no matter what the levels of anything else is. That philosophy is what keeps people a slave to chlorine and having to always stay on top of their pool not just daily but hourly.

Thank you for your insight. was set to use tabs since that’s what we were shown but after my freak out last night about 0 chlorine I jumped on here and now know better. I’ll be heading to the store this morning and grabbing some. On a side note, I had no clue you could use regular ol’ chlorine. I did see there were limitations on which percentage to use and such.

 

[Sunny Blues]

Thank you for your insight. was set to use tabs since that’s what we were shown but after my freak out last night about 0 chlorine I jumped on here and now know better. I’ll be heading to the store this morning and grabbing some. On a side note, I had no clue you could use regular ol’ chlorine. I did see there were limitations on which percentage to use and such.

Yeah “tabs” “pucks” “kits” - all bad. Tabs will introduce so much CYA into your water that over time you’ll have well over 100-150 CYA, which requires you keep chlorine levels at 12-18 ppm daily and more if CYA is higher. Just unnecessary. But you don’t want to swing too low on CYA either because then you’re always chasing chlorine levels.

Don’t get any liquid chlorine unless the only active ingredient is Sodium Hypochlorite 12.5% Chlorine. Noting else. The word “shock” is only trustworthy 50% of the time. Check ingredients first. Oh! And check expiration dates too. We used 3x as much chlorine last year as we usually do and found out it had expired and was no longer 12.5%, but probably closer to 4-5%. Cost money for us to have to use more.

Grab some muriatic acid while out (31%) to bring your pH and alkalinity down.

Also grab some granular CYA (unless you want to pay double then there are instant liquid versions.) Again make sure the only ingredient is cyanuric acid and nothing else. Then you can increase CYA to 50 and stabilize your chlorine levels. There is a CYA chart on here I remember from years ago that I printed off for quick reference of what FC I should be at and should never drop below, where the ideal range is, and what the shock level should be based on each 10 level increments of CYA. I think PoolMath calculates it all but I still feel better being able to quick reference that chart.

Don’t get roped into buying anything else from any sales associate or pool expert while out. We asked where we could find what we wanted after learning what we need here, and they all tried to get us to buy all-in-one magic beans or quick fixits. They didn’t understand the pool chemistry, only what the manufacturers wanted them to know about their products. Stick to your guns and trust TFP

 

[PoolGate]

If you have a Home Depot near you, buy this. I got 4 cases at the beginning of the season to get me going. You'll need it the entire season, however.

You can use pucks just be mindful of the CYA that is added with each one. With a new pool and low CYA you are ok to use them sparingly. I believe each puck adds 2-3 parts CYA to your water.

Perhaps ask your builder how much he would charge to add the Jandy PLC1400 SWG. I will guess around $3000. Maybe less. Always get the larger SWG if you are considering this DON'T go with the PLC700 even though your builder will tell you that is enough.

HDX Chlorinating Liquid for Swimming Pool Shock, 1-Gallon (3-Pack) 30128HDX - The Home Depot

Keep your pool clean and sparkling with 3 Gallons of Chlorinating Liquid. It quickly dissolves so your water isn't cloudy and it can be used as a super-chlorinator, shock or sanitizer. This liquid can

www.homedepot.com

 

[Sunny Blues]

I just realized I’m now in a minority on here not having a SWG. 13 years ago only half the members had them if that but now it seems like that’s all anyone has. We are nearing retirement and unsure how many more years we will live here. We could move within 6-8 years. The cost of yearly chlorine in the Chicago area over the next 6 years still might be less than the cost of installing a new SWG system at this time, so for us we probably are stuck with the traditional ways. The savings in chlorine each year with a SWG would require at least 6 years minimum to just break even on the expense.

But, our setup has served us well and was not more difficult imho. I’ll always need advice on here from the perspective of a non-SWG system. So, you’re not alone!

However your pool is new. Possibly you have at least 10-20+ years to live there? It might be worth your money in the next couple years to convert to a SWG? Do a cost benefit analysis about it. Just something to think about.

 

[Sunny Blues]

Perhaps ask your builder how much he would charge to add the Jandy PLC1400 SWG. I will guess around $3000.

Help me understand the benefit of the expense. We spend about $200-$250/year on chlorine. That means it would take at minimum 10-12 years just to break even.

 

[PoolGate]

Help me understand the benefit of the expense. We spend about $200-$250/year on chlorine. That means it would take at minimum 10-12 years just to break even.

Savings over chlorine is not the main reason to get a SWG. The main reason is ease of maintenance. Once a SWG is dialed in, it is set and forget. I don't think anyone that has one would trade it for manually chlorinating.

 

[duraleigh]

The benefit is convenience......plain and simple.

Manually added pool chlorine is the very best solution for any pool.........you only need to accept the inconvenience manually dosing presents.

If you are OK with that, then use it as long as you like. You can always switch to SWG if you change your mind later

 

[KayyLo]

Yeah “tabs” “pucks” “kits” - all bad. Tabs will introduce so much CYA into your water that over time you’ll have well over 100-150 CYA, which requires you keep chlorine levels at 12-18 ppm daily and more if CYA is higher. Just unnecessary. But you don’t want to swing too low on CYA either because then you’re always chasing chlorine levels.

Don’t get any liquid chlorine unless the only active ingredient is Sodium Hypochlorite 12.5% Chlorine. Noting else. The word “shock” is only trustworthy 50% of the time. Check ingredients first. Oh! And check expiration dates too. We used 3x as much chlorine last year as we usually do and found out it had expired and was no longer 12.5%, but probably closer to 4-5%. Cost money for us to have to use more.

Grab some muriatic acid while out (31%) to bring your pH and alkalinity down.

Also grab some granular CYA (unless you want to pay double then there are instant liquid versions.) Again make sure the only ingredient is cyanuric acid and nothing else. Then you can increase CYA to 50 and stabilize your chlorine levels. There is a CYA chart on here I remember from years ago that I printed off for quick reference of what FC I should be at and should never drop below, where the ideal range is, and what the shock level should be based on each 10 level increments of CYA. I think PoolMath calculates it all but I still feel better being able to quick reference that chart.

Don’t get roped into buying anything else from any sales associate or pool expert while out. We asked where we could find what we wanted after learning what we need here, and they all tried to get us to buy all-in-one magic beans or quick fixits. They didn’t understand the pool chemistry, only what the manufacturers wanted them to know about their products. Stick to your guns and trust TFP

I read your post too late and had already grabbed the chlorine. I initially had regular bleach then saw this which is 10% sodium hypo. Should the other ingredients be a concern? I have to go out and get the rest of the items later so I can return easily.
I’ll make sure not to get duped.

 

[proavia]

If that's the Pool Essentials chlorine from Walmart, it's fine.
If not, show the whole bottle.

Pool chlorine usually comes in 10% or 12.5%.

 

[KayyLo]

Savings over chlorine is not the main reason to get a SWG. The main reason is ease of maintenance. Once a SWG is dialed in, it is set and forget. I don't think anyone that has one would trade it for manually chlorinating.

Whew! It is Pool Essentials from Walmart and was about $1 less than regular chlorine which had fewer ounces. That was a surprise to me.

 

[Sunny Blues]

Whew! It is Pool Essentials from Walmart and was about $1 less than regular chlorine which had fewer ounces. That was a surprise to me.

Yeah that’s it, just lower strength. Just know you need more of the 10% than you would need of the 12.5% so there really is no savings. It’s about equal. We would only buy the 10% in an emergency if we couldn’t find the 12.5% anywhere

And never get just regular bleach from the laundry aisles. Most have other chemicals in them these days. You want “pool” bleach.

We have a grocery store near us named Woodmans that carries 12.5% liquid chlorine. They call it shock but it’s just the chlorine. Look at the price!!! That’s so unusual. My husband paid $24 a case last week at American Sale. That comes out to $6 a gallon! We used to pay $2.79 a gal just five years ago.

I was giddy to find this deal. Sending the hubs back to stock up. Expiration dates were spring 2025 so only good for this season as always with any of these.

 

[KayyLo]

Yeah that’s it, just lower strength. Just know you need more of the 10% than you would need of the 12.5% so there really is no savings. It’s about equal. We would only buy the 10% in an emergency if we couldn’t find the 12.5% anywhere

And never get just regular bleach from the laundry aisles. Most have other chemicals in them these days. You want “pool” bleach.

We have a grocery store near us named Woodmans that carries 12.5% liquid chlorine. They call it shock but it’s just the chlorine. Look at the price!!! That’s so unusual. My husband paid $24 a case last week at American Sale. That comes out to $6 a gallon! We used to pay $2.79 a gal just five years ago.

I was giddy to find this deal. Sending the hubs back to stock up. Manufacturer dates were spring 2025 so only good for this season as always with any of these.

View attachment 567205

I’ll keep an eye out for a higher percentage when I head out for the other items. I was so excited to see some pink show for the FC test after I put it in. I just added additional based on the app and waiting for CC to show up.

 

[Newdude]

I was so excited to see some pink show for the FC test after I put it in

So let's go over your target, which is a moving target.

With the exception of an occasional whoopsie week where things don't go to plan, your FC loss will resemble a bell curve over the season. It starts low, ramps up for the mid season, then falls similar to how it went up.

You'll quickly find with regular testing that you've been losing X ppm per day. That's this point in the seasons daily demand. Add it back, plus 1 or 2 ppm for some wiggle room. This is done *above* minimum FC for your CYA level. Minimum is not the minimum you need to get by today. It's that your available FC for sanitizing is almost 0. (Factoring the CYA buffering it).

So everyday, here's how you dose :


Minimum FC
+ Recent daily loss
+1 or 2 ppm wiggle room
--------------------------------
= stupid clear trouble free pool.

When your CYA goes up, the FC needs to be raised proportionately to match it. All levels on this chart are equal for sanitizing.





For those of us with SWGs, everything still applies. We track the levels just the same but tell the SWG how to respond. However, and I cannot overstate this convienence, the FC is produced on-site. There's no buying, lugging or pouring involved. I make *one click* of a button and the unit produces more FC as the demand increases, or one click to make less in the back half of the season. Most weeks are like the week before and we get 2 to 6 weeks between adjustments.

 

[KayyLo]

So let's go over your target, which is a moving target.

With the exception of an occasional whoopsie week where things don't go to plan, your FC loss will resemble a bell curve over the season. It starts low, ramps up for the mid season, then falls similar to how it went up.

You'll quickly find with regular testing that you've been losing X ppm per day. That's this point in the seasons daily demand. Add it back, plus 1 or 2 ppm for some wiggle room. This is done *above* minimum FC for your CYA level. Minimum is not the minimum you need to get by today. It's that your available FC for sanitizing is almost 0. (Factoring the CYA buffering it).

So everyday, here's how you dose :


Minimum FC
+ Recent daily loss
+1 or 2 ppm wiggle room
--------------------------------
= stupid clear trouble free pool.

When your CYA goes up, the FC needs to be raised proportionately to match it. All levels on this chart are equal for sanitizing.

View attachment 567235



For those of us with SWGs, everything still applies. We track the levels just the same but tell the SWG how to respond. However, and I cannot overstate this convienence, the FC is produced on-site. There's no buying, lugging or pouring involved. I make *one click* of a button and the unit produces more FC as the demand increases, or one click to make less in the back half of the season. Most weeks are like the week before and we get 2 to 6 weeks between adjustments.

Thank you so much for this! It’s very helpful. Once we are situated with the pool and all the additional costs we’re throwing at the yard renovation I’ll be considering the SWG. I am enjoying this learning process though!!

 

[Newdude]

It’s very helpful.

It's so simple yet it's also so frequently misunderstood.

People test at minimum and pat themselves on the back as they walk away.

Or they test 4ppm which is 'in range' and they pat themselves on the back and walk away. 4ppm may be a 2 day supply over minimum in April, and it may be a 3 hour supply in July when you lose 4, or maybe even 5 ppm a day because sunny CA.

If you need to dose over target range to accomplish the mission mid season, don't even blink and just do. You are safe for swimming and equipment up to slam. Notice how much wiggle room you have above target, and how little below it. Always dose or screw up on the high side and you'll *never* need to come ask us about your swamp.

Instead you'll come gush how TFP clear water is no joke.

 

[KayyLo]

Lowering your pH with acid will reduce your CSI. Which is not bad anyway you are fine. I would also work on lowering your TA. Increase CYA too. Also FYI: CYA is not linear so a reading of 25 just count as 30.

You got a new pool too bad you didn't go with a SWG. Would have made your life a lot easier.

Plaster surfaces are rarely evenly colored. Your pic looks like one side might be in the shade. If not and that is actually the difference in color, that is worse than usual. And interesting that the mottling is on that side.

I added all but the stabalizer yesterday. Turns out I actually had 0 so I’m trying to get to 30 now. I added liquid just now and brushed away and have the granual on hand as well to make it easier next time. It was a long stressful day of running out to grab supplies, testing, and adding chems while trying to get work done. TA tanked so now I’m buying some baking soda. I’ll post results of my test when I get home. I just subscribed after realized I saved over my last results.