New AGP. out with the intex

[Dadofthree74]

Like all of you we bought an intex pool at the start of covid. It served us well. 15x 48”. We ran a swg and the pool is no longer level and the poles are rusting

We went to family leisure today and are looking at a 18 x52” round corrugated steel with resin top and resin verticals (asahi pool) 30 mil pool liner (swim line) with a waterway 1 hp single speed and 19 in sand pump. stainless steel panel with a skimmer and one return for $5500 plus tax installed.

We have to provide the mason sand (2 yards) electrical (already nearby) and move a fence for the bobcat. (Cost not included)

1. Is that a decent pool?
2. We are NOT getting the permasalt system. How easy is it to add a swg to the setup?
3. Will start with chlorine tabs initially. Since we never did chlorine tabs how easy is it maintain a pool with them?
4. If we can find a local installer is there a pool and pump to get online. The largest size would be 18 feet. Maybe 20 ft.
5. With single speed pumps can you add a timer?

Thanks for your advice.

 

[Newdude]

1. Is that a decent pool?

That is too subjective.

2. We are NOT getting the permasalt system.

Repeat this over and over. Do not stop. If the pool store tries to change your mind, continue chanting, but louder.

How easy is it to add a swg to the setup?

The same as last time, but likely a bigger and/or more permanent system.

3. Will start with chlorine tabs initially. Since we never did chlorine tabs how easy is it maintain a pool with them?

They are easy peasy lemon squeezy. Until they jack your CYA and make you drain the swamp which is unsanitizable because the sun burns off the high FC faster than you can add it. Effectively you won't be able to make it sanitary no matter how hard you try. Then it's difficult difficult lemon squifficult.

4. If we can find a local installer is there a pool and pump to get online. The largest size would be 18 feet. Maybe 20 ft.

Many people buy online and have a 3rd party install it.

5. With single speed pumps can you add a timer

Yes.

 

[Dadofthree74]

They already threw is the $100 for permasalt this weekend. We won’t fall for that.

I calculated the pool vol to be about 8000. Any recommended swg these days? We only used intex swg in the past.

 

[Decoy205]

Get the Swg if you can do it. Stick with liquid chlorine if that’s not going to be installed at the same time. Your pool is small enough that it won’t be that crazy if an expense even if price goes up. Look up reviews on the pool if you’re concerned about quality. Honestly I think the install is the most important thing. As long as that’s done properly you should not have issues.

I think the price is fair considering you’re getting the equipment and the install.

 

[Dadofthree74]

Get the Swg if you can do it. Stick with liquid chlorine if that’s not going to be installed at the same time. Your pool is small enough that it won’t be that crazy if an expense even if price goes up. Look up reviews on the pool if you’re concerned about quality. Honestly I think the install is the most important thing. As long as that’s done properly you should not have issues.

I think the price is fair considering you’re getting the equipment and the install.

I’m not sure if they will install a swg when they install the pool.

I’ll have figure out how to install it and run it only when the pump is on. Is that something an electrician has to do or can a novice do it?

 

[Newdude]

Is that something an electrician has to do or can a novice do it?

Installing a timer is basic level stuff, but still beyond many folks comfort level. If you are not entirely comfortable working on electric, and aware of how to do it safely, we reccomend having an electrician come in.

Any recommended swg these days?

@Mdragger88 might know of some middle of the road models for smaller pools.

 

[VinnyinNJ]

Here's my thoughts just going through an AG install last year, we replaced an AG pool that was the same size as we had.

We had our pool installed by a pool installer and we had to pull permits for this. I can't say if where you live is the same or not or if the pool you're looking at is considered the same as what we bought (I assume any steel walled AG pool is the considered the same) but you may need permits for at least electrical which follow the National Electric Code (NEC) and maybe a building permit for the pool itself. I think DIYers may get away with not installing to codes but an installer doesn't want to get caught. Our last pool had bonding to just the pool upright, our new pool has bonding under the dirt 18 to 24 inches from the pool wall, water bonding but since our uprights and lower tracks are resin no pool wall bonding. If needed you can do that yourself, there were other code changes as well but not sure if it was a township code change.

If you can get away with no electrical requirements, I would suggest looking at a Hayward Aquatrol SWG. It is an AG SWG that is good for up to 18,000 gallons so a little over 2x the capacity of your volume. It comes with a timer and assuming you don't need a twist lock plug for your filter you can plug the filter into the SWG housing and it times both of them. Actually I would look at it even if there are electrical requirements since it is large enough for a pool the size you are looking at.

I agree to stick with liquid chlorine, although you can trichlor until your CYA reaches the correct amount (around 30). I used to use bleach but they are putting stuff in bleach now so it's harder to find plain old bleach.

There is a brand online that people here say is nice, not sure what brand it is. It's been in a few recent threads. Just be aware that buying online may not mean a better price or if it is, installation may be more from an installer.

 

[Dadofthree74]

Here's my thoughts just going through an AG install last year, we replaced an AG pool that was the same size as we had.

We had our pool installed by a pool installer and we had to pull permits for this. I can't say if where you live is the same or not or if the pool you're looking at is considered the same as what we bought (I assume any steel walled AG pool is the considered the same) but you may need permits for at least electrical which follow the National Electric Code (NEC) and maybe a building permit for the pool itself. I think DIYers may get away with not installing to codes but an installer doesn't want to get caught. Our last pool had bonding to just the pool upright, our new pool has bonding under the dirt 18 to 24 inches from the pool wall, water bonding but since our uprights and lower tracks are resin no pool wall bonding. If needed you can do that yourself, there were other code changes as well but not sure if it was a township code change.

If you can get away with no electrical requirements, I would suggest looking at a Hayward Aquatrol SWG. It is an AG SWG that is good for up to 18,000 gallons so a little over 2x the capacity of your volume. It comes with a timer and assuming you don't need a twist lock plug for your filter you can plug the filter into the SWG housing and it times both of them. Actually I would look at it even if there are electrical requirements since it is large enough for a pool the size you are looking at.

I agree to stick with liquid chlorine, although you can trichlor until your CYA reaches the correct amount (around 30). I used to use bleach but they are putting stuff in bleach now so it's harder to find plain old bleach.

There is a brand online that people here say is nice, not sure what brand it is. It's been in a few recent threads. Just be aware that buying online may not mean a better price or if it is, installation may be more from an installer.

I’m not sure if we need permits. We have a existing intex pool and an electrician ran a gfci switch near by. I’ll ask the pool installer.

No mention of bonding by the pool company. Is this bc the lower part is buried?

 

[Newdude]

I’m not sure if we need permits.

All localities being different and all......... most don't require permits for 'temporary' Intex type pools and most localities do require permits for 'permanent' above ground pools.

 

[Texas Splash]

I didn't see this mentioned above, but if at all possible try to get something other than a single speed pump/motor. Ask if they have any 2-speeds stilll available or go with a variable speed.

 

[Dadofthree74]

I didn't see this mentioned above, but if at all possible try to get something other than a single speed pump/motor. Ask if they have any 2-speeds stilll available or go with a variable speed.

I asked they don’t. They only have two pumps. Both waterway. 1 hp and 1 1/2 hp.

 

[Texas Splash]

They only have two pumps. Both waterway.

That will work. I'm currently using a Waterway Supreme, but the Hayward PowerFlo Matrix is the same. Easy hook up and you can keep it on low as much as you want. Avoid a single speed if possible.

 

[Mdragger88]

@Dadofthree74
I have an asahi pool from F.L. - a Mirage.
Is it a top of the line pool? - um no…
Will it probably be fine? It should fare the same as any other in that price range. If you plan to bury it at all I would go with another choice.
Wilbar & aqualeader pools are more robust. They also sell those.
If you can find an independent installer the pool factory has some very nice salt friendly options that many here have had good experiences with & they are good to deal with/have good customer service -The saltwater 8000, matrix, & aurora (if your budget can swing it) if I were to replace my pool today I’d go with an aurora as it is completely resin walls & all. In my case I couldn’t find an independent installer at the time & I needed the pool to be buried on one side so I didn’t feel comfortable going diy with that dirt work.
They were also low on stock (no 27’ pools) at the time & the price was right so I went with this bigger 33’ .

For others reading this post - the Perma Salt System is NOT a swg. It is a copper ionizer system that masquerades as a swg.
Good job on avoiding that
I made them substitute wedding cake steps instead.
I used my intex swg’s with it until they died - there are adapters that connect the intex to normal above ground hoses.
I just let them install the pool & told them I would do all the “start up” chemicals (which are all still in my shed) then I put my swg’s on it after they left- i used two intex units because my pool is large. I now finally have a “normal” swg. Ideally you want a swg rated for at least 2x’s your pool’s volume. If you already have a 15k intex swg use it till it dies lol
I wanted sand & bought some but they refused & put zeolite in the filter which I had to change to sand after a year because it was terrible.
They also added sand directly to my steps which became an algae nightmare quite quickly.
You can use a floater with pucks while you’re pool is filling & things are getting hooked up but that is not a good daily chlorination plan. Either use liquid chlorine or a swg.
As far as I know FL still only offers single speed 120v pumps with above ground pools
- if you go with an online pool purchase you can buy a 2 speed or a vsp pump instead.
You can definitely use a timer with any of those.
I have a 1.5hp single speed pump & I use this timer
NSi Industries TORK RHB32R... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07B93VNT2?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
The intex swg units had their own timers so I would just sync them with this one.
For My current hayward aquarite I installed a cord end on it & it is also plugged into this timer.

 

[VinnyinNJ]

I’m not sure if we need permits. We have a existing intex pool and an electrician ran a gfci switch near by. I’ll ask the pool installer.

No mention of bonding by the pool company. Is this bc the lower part is buried?

There is the NEC but that's not to say that your township requires it for a more permanent pool, NEC does require the bonding. We had a GFI from our last pool and the electrician said he needed to upgrade the pool's electrical to new standards. He took out the old GFI and added a new one with a switched time clock for the filter - said it was required by either our township or NEC, I'm not sure. He also said that I couldn't use the SWG time clock for the filter per code, this may be/is questionable but I didn't push it. We also had to get a self closing, self locking pool gate (was the same 20+ years ago) to pass inspection; this is built into the pool steps we bought.

I mentioned all this because it was a surprise to us having a pool already that we needed to upgrade the electric and it was an added cost. We just assumed that it was a like for like exchange but things changed over the years; ours was 20+ years but my neighbor is able to run his non permanent pool much differently than we do.

 

[Dadofthree74]

@Dadofthree74
I have an asahi pool from F.L. - a Mirage.
Is it a top of the line pool? - um no…
Will it probably be fine? It should fare the same as any other in that price range. If you plan to bury it at all I would go with another choice.
Wilbar & aqualeader pools are more robust. They also sell those.
If you can find an independent installer the pool factory has some very nice salt friendly options that many here have had good experiences with & they are good to deal with/have good customer service -The saltwater 8000, matrix, & aurora (if your budget can swing it) if I were to replace my pool today I’d go with an aurora as it is completely resin walls & all. In my case I couldn’t find an independent installer at the time & I needed the pool to be buried on one side so I didn’t feel comfortable going diy with that dirt work.
They were also low on stock (no 27’ pools) at the time & the price was right so I went with this bigger 33’ .

For others reading this post - the Perma Salt System is NOT a swg. It is a copper ionizer system that masquerades as a swg.
Good job on avoiding that
I made them substitute wedding cake steps instead.
I used my intex swg’s with it until they died - there are adapters that connect the intex to normal above ground hoses.
I just let them install the pool & told them I would do all the “start up” chemicals (which are all still in my shed) then I put my swg’s on it after they left- i used two intex units because my pool is large. I now finally have a “normal” swg. Ideally you want a swg rated for at least 2x’s your pool’s volume. If you already have a 15k intex swg use it till it dies lol
I wanted sand & bought some but they refused & put zeolite in the filter which I had to change to sand after a year because it was terrible.
They also added sand directly to my steps which became an algae nightmare quite quickly.
You can use a floater with pucks while you’re pool is filling & things are getting hooked up but that is not a good daily chlorination plan. Either use liquid chlorine or a swg.
As far as I know FL still only offers single speed 120v pumps with above ground pools
- if you go with an online pool purchase you can buy a 2 speed or a vsp pump instead.
You can definitely use a timer with any of those.
I have a 1.5hp single speed pump & I use this timer
NSi Industries TORK RHB32R... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07B93VNT2?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
The intex swg units had their own timers so I would just sync them with this one.
For My current hayward aquarite I installed a cord end on it & it is also plugged into this timer.

@Mdragger88

We are trying to find an independent installer but maybe out of luck.

Thanks for the helpful tips.
I still have the intex swg.
Thanks for the timer link.

I’m not electrically inclined. Shocked myself as a kid!

We are not burying it. They do recommend backfilling the excess dirt about 4-6 inches to help prevent the sand u see the pool from washing out(?). I’m thinking you is Buried more than that.

 

[Mdragger88]

Many here have diy’d their own build with some electing to sub out the dirt work. Not sure if that’s your thing but it is quite achievable.
the Family Leisure here doesn’t do any electrical or bonding- you’re on your own for that either way. Not sure how yours is but it’s quite common for that to be how it is.
Yes, my pool is very buried.
Ideally, for the most longevity you don’t want dirt or anything touching the pool wall at all if you can help it.

 

[Dadofthree74]

Many here have diy’d their own build with some electing to sub out the dirt work. Not sure if that’s your thing but it is quite achievable.
the Family Leisure here doesn’t do any electrical or bonding- you’re on your own for that either way. Not sure how yours is but it’s quite common for that to be how it is.
Yes, my pool is very buried.
Ideally, for the most longevity you don’t want dirt or anything touching the pool wall at all if you can help it.

@Mdragger88

I did the install of the intex- hand cut the grass etc- pain in the butt. I am inclined to normal try it myself but had a small cardiac event last week
so I am no longer able to do that kind of work (per the boss). Hence need to outsource it.

I will definitely outsource the electrically (I assume they will do the bonding?). I will do the swg on my own after the install and I will use the intex till it dies. thanks for that suggestion.

is there any reason why I couldn't spray some rust oleum on the stainless steel screws they install to help minimize rust?

 

[Mdragger88]

Definitely sub it all out then- don’t wanna get on the boss’s list!
The xtra rustoleum is a good idea- I did it later at all the seams but I wish I would have done alot more at the beginning especially in all the areas mine is buried before I backfilled.
An electrician should do the bonding- make sure you ask so it’s included in the quote. You may or may not need permits for the pool - that’s your responsibility as well. I was also responsible for getting the utilities located (you must do this) & aquiring sand (they told me how much & what kind to get)
FL just does the dirt, leveling, sand spreading/tamping and install. The rest is up to you. Fulfilling safety requirements and all that.
I think they would put a pool in your front yard if you asked
I paid an extra $500 for them to dig - that was between me & the installers. They charge per inch after a certain amount. I can’t remember how many inches were “free/included”.
Even if you think your yard is level it’s probably not so be prepared for a little extra.