New IG pool owner, question before first startup

[milesvdustin]

Opened the main drain cover. There is a pipe coming in At the side and another sticking up with a gasketed cap on it. I blew air down the line with main drain isolated and the side pipe blew all the air and water out it. Not sure what that gasketed pipe is yet. Couldn't pump anything up or down the sump line. Just a couple bubbles at the main drain when blowing air down the sump line

Drain is a hayward sp1084-B

 

[milesvdustin]

SO I did some testing, I removed the pump so I could attach my shop vac to the main drain and sump lines. I isolated the "sump" line and applied air. The area at the main drain was bubbling a tiny tiny amount. I switched to blowing air into the line marked "main drain" and it was bubbling and spraying water like crazy!

So do I have a drain tile system under the floor in the bottom of the hopper that can be pumped out with the pool pump to alleviate ground water?

I am at the point where I am going to jack up the bottom of the hopper and see what is going on with these lines.

 

[Casey]

Keep us updated on what you find. Did you find a liner yet? That old one was pretty beat.

 

[milesvdustin]

I am measuring Saturday when I have some help to measure it up. I am still investigating the main drain and sump line conundrum. Could there be two lines connected to that drain area?

That old liner mostly tore apart by hand without needing a razor knife. It was bad! Couple spots to repair in the floor and add wall foam then new liner. ANy thoughts on ground pads for IG vinyl pools?

I think I need to get a handle on ground water. What is the best way to add a well point next to the pool?

My Hayward sand filter needs new sand. It looks half empty and all rutted through and thrown about. Best to start fresh not knowing the history.

 

[duade]

So do I have a drain tile system under the floor in the bottom of the hopper that can be pumped out with the pool pump to alleviate ground water?

Man you move fast.

Can you share some pics of the entire yard so we can get a feel for the topography? May help to determine why the system is this complicated.

Im from the Chicago area, but I am a Saluki. I lived in a house on the west part of Carbondale that was in a valley like area that fed a creek. The backyard was always wet even in drought like conditions. If you cant share a photo, maybe describe it?

 

[Casey]

You can dig a hole at the corner of the pool (deepend) and shove a sleeve into the hole and put some gravel in it and cap it. Then drop a sump pump in it when you see water collecting. They are best done when installing pools but obviously they aren't always done.

 

[milesvdustin]

I am up on top of a hill. All the land gently slopes away from the house and the pool. I can take some pictures tomorrow, I am working OT tonight until midnight.

There is a pond about 100 yards away and then about 200 yards to the north is a large creek that always has water in it. I suspect the water table is a little higher here.

 

[milesvdustin]

You can dig a hole at the corner of the pool (deepend) and shove a sleeve into the hole and put some gravel in it and cap it. Then drop a sump pump in it when you see water collecting. They are best done when installing pools but obviously they aren't always done.

Pretty hard to dig a 10 foot deep hole without machinery. I do have a post hole digger

 

[milesvdustin]

Looking at my picture of the main drain area, there is only the one pipe coming in. When I blew air down it that pipe on the side was blowing like crazy. When I blew in the sump I got a very small amount of bubbling activity in the drain area.

 

[duade]

Pretty hard to dig a 10 foot deep hole without machinery. I do have a post hole digger

Maybe hold off digging until more people comment. Also, you need to take care when digging around the pool even with a post hole digger.

 

[milesvdustin]

Maybe hold off digging until more people comment. Also, you need to take care when digging around the pool even with a post hole digger.

I am not too hard up to dig just yet. But I really want to know what this purported sump pipe is. I have a sneaky feeling that the "return " right next to the skimmer is actually a suction port for a cleaner and is mislabeled. I have a couple tests to do tomorrow and ill report back

 

[jimmythegreek]

Sounds like you have a sump under the deep end hopper. They do those when ground water is an issue and it's a good thing to have. The only negative is that it needs manual attention, like you need to see the liner floating to go set filter to waste amd get it pumping. A sump pit is ideal for chronic issues but way more work so many PB do the sump so they can keep working during the build.
You have vermiculite, it's only soft when new amd wet, older Verm feels like concrete. I would get that measured amd get on the liner ASAP its not great to have a liner pool sit empty and even worst with water issues. The hydrostatic pressure will crack the floor up fast so wait on repairs until the liner is ready to go in.
Easy enough to test the line to determine if it's a cleaner line. Usually has a different type of fitting than a standard return

 

[milesvdustin]

That line appears to be a regular return. All 3 returns. They are threaded inside. My testing seems to point to below grade sump, but nothing comes up when I pump on it with the other lines isolated. It blows a tiny bit of bubbles down at the main when I force air down the line


Doing the air blowing thing with some main drain valve open produces much greater action at the drain

 

[milesvdustin]

I sent off quote requests to 5 diff companies today, one came back at 1800. I really like that liner too. Poolwarehouse is a tentative 900 bucks for a GLI liner but it's 20 mil vs the 28/20

 

[jimmythegreek]

PW has cheap liners because of dye quality. They aren't bad, but fade much faster from UV than major brands. Who can get you one fast is also a big consideration in this pandemic. Make sure your measurements are spot on as you will get a summer cut so will be slightly tight naturally. What shape is pool?

When you blow the sump line are you getting bubbles in the drain or near the drain from perimeter floor area?

 

[milesvdustin]

pool is a 18x36 rectangle with an 8' 6" deep end. 6" radius corners

 

[jimmythegreek]

Get good numbers L x W as 6" corners are hardest to get tight. Make sure the hopper and slope is laid out also

 

[milesvdustin]

the part where the slope comes down from the shallow end doesnt really have a defined point, it kind of just slopes into the bottom of the deep end. The length and width of the pool walls are dead on exact, maybe 1/16" difference. I measured 5 different points across both ways to check. Just the bottom someone did a less than perfect job on.

Local pool store quoted over $4,000 for a liner. Still waiting on all my quotes for DIY to come in.

 

[milesvdustin]

So I can't get any water from the sump line. There is about 8" of water in the bottom right now from groundwater. Does the pool have to be full for the pump to take water from the sump line?

I'm worried to order a liner. The bottom isn't perfect, far from it. How do you deal with ground water during liner install?

 

[jimmythegreek]

The line needs to be primed. When you use the sump line normally the system is full of water already. Some pumps can self prime others need a garden hose to fill line partially then quickly pump it.
Also keep in mind the line could be partially blocked of damaged somehow if you dont know the history of the pool