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Thread: Nature2

  1. Back To Top    #1

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    Nature2

    This year I ditch the Nature2 system, I used it last year for my first year with the BBB method, and I had a perfectly pristine pool. I understand that the use of things like the Nature2 system are totally not necessary, so this is going to be my test. And I have complete confidence in the results. Another perfect year.
    steve

    Above Ground / 18' Round / Vinyl Liner / Sand Filter / 100K Gas Heater / Salt Added / No Nature2

  2. Back To Top    #2
    And the money you save on this year's N2 cartridge will buy ALL your bleach for the season--and maybe next year's as well!

    Even if N2 worked as well as they claim (and I gather it doesn't) it won't pay for itself at all. Because the cost of the cart is about double of what you save on bleach, if not quadruple.

    Here's how I figure: I have 20k gallons. I average about 1 gallon every 2 days all summer. Assume a 3 month summer--90 days. That's 45 gallons.

    An N2 Cart is about $90. Now if bleach is $2/gallon, I can buy ALL my bleach for the summer for the cost of the cart. Bleach has to go to $4/gallon AND the N2 must cut my usage from 45 gallons to 22.5 gallons just to break even. If bleach is $2.50/gallon it's more expensive to use N2 even if it cuts my usage in half.

    Not worth it to me.

    Plus, N2 adds silver and copper to your water. It helps control algae (which reduces chlorine usage) but doesn't do ANYTHING to sanitize your water. Adding 2 ounces of Polyquat 60% every week will be just as effective. But copper turns blond hair green and stains metal fittings.

    I also find it interesting that Nature2 is decidedly UNinformative about what's in their system, and about evidence that it works. Lots of testimonials and adjectives, little on specifics.
    Stay ahead of your water!

  3. Back To Top    #3
    gonefishin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarlD
    I also find it interesting that Nature2 is decidedly UNinformative about what's in their system, and about evidence that it works. Lots of testimonials and adjectives, little on specifics.
    It reminds me of some of the audiophile marketing I've seen



    This is only the second year that I've had my pool up. But a Nature2 system came with the pool kit. After reading this forum I decided I didn't want to use the Nature2 system and the pool store gave me an in store credit for $99.00.


    That may be an option for others who buy a pool kit that includes the Nature2 system. Oh yeah...with the $99.00 credit I bought myself a second cartridge filter and some other goodies

    dan
    33' Aqua-Leader AGP
    Hayward cartridge filter and IntelliFlo VS pump.
    Solar Heat coming ; used to own Aqua-Cal HeatWave 100k (HeatPump)
    Aqua-Rite t-15 SWG

  4. Back To Top    #4

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    That is precisely why I started this topic, to get it out there that this is an unnecessary expense, and that the money could be used in other places. Now I have this used nature2 system that I have to sell.
    steve

    Above Ground / 18' Round / Vinyl Liner / Sand Filter / 100K Gas Heater / Salt Added / No Nature2

  5. Back To Top    #5

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    Re: Nature2

    Quote Originally Posted by sevver
    This year I ditch the Nature2 system, I used it last year for my first year with the BBB method, and I had a perfectly pristine pool. I understand that the use of things like the Nature2 system are totally not necessary, so this is going to be my test. And I have complete confidence in the results. Another perfect year.
    I not only don't like the cost of the Nature 2 but also question the effects of the silver and copper on the body long term. We use silver to treat wounds and have seen some resistance to silver by gram positive cocci in low dosage over long peroids of use in treating some deep skin wounds. As for copper there is always Wilson's disease. I know the occurrence is low in our population but why take the chance. I took a hard look at the Nature 2 last year when I was "pool stored" when I bought my pool and dumped the cartridge mid season and will not replace it. I had no out problems with out it the second half of the season.
    But this is my ideals about this worthless system.
    Steve
    Echo Canyon II by Artesian Pools, 13.5 KGal AG Round, 22" Artesian Sand Filter 2 hp Artesian pump
    Med Lab Tech for 12 years in E.TN
    Chem testing by Trouble Free Test Kits

  6. Back To Top    #6
    Quote Originally Posted by gonefishin
    Quote Originally Posted by CarlD
    I also find it interesting that Nature2 is decidedly UNinformative about what's in their system, and about evidence that it works. Lots of testimonials and adjectives, little on specifics.
    It reminds me of some of the audiophile marketing I've seen

    dan
    Oh, they come up with some fertilizer too, don't they! Then the next company makes fun of the first company's claims! The two biggest on hype are easily Bang&Olaffsen and Bose. They spend far too much money on their high-end mall stores and it's reflected in the priceyness of their equipment--far beyond the sound quality's justification.

    Since I'm a super-big believer in the B-B-B method I am totally skeptical of all of Nature2's claims. And the cost-benefit analysis just doesn't add up. I also am HIGHLY skeptical of the ozone method of sanitation, and see the electro-magnets as pure BS.

    Good, basic methods work and are easy. You test your water frequently, you adjust immediately as needed. You use simple chemicals. Replace hype and fear tactics with knowledge. Save money and have a sparkling clear pool that YOU know is sanitary and safe.
    Stay ahead of your water!

  7. Back To Top    #7

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    Yeah so I guess I got pool stored on that one......we did get a new cartridge while they were on sale and it is not returnable.......i'll use it this year and then, as one of hte other posters suggested, just let the water run through it without a new cartridge.

    Pool gets opened next Friday, I'm quite anxious to see what the water looks like. I do have all the chemicals needed from t he store, we were using the Simplicity System, I think by Bioguard. I did get a Taylor testing kit and will be checking results with the store and this forum. Eventually I guess we will make our way to the BBB system. Our only fear is whether or not our current system is compatabile or we need to do the conversion. We did talk about this on anther thread, but I dont' think it was resolved as to whether there was anything in our chemicals that would preclude using BBB as an alternative.
    18 ft.52" Round Atrium AG -7600 gallons, Sand Filter, Vinyl liner, Royal Entrance Steps, 80 lbs.solarsalt

  8. Back To Top    #8
    Why don't you list the chemicals in the Simplicity system?

    Most of these packages are just fancy re-branding of standard stuff, with some additives you don't need or want.

    If it's Bromine or Bacquacil, you have a decision to make.

    But if it's just a chlorine compound, you can "switch" to B-B-B tomorrow--or today. You aren't actually switching--you are just buying the products you need far cheaper and only when you need them.

    pH-Up! from Biogard is nothing more than sodium carbonate--Soda Ash--Arm&Hammer Washing Soda (not baking soda) is the same stuff.
    Most commercial pH raisers are soda ash--and expensive.
    20 Mule Team Borax is far cheaper and has fewer side effects.

    pH-Down and other powdered pH lowerers are nothing more than dry acid--buy it as cheap as you can find it generically, or use Muriatic acid, which has less side effects.

    Total Alkalinity Raiser is Sodium Bicarbonate--Baking Soda. You can pay $12 for 4 lbs, or you can pay $4 for 12 lbs at CostCo.

    Chlorine is chlorine is chlorine. Liquid Chlorine, aka, Laundry Bleach has the fewest side effects and is usually cheapest. Don't buy the hype about it adding Total Dissolved Solids--the salt for a salt-water generator adds at least 10x as much with no problem.

    There's only one algaecide that isn't more trouble than it's worth: Polyquat 60%...If the bottle say Poly...<something>... 60%, that's the stuff, no matter if it's called Black Algaecide, Mustard Algaecide, etc. Don't pay more than $15/quart if you can help it, $20/quart if you gotta have it now (anything higher is a rip-off).

    The other algaecides can cause foaming, clouding and lots of other problems.

    Other stuff: Clarifiers, sequesterants, flocculants, bluing, etc. Avoid them like the plague. You only need them under specific circumstance and most people NEVER see those if they follow good maintenance discipline.

    Testing: If you don't have a good test kit you need one. Even the 5-way drop test kit from Wal-Mart is better than nothing. But a true FAS-DPD chlorine test kit will pay for itself many times over even if all you have is a 15' Intex Donut. I bought my first FAS-DPD kit when I had a 15' Intex and I was AMAZED at how much it helped.
    Stay ahead of your water!

  9. Back To Top    #9
    As mentioned in another thread, the Simplicity system is a chlorine-based system, so there will not be any conversion necessary. Simply start using BBB... That, in my mind, is simplicity!! Three inexpensive, readily available substances, plus a little stabilizer and acid if necessary, and that's all there is to it! Oh, and a good test kit!

    8000 gallon 20' x 48" round vinyl frame pool, 12" sand filter (don't have the specs on the pump), TF100 test kit
    Handy Links: PoolMath, TF-100 Test Kit, Pool School, CYA-Chlorine Chart
    "Shock" is a process, not a product!

  10. Back To Top    #10

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    Got the Taylor test kit so I will get that going once the pool opens..........one more probably silly question......if you use bleach that gets poured directly into pool then you don't need the chlorine pucks anymore? For example we use the Simplicity clear pucks that are placed in the automatic chlorinator....so we wouldn't need that cholorinator either and it can just sit there and look pretty beside the empty Nature 2 device????
    18 ft.52" Round Atrium AG -7600 gallons, Sand Filter, Vinyl liner, Royal Entrance Steps, 80 lbs.solarsalt

  11. Back To Top    #11
    Quote Originally Posted by waterbug
    .......if you use bleach that gets poured directly into pool then you don't need the chlorine pucks anymore? ............so we wouldn't need that cholorinator either and it can just sit there and look pretty beside the empty Nature 2 device????
    You are correct!!

    You would have to delete them from your signature, tho!! 8)

    (and the only silly question is the one that goes unasked!!)

    8000 gallon 20' x 48" round vinyl frame pool, 12" sand filter (don't have the specs on the pump), TF100 test kit
    Handy Links: PoolMath, TF-100 Test Kit, Pool School, CYA-Chlorine Chart
    "Shock" is a process, not a product!

  12. Back To Top    #12

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    I could have saved several hundred dollars in these lovely devices if I had seen these wonderful pool forums before buying a pool. Ah well, live and learn right? We will use up all our chemicals and then be able to switch over next season to the BBB way.

    Thanks to all.
    18 ft.52" Round Atrium AG -7600 gallons, Sand Filter, Vinyl liner, Royal Entrance Steps, 80 lbs.solarsalt

  13. Back To Top    #13
    SeanB's Avatar
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    Never hurts to have the chlorinator if you go out of town or something.
    TFP Founder

    My Pool: 13K gal IG gunite with 7' spa, Pentair Cartridge Filter, Intellichlor IC40 SWG, Polaris 280 Cleaner, TF-100 Test Kit w/ salt test.

  14. Back To Top    #14

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    Okay, we do go away sometimes and yes, we did leave pucks in it and leave the pump running. So, if you did this, then you could just leave the chlorinator empty, except for when you go away, and then add, some form of puck in the chlorinator for the time frame that you are gone?
    18 ft.52" Round Atrium AG -7600 gallons, Sand Filter, Vinyl liner, Royal Entrance Steps, 80 lbs.solarsalt

  15. Back To Top    #15
    Quote Originally Posted by waterbug
    Okay, we do go away sometimes and yes, we did leave pucks in it and leave the pump running. So, if you did this, then you could just leave the chlorinator empty, except for when you go away, and then add, some form of puck in the chlorinator for the time frame that you are gone?
    I would leave the chlorinator empty, and check it now and then to ensure there's no build-up of deposits on any of the ports. Then when you go away you can use Tri-Chlor pucks in it to keep you pool chlorinated...but check you CYA and pH before you leave--the pucks add CYA rather rapidly, and are VERY acid.
    Stay ahead of your water!

  16. Back To Top    #16

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    Thanks for this info concerning the nature 2 system. I am about to purchase an Echo Canyon II, 16'X24'X54" AGP from artesian and the two of the "packages" comes a nature 2 system. As such I was wondering what it did and if it was worth it. I see that many feel it isn't!

    Again, thanks.
    TPG
    36k, 23'x47' freeform 3.5'-9'deep
    Gunite/white plaster
    Colorlogic LED lights.

  17. Back To Top    #17

    Re: Nature2

    In facts, from customers' testimony, it ''does work'', but it ain't worth the risk.

    Price is high. Even with Cal-Hypo it won't pay itself.
    Most customers who uses Nature2 don't use CYA. This means pool's clear but not SAFE, especially since some customers, no CYA again, put chlorine every other day only.

    Hurts Saltwater chlorinator sales too!

    I am all for B-B-B method and teaching:
    Know what you add to your pool.
    Never add a product that ''might'' help, only those that ''will''.
    There's only science: No magic, no new trick, no miracle. Best you can hope is a tradeoff: (Polyquat burns up chlorine, CYA lowers Chlorine effectiveness, etc.)
    ...
    I simply use Pool Store products to do so.
    Pool: None, and All.
    ''What's really interesting is finding some way to explain some technical concepts with simple terms so that everyone might understand, to vulgarize.'' CaOCL2

  18. Back To Top    #18

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    Re: Nature2

    Anytime I see mention of N2, I am compelled to re-post my story. Forgive me if you have seen it before, this is my little way of trying to get even:
    Quote Originally Posted by Durk
    I had severe problems with the Nature2 system that came free with my new pool in 2004. Pool was only three weeks old when I had to travel for 2 weeks. Cartridge failed while I was gone and all the little metal balls blew out the returns, rolled merrily down the pool bottom, and most got sucked into the main drain and back into the pump trap five feet from where they started. Metal levels went through the roof and I had nice black stains that required acid start-up and much sequestrant to resolve. I took the little balls down to the Pool Store Guy and he knew exactly what they were, because apparently it happens a lot. Anthony-Sylvan did step up and do the stain removal, and THEY said it happens a lot. I never used it again and have since ripped it out.
    Current: 28,000G 18'x36' I/G AnthonySylvan Plaster; Waterway 60 sq.ft. DE Filter; 1.0hp x 1.65 SF Two-Speed (B2982) WhisperFlo; 2004-Present
    Previous: 40,000G 20'x40' I/G Koven unlined WWII salvage 5/8" marine steel; Lomart Stainless Sand Filter; 3/4hp Hayward SuperPump; 1946-2003 (managed by me from about 1964)
    Ancient Taylor K-2000, upgraded with Taylor CH, TA, and FAS-DPD, and TFT CYA tests.

  19. Back To Top    #19

    Re: Nature2

    I have a Nature2 for my pool would you suggest I remove it just can't get my pool chemicals right.

  20. Back To Top    #20
    dmanb2b's Avatar
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    Re: Nature2

    I would, but that's my opinion. If yo start your own thread, feel free to post up a full set of test results along with your specific issues..we'll help you get that water balanced. Welcome to TFP.
    24'x52" AGP (13,500 Gallons), Intex SWG, (2)Solar Bear 4x20 panels, Hayward S220T Filter, 1/2hp Pentair Superflo

    Pool School, TFTestKits, Pool Calculator

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