Feeling slight electrical current in pool...bonding seems intact. Thoughts?

[blazin]

Sorry i have no idea as to the tools as i just watched from afar. I have read post on the boating forums about stray voltages in and around marinas strong enough that people have died. A "little" shock around swimming pools can end up to a bigger shock and that is the scary part.
IF, thats a if, if i had to "guess" as to these problems i would say is it caused by multiple grounds. I always understood that all grounding wires were to go to ONE common ground rod on a property. More then one and you can get a difference in ground potential . This is what i think is the problem.

Just wanted to throw a lovely curve-ball out there.. the salinity defines the conductivity of water. It may be slightly easier to actually use a low voltage meter to measure something in the ocean vs a fresh water lake vs a pool. One of those fun science facts that plague engineers designing underwater electronics

 

[rawb]

Hi everyone... thanks again for all the great input I have received. I just wanted to give a couple updates on my troubleshooting. Forgive me if I already mentioned it, but I did turn off the main breaker to our house and was still able to feel the current. Last night I bought a 6-ft piece of #6 copper wire and put one end in the water and the other up on the wet concrete pool deck with a heavy brick on it just to see if it would make a difference if the potential was different between the two. I was still able to feel the current with it in place.

Another thing I noticed which I thought was odd is that I can only feel the current on one side of the pool. As a test, I got in the pool, stood at the shallow end by one of the step rails and began working my way down the length of the pool touching the wet concrete deck with my fingers. I had a slight cut/abrasion on my finger which made it quite noticeable and made it easy to test. I felt the current all the way down that long side of the pool, but just after I made the 90 degree turn down at the deep end, it was no longer there. I continued across the deep end and then all the way back down the other long side, and felt nothing. As soon as I got back to my starting point, it was back. So basically, I could touch the deck a few inches to the right of the step rail and feel nothing and then touch a few inches to the left and feel it. I have no idea why it's not consistent all the way around the pool. I also called a different electrician in town that wasn't the guy that my pool guy uses, but who does all the electrical for another big pool company in town. He asked if I had a separate electrical panel at the pool equipment pad. I told him no because they wired it straight from my breaker box in the garage into the pump and timer for the SWG. There is no additional panel at the pad. He thought that perhaps voltage was leaking into the pool since there wasn't that additional panel.

 

[jza1736]

If you turned off your main breaker and still feel the current, there is no way an additional panel will fix the problem. If he says it will, tell him to do it, but if it doesn't fix it, will you waive the cost of installation for the panel. I bet he backs out of that 1

 

[Dirk]

Glad to hear you're still alive!

And very glad to hear you're pursuing an expert to come take a look. Doesn't sound like you've found the right guy, though. Maybe keep looking.

Not so glad to hear you're still testing this with your body, though! I know you have a mind to solve this yourself, just seems very risky, is all. OK, OK, I won't mention it again.

A possible reason you're feeling different affects of the faulty bond in different places was addressed in #8, I believe, something about "voltage gradients."

Hopefully you'll find the right expert, who'll come to your pool and pinpoint the problem and fix it for you, too. Good luck.

 

[1Sammy]

If you turned off your main breaker and still feel the current, there is no way an additional panel will fix the problem. If he says it will, tell him to do it, but if it doesn't fix it, will you waive the cost of installation for the panel. I bet he backs out of that 1

I'll second that.
The fact you still can feel that tingle with the power off causes me to think of the imbalance of none bonded items and different ground potential. May not be an easy fix after the build.
See if you can find a marina electrician . One who has done work in dock wiring and the wiring in boats with AC hook ups. He won't be surprised by what you tell him.
Thank you for coming back to update.

 

[tstex]

rawb,

first, thanks for the update.

next, as Dirk stated, there's something about the tingle in your body and it being felt greater w an open cut that bothers me. This type of problem, or how to expertly troubleshoot w the correct tools is past my current pay-grade. But what is not, is general safety and you being the conductor still doesn't sound so great...

finally, since Lexington is pretty close to Lake Murray, maybe try Sammy's suggestion of a marina electrician? Find one and call him. Here's a link to 17 electricians in the Lexington SC area....good luck, tstex

17 Best Electricians - Lexington SC | HomeAdvisor Electrical Contractors

 

[#40Fan]

Since it is isolated to one side, have you tried grounding out the cement pad into dirt?

Also, how about a picture of the pool? Stand on the side that doesn't shock you and point the camera to the side that does. Get as much of the scenery behind it in the picture as you can.

 

[1Sammy]

You can only get a shock when you are at 2 different potentials. You then become the conductor. I can not understand how you still could feel a tingle when you had that wire in the pool and in tight contact with the Wet deck. Doing so would have them now in a bond state. Example.. You are in the pool with the wire, no tingle, so it you touch the wire you would feel no tingle. Work your way up the wire, no tingle as it is a one piece wire. Get to where you had the cement block, no tingle on the wire. Move finger off the wire to the deck, tingle,= No Bond. If there was a good contact it would be the same as touching the wire. You can wrap that wire around the hand rail and with that in the water it will bond the water. By chance do you know if you have rebar or wire in the concrete. It there is an expansion cut in the area of this tingling and water runs down and contacts the rebar which may not have a bond wire and might be just grounded. More of us have this issue then we know and until you get down to the last layer of skin we don't feel it.

 

[Anonymous]

Bonding of pool and equipment, and grounding of electrical feeds are two different things. Let's not conflate them.

Bonding ensures that people do not get shocked around a pool even when stray curent are present. Bonding ensures the stray current around a pool has a better path to travel then through the person.

To say this another way... Bonding brings all pieces of equipment to the same "Potential". Very important to understand that point. I've worked installing solar for a few years. (no longer). Just before any panels are installed, each piece of metal (each rail) is bonded to one another in an UNBROKEN and continuous manor, and that conductor is brought down to an earth ground.