Alkalinity ?

[vlh3]

Hello, I've visited your site in the past to troubleshoot issues with our pool. Thank you so much for all the resources! This year, in the beginning of June, I had to do the SLAM procedure. When I initially started, I only had test strips. The alkalinity seemed very high as well as the pH from the test strip comparison. During the process I did purchase the K-2006C Test Kit so I could get accurate #'s. Also, during the process I added 3 gallons of muriatic acid 3 different times. Things cleared up, but I seem to not be able to get the alkalinity/pH in check.

My test #'s 7/12/23 are FC 5.2, CC .2, pH 7.6, TA 150, CH 200, CYA 30. I think the alkalinity is still high, the pH seems to always drift up. I have added another 10 lbs. of dry acid... my husband's suggestion to use instead of the muriatic acid. I just can't seem to bring the alkalinity down to the ideal range. Last night, sometime after adding the second 5 lbs. of dry acid, I retested and the alkalinity came down to 140 ppm/pH 7.2... but it's back up to 150 now. Yes, I do have cloudiness.

Seems like I'm adding water from our outside faucet (city water) every other day or so. I tested the water that I add to the pool, it was TA 200ppm. Not sure if it matters... I was just curious what the alkalinity was that I was adding to our pool.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

 

[Oly]

Focus on the cloudy water first. Run an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test with your test kit. You may have a bigger issue so follow the test link instructions and diagnose this right away.

Your high TA issue will take some time, only use Muriatic Acid and simply lower your pH when it nears 8. Dont stress this situation. Having high TA in your fill water means this will be an ongoing process more so during the summer and high evaporation. PH TA Relationship - Further Reading

 

[Bperry]

Hello, I've visited your site in the past to troubleshoot issues with our pool. Thank you so much for all the resources! This year, in the beginning of June, I had to do the SLAM procedure. When I initially started, I only had test strips. The alkalinity seemed very high as well as the pH from the test strip comparison. During the process I did purchase the K-2006C Test Kit so I could get accurate #'s. Also, during the process I added 3 gallons of muriatic acid 3 different times. Things cleared up, but I seem to not be able to get the alkalinity/pH in check.

My test #'s 7/12/23 are FC 5.2, CC .2, pH 7.6, TA 150, CH 200, CYA 30. I think the alkalinity is still high, the pH seems to always drift up. I have added another 10 lbs. of dry acid... my husband's suggestion to use instead of the muriatic acid. I just can't seem to bring the alkalinity down to the ideal range. Last night, sometime after adding the second 5 lbs. of dry acid, I retested and the alkalinity came down to 140 ppm/pH 7.2... but it's back up to 150 now. Yes, I do have cloudiness.

Seems like I'm adding water from our outside faucet (city water) every other day or so. I tested the water that I add to the pool, it was TA 200ppm. Not sure if it matters... I was just curious what the alkalinity was that I was adding to our pool.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

As you manage the pH to stay in the 7’s, the TA will automatically come down on its own. Don’t worry about it. But stay away from the dry acid.

 

[Rancho Cost-a-Lotta]

Welcome to TFP!

I think the alkalinity is still high, the pH seems to always drift up.

Seems like I'm adding water from our outside faucet (city water) every other day or so. I tested the water that I add to the pool, it was TA 200ppm. Not sure if it matters

With high TA fill water, this will be a constant battle. As mentioned, keep pH in range with muriatic acid to help control TA.

 

[vlh3]

Focus on the cloudy water first. Run an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test with your test kit. You may have a bigger issue so follow the test link instructions and diagnose this right away.

Your high TA issue will take some time, only use Muriatic Acid and simply lower your pH when it nears 8. Dont stress this situation. Having high TA in your fill water means this will be an ongoing process more so during the summer and high evaporation. PH TA Relationship - Further Reading

After my post yesterday, I manually vacuumed algae out of the pool and shocked it with 3 lbs. of Cal. Hypo. An hour after shocking, I tested the FC which was at 13 ppm. In addition to the high alkalinity, algae keeps showing up.

OCLT - 7/12/23 10:21 pm - FC 13 ppm 7/13/23 6:15 am - FC 13 ppm

Other results: CC .6, pH 8, TA 150, CH 180, CYA 40

The pool was installed in 1985, 10 years before I came onto the scene. In my almost 30 years, we have not had such an issue with pH/alkalinity in the past.

 

[Bperry]

After my post yesterday, I manually vacuumed algae out of the pool and shocked it with 3 lbs. of Cal. Hypo. An hour after shocking, I tested the FC which was at 13 ppm. In addition to the high alkalinity, algae keeps showing up.

OCLT - 7/12/23 10:21 pm - FC 13 ppm 7/13/23 6:15 am - FC 13 ppm

Other results: CC .6, pH 8, TA 150, CH 180, CYA 40

The pool was installed in 1985, 10 years before I came onto the scene. In my almost 30 years, we have not had such an issue with pH/alkalinity in the past.

Just shocking the pool once isn’t going to clear up visible algae. There’s a specific process that TFP has outlined that’ll clear it up and keep it from coming back. Your TA issue isn’t related to the algae.

 

[vlh3]

Just shocking the pool once it’s going to clear up visible algae. There’s a specific process that TFP has outlined that’ll clear it up and keep it from coming back. Your TA issue isn’t related to the algae.

Thanks, Bperry. Yeah... I know the two are separate issues. I read through the resources that Oly suggested on PH TA Relationship. I'll check out the other resources for the algae that keeps creeping back.

 

[Bperry]

Thanks, Bperry. Yeah... I know the two are separate issues. I read through the resources that Oly suggested on PH TA Relationship. I'll check out the other resources for the algae that keeps creeping back.

Sorry, my reply had an autocorrect that was the opposite of what I meant. I edited the “it’s” to “isn’t”.

Sounds like you’re on the right track now.

 

[Oly]

This year, in the beginning of June, I had to do the SLAM procedure.
Yes, I do have cloudiness.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

This is what I keyed on in your initial question. Your TA/pH is not making your pool water cloudy.

In my almost 30 years, we have not had such an issue with pH/alkalinity in the past.

I tested the water that I add to the pool, it was TA 200ppm.

Perhaps your fill water was not always at 200ppm TA? It is now.

After my post yesterday, I manually vacuumed algae out of the pool and shocked it with 3 lbs. of Cal. Hypo. An hour after shocking, I tested the FC which was at 13 ppm. In addition to the high alkalinity, algae keeps showing up.

Your pool is cloudy and you are seeing and vacuuming up dead algae after 3# Cal Hypo. I understand you appear to have passed an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test but observing cloudy water and the presence of algae point to one diagnosis.

 

[vlh3]

Another question - After reading the resources of PH TA Relationship, Managing PH and TA, and How to Lower TA... At what point will I know that the rate of pH rise is at a reasonable level to manage?

 

[Rancho Cost-a-Lotta]

In my almost 30 years, we have not had such an issue with pH/alkalinity in the past.

It' my understanding that adding Cal Hypo to a pool with high TA and pH can cause cloudiness. You should avoid Cal Hypo and switch to liquid chlorine/bleach or install a SWG.

Your TA is not really an issue with a vinyl pool. There's no pressing need to force TA down. Just continue to manage pH levels with MA and monitor TA.

 

[vlh3]

This is what I keyed on in your initial question. Your TA/pH is not making your pool water cloudy.





Perhaps your fill water was not always at 200ppm TA? It is now.



Your pool is cloudy and you are seeing and vacuuming up dead algae after 3# Cal Hypo. I understand you appear to have passed an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test but observing cloudy water and the presence of algae point to one diagnosis.

Yeah... I'm suspecting that the City may have made changes to their water management/treatment.

I actually vacuumed the algae before the addition of the 3 lbs. of Cal Hypo. And yes, cloudy water after passing the OCLT from the testing of the FC this morning.

 

[Bperry]

Another question - After reading the resources of PH TA Relationship, Managing PH and TA, and How to Lower TA... At what point will I know that the rate of pH rise is at a reasonable level to manage?

It’s all personal preference technically. If the pH rises above 8.0 every day and you can add acid to bring it back down, it’s manageable. But some other people would find that unmanageable so they’d want to bring the TA down to let them have to only add acid every few days or weeks.

 

[Oly]

Reasonable is subjective some think even owning a pool is unreasonable.
I have high TA fill water and found that once my pool water TA reached 60ppm the pH became much more stable. Using more fill water during summer will push the pool TA up so anticipate that by have muriatic acid on hand or a tab or two of trichlor will lower pH and bump your CYA if needed, at the same time.

 

[vlh3]

It’s all personal preference technically. If the pH rises above 8.0 every day and you can add acid to bring it back down, it’s manageable. But some other people would find that unmanageable so they’d want to bring the TA down to let them have to only add acid every few days or weeks.

Every few days or weeks would be good with me! Thanks for all your wisdom and advice!

 

[vlh3]

Reasonable is subjective some think even owning a pool is unreasonable.
I have high TA fill water and found that once my pool water TA reached 60ppm the pH became much more stable. Using more fill water during summer will push the pool TA up so anticipate that by have muriatic acid on hand or a tab or two of trichlor will lower pH and bump your CYA if needed, at the same time.

This season... I'm thinking owning a pool is unreasonable! I'll have patience in the process of lowering the pH TA. My husband likes to have a tab or two of trichlor in the skimmers all the time.

Thank you for all your wisdom and advice.

 

[vlh3]

It' my understanding that adding Cal Hypo to a pool with high TA and pH can cause cloudiness. You should avoid Cal Hypo and switch to liquid chlorine/bleach or install a SWG.

Your TA is not really an issue with a vinyl pool. There's no pressing need to force TA down. Just continue to manage pH levels with MA and monitor TA.

I have some of the cal hypo left, but will switch to liquid chlorine for future use. Thanks for your knowledge, help and advice!

 

[Bperry]

This season... I'm thinking owning a pool is unreasonable! I'll have patience in the process of lowering the pH TA. My husband likes to have a tab or two of trichlor in the skimmers all the time.

Thank you for all your wisdom and advice.

Not a good idea to put trichlor in the skimmer. The acidic mixture gets pulled through all your equipment and damages it. Put them in a floater if you must use trichlor, but don’t use anymore once your CYA gets to 50ppm or so.

 

[vlh3]

Not a good idea to put trichlor in the skimmer. The acidic mixture gets pulled through all your equipment and damages it. Put them in a floater if you must use trichlor, but don’t use anymore once your CYA gets to 50ppm or so.

Wow! Thanks... this is what my husband was told to do when he had the pool installed in 1985 and has been doing so since. Sometimes he puts two 3" tabs in each skimmer.