New to pool maintenance...

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Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Oh I almost forgot to mention this: Since I wasn't sure what my readings were gonna be I stopped by Fry's on the way home and bought 8 jugs of bleach. I just put one jug on the counter and said I have 8 of these. The guy tipped the jug up to read the label and said "Is everything ok? You're not burning bodies or anything are you?". I was like no I'd need to buy acid for that...lol.
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Well the pool's been looking great. I haven't put any chemicals in since Sunday night. I seem to be averaging a loss of about 3.5ppm per day of FC and so it's down to 9 now. The only thing bugging me is to maintain a 3.5 ppm FC loss per day is going to cost about $3/day. Plus a $68 test kit that only does like 70 tests seems to equate to a dollar a day...maybe a little less when doing refills but I don't know. So it's looking like at least $100 a month. I know the costs won't be that high all year so maybe the average will get me back down to a reasonable number but when someone mentions a $100 a year costs I get excited and I'm just not seeing that as a reasonable expectation. For $60 a month I barely had to walk in the backyard more than twice a week.
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Gilrock said:
Well the pool's been looking great. I haven't put any chemicals in since Sunday night. I seem to be averaging a loss of about 3.5ppm per day of FC and so it's down to 9 now. The only thing bugging me is to maintain a 3.5 ppm FC loss per day is going to cost about $3/day. Plus a $68 test kit that only does like 70 tests seems to equate to a dollar a day...maybe a little less when doing refills but I don't know. So it's looking like at least $100 a month. I know the costs won't be that high all year so maybe the average will get me back down to a reasonable number but when someone mentions a $100 a year costs I get excited and I'm just not seeing that as a reasonable expectation. For $60 a month I barely had to walk in the backyard more than twice a week.
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Actually, FC loss is a percentage, not a fixed PPM per day. So as the FC level drops, the loss drops, although percentage wise it should be about the same. Most people only lose 2-3 ppm per day.

Do some comparison shopping for bleach. Check http://www.hasapool.com/dealer_locator_hasa.php to see if you have a dealer nearby. That's the stuff I use; always fresh, full strength, cheap, and has a punch card for a free one after so many that makes it even cheaper.

I was scrolling through and I missed what your final CYA value is. If it's low enough, you can get by most days with the colorblock tester for checking chlorine.
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Hmm...just wanted to make sure my FC loss sounded reasonable. Even 2-3 ppm loss a day is gonna cost me more in bleach alone than I was paying a pool guy. I'm starting to wonder how he was able to keep my pool clear for $60 a month. I'm just a bit surprised cause I thought I could do it myself for less but I guess not.

The last CYA number I measured was 65. I haven't tested it again because the Taylor K-2006 only had enough stuff to do the CYA test 6 times. I'd be willing to drain the pool to dilute it if would lower the FC loss but I haven't seen anyone talk about the relationship of CYA level to FC loss....only the number you need to shoot for. If most people lose 2-3ppm a day and I'm at 3.5ppm now I'm not sure how much better I can get and if its worth another drain so soon. I also haven't seen anything about the relationship of what CYA level you need for different areas. Like since I'm in AZ with 105 F temps do I need a higher level than somewhere with much lower average temps?
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

In AZ you may want your CYA a little higher. But that can an issue if you have a problem. It was cheaper for me to use a service too, but the water was never as nice and safe.
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Yeah that's what I was thinking. My water is really clear right now. When my wife gets back from vacation I'll see if she thinks the water is clearer than when we used a pool service. I'm just worried she's gonna freak out when I tell her we gotta buy 30 bottles of bleach a month over the summer and she realizes how much more we will be spending. So I guess everyone in town can't be using this method or Walmart wouldn't be able to keep up with bleach demand...lol.

The first service guy we had used chlorine gas so he wasn't raising the CYA level. He also told me not to put anything in the pool between his visits. But he only came every 2 weeks so the first week the pool looked great and the 2nd week it was starting to look greenish. That's why my wife wanted to switch. The second service guy we had was $10 more a month but he came every week and did a couple additional things like cleaning the basket and backwashing. But the 2nd guy floated tabs all week and didn't use chlorine gas so I assume he was using shock that was raising my CYA level. I'm really curious what would have happened if I had kept him for a few years. Seems like it would have been costing him more to support the pool if the CYA level sky rockets.
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

I had chlorine gas too, they had my CYA at 300ppm when I fired them. :hammer:
Also no refund if the pool turned green and unusable.
 

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Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

I'm in PA and you are in AZ, so keep that in mind... but I bought a solar cover this year which I keep on the pool during the week when few people are swimming and it has REALLY cut back on the chlorine demand. Last summer I needed to put in 2/3 of a gallon of 8.25% liquid chlorine every day. This year, I'm only using a gallon of 12.5% every 3-4 days. It's remarkable. I run my pool with CYA @ 30.

Essentially my chlorine costs were cut in half. The 20x40 solar cover cost about $100. Assuming I get 2-3 seasons out of the cover which seems typical, that's a payback time I can live with.
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Ok thanks for the feedback everyone. Now I've been starting to wonder about a different topic....my filter run times. I'm not sure where we got the idea but someone told my wife that a good rule of thumb was to run the filter an hour for every 10 degrees so when it's 100 outside in the summer run 10 hours and when it's 60 in the winter run 6 hours etc. I'm wondering if I need to run less now that I'll be keeping the FC more stable. I've actually been running my filter 12 hours a day right now so I'm probably turning the water over 3-4 times a day. I also thought I read awhile back that it helps reduce chlorine consumption by the sun if you have disturbance on the water surface causing the sunlight to reflect around so I've always routed some of the return water to the waterfall to keep the surface active.
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Gilrock said:
Ok thanks for the feedback everyone. Now I've been starting to wonder about a different topic....my filter run times. I'm not sure where we got the idea but someone told my wife that a good rule of thumb was to run the filter an hour for every 10 degrees so when it's 100 outside in the summer run 10 hours and when it's 60 in the winter run 6 hours etc. I'm wondering if I need to run less now that I'll be keeping the FC more stable. I've actually been running my filter 12 hours a day right now so I'm probably turning the water over 3-4 times a day. I also thought I read awhile back that it helps reduce chlorine consumption by the sun if you have disturbance on the water surface causing the sunlight to reflect around so I've always routed some of the return water to the waterfall to keep the surface active.
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If you are running 12 hours per day, I think you can see some savings from cutting back. My advice, cut back to 6 hours a day for a week and see if you notice a degradation in water clarity. If not, then stick there and enjoy the 50% electric cost savings. If the water is cloudy (but the water is balanced) then scale back up to 8 hours a day which should be more than enough unless you have a filter issue of some kind. I have a sand filter and found that I have no issues with running 6 hours a day.

Keep in mind that if you are SLAM-ing the pool the filter needs to run 24 hrs/day.
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Well my water has been doing great. The only thing bugging me now is how much I've been spending to maintain it. I was already at about $80 to $90 a month on bleach and lately trying to keep my pH from being too high is starting to be a $30 to $40 a month cost. I have a waterfall which I guess causes aeration and raises pH. I've always liked using the waterfall to create additional movement in the water and ripples on the surface. I've lowered the flow rate on the waterfall to a very low rate. It also seems like rain is increasing pH and I thought it would have been acidic and lower pH. Last couple weeks I've been using about 2 gallons of muriatic acid a week to maintain pH. I bring it down to 7.2 and in 3 days it's back up to 7.8. It's like it's on a spring and I keep pushing it away from it's happy place. I have noticed that my bleach usage has decreased a little since I've been trying to keep the pH lower but the acid costs a lot more than the bleach. The cheapest I've found so far is $5 a gallon for 14.5% acid. I did find some 31% acid but it was $5 a quart. My old pool guy who charged $60 a month has and still maintains my neighbor's pool for years now. I don't think those people ever touch the pool and it looks pretty nice so I've been tempted to go grab a water sample out of curiosity. I've never seen them drain any water in 3 years. My water looks really nice but I'm not sure it's double the cost nice and the fact that I'm now slaved to it. I used to barely go in the backyard but once or twice a week and now it's once or twice a day.
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Something doesn't sound right -- that's waaaaay too expensive!

Your pool is 25% larger than mine, and you probably get a little more sun. Chlorine costs me a buck a day. I wouldn't think you'd need to spend more than twice what I spend. Have you checked pricing and availability for HASA bleach and acid in refillable jugs? http://www.hasapool.com/dealer_locator_hasa.php

If your water is high in TA, you will use a whole lot of acid. Evaporation and topoff and the waterfall aeration will do that. Once I finally got my TA down to 70, things stay pretty stable. I've even learned roughly how much acid to add for each inch of water I add, so I can keep pH close to ideal without constant fussing.

Rain is mildly acidic, but when it really nails the surface of the pool so it looks like it's boiling, it's aerating and driving pH up.

Five bucks a quart for acid? :shock: I think I'm paying four bucks a gallon for 31%.
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Go to Leslie's and get 2 gallons of 31% acid for $11.

The HASA store is pretty far away and may not be worth the drive.

Post up some numbers. What is your CYA? What are your FC readings? Where are you buying your chlorine?
 
Re: New to pool maintenance...about to give up

Yeah I forgot to check into the HASA store. I didn't think to check acid prices at Leslies cause their liquid chlorine price was $5 a gallon for 10% so I figured they were probably high on everything. For chlorine I'm mainly buying bleach at Walmart so it's only $3 a bottle but I was using a gallon a day which is near 3.5 ppm FC. Since I started trying to keep the pH lower it seems like I was only losing 3ppm a day so I have had days where I only dump in 1/2 gallon and after a couple overcast days I was able to skip a day. I usually only measure my FC and pH. CC has always been 0 whenever I check it. I test in the evening when I get home and I target my FC to be around 7.5 to 8.0 to begin the day. I don't test CYA very often. I've read it as 55 and then a week later read 65 even though nothing was added to raise it. That test is just not very accurate in my opinion....it's too subjective on how much the dot needs to be hidden. So I just assume I'm near 65 and I don't worry about it. It should be doing nothing but going down but I think that's gonna happen very very slow. I've only checked other readings a couple times and TA is near 100 which I thought was ok and CH is 350 which I thought was a little high.

BTW when I say gallon the Walmart bottles are 121oz so it's slightly under a gallon and its the 8.25% stuff.
 

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