Looking for an alternative to Softswim Assist (20% sodium chlorite)......

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Here is another vote for SWCG. It is the most trouble free way to go since all you have to do is get the salt and CYA to the right level when you open in the spring and you generally are good to go for the entire season without doing a thing - other than testing. And you aren't adding any chemicals to the pool at all, just regular salt. But using liquid chlorine as suggested doesn't cause you to smell when used properly.
 
Thanks prs...but I'm good for now. I really am adverse to draining. As I pointed out, the water was just put in last summer! It feels so fresh and clean compared to what was in the pool up to when the replastering was done. So..I have absolutely no interest in draining the pool. Why would I want to do that? Today the water looks really good. I need to be more vigilant of my oxidizer level rather than just assuming that because I am adding the same amount each week everything is ok. That being said, if the water mold problem comes back (ok...I know everyone here would have me change the operative word to "when" rather than "if") then I will need to consider going to chlorine since the go-to chemical that took care of mold for baquacil systems is no longer made. Decision point is looming. I have one more Softswim assist treatment and then my supply of the last few years is gone. Taking it one day at a time. No change this season anymore. I've already decided that.
 
As I noted in this post, you can get sodium chlorite directly yourself. The chemical is still made as is Dichlor that needs to be added with it. This MSDS shows that BioGuard SoftSwim Assist is, by weight, 20% sodium chlorite and 8% Dichlor. Technically what the combination of sodium chlorite and Dichlor does in water is produces chlorine dioxide. That is what kills the white water mold without destroying the Baquacil. Chlorine would of course kill the white water mold, but would also oxidize the Baquacil which is how one converts to a chlorine pool.
 
chem geek said:
As I noted in this post, you can get sodium chlorite directly yourself. The chemical is still made as is Dichlor that needs to be added with it. This MSDS shows that BioGuard SoftSwim Assist is, by weight, 20% sodium chlorite and 8% Dichlor. Technically what the combination of sodium chlorite and Dichlor does in water is produces chlorine dioxide. That is what kills the white water mold without destroying the Baquacil. Chlorine would of course kill the white water mold, but would also oxidize the Baquacil which is how one converts to a chlorine pool.
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Chem Geek,

Thanks for additional info. Would you suggest continuing to use sodium chlorite periodically over, perhaps, the idea of trying the Aqua Finesse tablets (main ingredient, besides soda ash, is the disodium metasilicate)? How would disodium metasilicate take care of the white water mold anyway? I was going to give up on the idea of sodium chlorite since I really didn't know where to get it UNTIL I just reviewed the link to your other post (thanks!) which I did not notice before and yet has the Keavy's Corner site. So my next question, then, would be how much to use that would be comparable to the two Assist tablets that I typically use when I apply it - putting one in the pump strainer and the other in the skimmer. Hmmm..maybe you can help me out with that and I'll see what I can come up with. The form you suggested is, of course, liquid whereas the Assist is in tablet form. Let me know how much of it you would suggest to use and is it something that could be used regularly, which is how the aqua finesse tabs are supposed to be used.

The other thing that you mention is that dichlor would also need to be added. Geez...how much of that would I use? Starts to get complicated......

One thing that I've never mentioned in all this discussion is my location, since it might be relevant to what goes on in my pool. The pool is literally only 10 feet away from an actively managed farmer's field. So during the season a huge area right next to the pool is routinely cultivated, liquid-fertilized, planted, cut, raked, and bailed. Dust and so forth wafts over the pool area quite often. I can't imagine that this situation is conducive to maintaining top-quality pool water. Also, there are farmer's fields on the other two sides of the house...same thing only a bit farther away. Only one side of the house does not have a farmed field bordering us. Just thought I'd throw that in since I've never mentioned it before.

Keith
 
Figure out how much your two Assist tablets weighed. Then use 20% of that weight of sodium chlorite and 8% of that weight of Dichlor. Dichlor is known as "chlorinating granules" most often used for spas but also available for swimming pools. Just look in the ingredients for something like 99% sodium dichloro-s-triazine; you do not want Cal-Hypo (calcium hypochlorite) which is also sometimes confusingly called chlorinating granules though usually it's called shock powder or something like that.

So long as the two chemicals are dry, you can mix them together (they are mixed in the tablets you used to use) or add them separately to the pool one right after the other (the chlorite first, then the Dichlor).

Your being next to a farm just means you may get blown-in fertilizer into your pool. That's more relevant for algae, though all living organisms do need a source of phosphorous such as phosphates.
 
Thanks chem geek. Right now I'm much more concerned with whatever is going on with my grout (see my recent post over on Chemistry 201) than how the water looks. If it's not one problem, it is another the way it seems. I had the old grout in the pool for 25 years and NEVER had anything like this white deposit issue.
 
Chem Geek,

I think I found what might work to use as a replacement for Assist -

Amazon.com : 2-Pack Chlorine Dichlor Granules sanitizer shock for Spa, Hot Tub, Pool - 2 x 2 lb. bottles (4 lbs. total) : Swimming Pool Chlorine : Patio, Lawn Garden

2 Pounds Sodium Chlorite Flake

Is this the correct stuff that would need to be mixed together?

I guess a concern might be how strong the fumes of these products could be to work with. I know the assist tablets were quite strong but with those it was just a matter of cutting open the pack and dumping them right in the skimmer and pump strainer. With actually mixing these dry ingredients though, that could get a bit nasty. Have you worked with either of these and can perhaps suggest how strong they might be?

Thanks,
Keith
 
As you found, the Sodium Chlorite Shop has it as 80% in solid form for $37 to $49 per pound depending on size. This is similar in price to Sigma-Aldrich at $49 per pound.

As for Dichlor, there are LOTS of products and it's cheaper to get "chlorinating granules" in pool sizes than in smaller spa sizes where your link is $6.49 per pound. At poolgeek.com you can get GLB Granular Chlorine for $6.26 per pound or in 50 pound size for $4.14 per pound or you can get a less expensive Pool Solutions brand at 50 pounds for $3.16 per pound.

I wouldn't try mixing these dry in an attempt to try and recreate SoftSwim Assist directly. There's no need for that because all it is doing is making a solution of chlorine dioxide in water. So instead, I'd add these separately to a large bucket of water in the right proportions by weight 20:8 of sodium chlorite to Dichlor dihydrate so 5:2 or 2.5:1 (remembering that the sodium chlorite you are getting is 80% by weight while the Dichlor is 99% so the weight ratio of these products would be 25:8 or roughly 3:1). Then add that bucket of water to the pool water. This link shows not only the ingredients, but the instructions for SoftSwim Assist imply that these are tablets that dissolve slowly when you have them in the skimmer and pump basket with the pump off for 6-12 hours. You basically add some with the pump on for a minute then turn it off so that the product does most of its work in the piping. If you use a liquid form of this, you'd add some of it slowly in the skimmer with the pump running then turn off the pump and add some more.

You don't have compression equipment so can't exactly recreate the tablets. See this hazardous substance fact sheet regarding sodium chlorite. In many ways it's similar in hazard to chlorine so you want to avoid skin contact and do not breath the flakes/powder. In water when chlorine dioxide is produced, this is a gas but it is about 10 times more soluble than chlorine. So I would use SMALL quantities for the bucket (see below) so that you don't produce a lot of chlorine dioxide gas (it will smell similar to chlorine). It's more soluble in cold water and it won't outgas as much in cold water so use cold water in the bucket (cold tap water should be fine). You do not want to make the bucket solution much more concentrated than around a 1% chlorine dioxide solution which would be 10 grams/liter of chlorine dioxide. So in a 5 gallon bucket, you'd add no more than 400 grams (about 14 ounces weight of pure sodium chlorite so around 17-18 ounces weight of 80% sodium chlorite product and around 6 ounces weight of Dichlor -- add the Dichlor first and mix). You can scale this down to a gallon if you want (3.5 ounces weight of 80% sodium chlorite with 1.2 ounces weight of Dichlor dihydrate). I don't know the weight of the tablets that were 20% sodium chlorite with 8% Dichlor.

This chlorine dioxide solution won't last so you would use it right away and should keep it out of sunlight since that would have it degrade faster.
 
Where do you get that the Aquafinesse pool pucks add metals? This SDS says they contain sodium carbonate (same as pH Up) and disodium metasilicate where the latter is essentially a coagulant/flocculant. They likely have some other non-hazardous ingredients they don't have to list, but metals (i.e iron, copper) would be listed if they were present. Both of these ingredients are bases and will raise the pH, especially locally where they are added.

See this link and this link that describe the use of Aquafinesse to help prevent white water mold in biguanide pools.
 

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chem geek said:
Where do you get that the Aquafinesse pool pucks add metals? This SDS says they contain sodium carbonate (same as pH Up) and disodium metasilicate where the latter is essentially a coagulant/flocculant. They likely have some other non-hazardous ingredients they don't have to list, but metals (i.e iron, copper) would be listed if they were present. Both of these ingredients are bases and will raise the pH, especially locally where they are added.

See this link and this link that describe the use of Aquafinesse to help prevent white water mold in biguanide pools.
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Thanks again for your help as always! The 2nd link is the company I had originally contacted. I spoke at length to the guy there but then never heard back from him again when I asked some additional questions. Another company I talked to that sells this stuff indicated to me that there are trace elements of metals present but not enough to create staining. I'll probably buy some and try it, but likely not this season anymore. It's really time to close here in PA.

Actually, the battle I'm trying to fight right now has to do with whatever is going on with my coping and grout. I have blue sapphire granite and over the past few months there is all this brown discoloration on the stones and grout in between. My pool company is being of limited help with suggestions on what it might be and how to get rid of it. I'd love for you to see pictures of it but I've been unsuccessful in trying to upload them. My thread relative to this problem is under the 'everything else' part of the TFP site. If you can offer any suggestions regarding this problem, that would be great.

Regards,
Keith
 
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