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Thread: Buying a SWG

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    Buying a SWG

    Ok so i have like 2-3 months before its time to start thinking about opening the pool again. We want to buy a SWG but im reading alot of problems with certian ones. We have about a 48,000 gal pool its flippin huge . What SWG has the least amount of problems and can handle my size pool.

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    Autochlor RP64/RP92 or even SMCWM-100 if you want to go into commercial range.

    I'd recommend RP92 but it depends on your location.
    How much and what type of chlorine do you currently use?

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Buying a SWG

    The AutoPilot Digital with SC-60 cell is fairly well reviewed and suitable for a pool that size. Another approach would be to get two Aqua Rite units. Aqua Rite currently has the best reviews, and while having two units means a bit more complexity it also gives you some added reliability (even if one unit breaks the other will still provide some chlorine).
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    I like both the Auto-Pilot that Jason suggested and the Pentair IC-60. I am not a big fan of using cells in parallel except for with the Auto-Pilot system and its manifold design. That eliminates the Hayward, Jandy, and Zodiac and they have their share of issues.

    Actually, I have not found one that doesn't have some issue but the Auto-Pilot and Pentair have fewer given the number of unit that get installed over time.

    Scott
    Owner of - PoolGuyNJ LLC
    Expert Pool and Spa Repairs, Renovations, and Augmentation. Helping people decide what is the right gear for meeting their needs. Expectations Set, Expectations Met, No Surprises.

  5. Back To Top    #5
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    Re: Buying a SWG

    I actually prefer SGS Chlorinators, their grid spacing is wide so calcium build up is easily removed without a chemical bath. Controls are simple and installation is a breeze! They have three sizes 40,000, 55,000 and 70,000 gallon.

    Good Luck and Happy New Year!

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    New2Me's Avatar
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    Re: Buying a SWG

    If it is a flippin huge pool, do you have a flippin lot of space to add equipment? And a flippin huge amount of cash to add equipment? What is the chlorine demand for your pool? How long do you run your filtration system? Do you have hard make-up water? Do you want ease of use, and/or ability to handle complex configuration? Use with automation system/controller? When it stops working (and it will, they all do at some point) will you want to attempt to restore it to operation yourself, or call a warranty service tech (got a long warranty?)
    I would advise you to use the next few months to download several of the manufacturers owners manuals, and read them to compare/contrast their systems.
    Can you understand their basic operation, and how to change the control parameters, or set/remove alarms?
    Does the installation and maintenance seem different from the others?
    How can you tell if it's working or needs to be cleaned, how do you clean it, and does the cleaning require parts that aren't included?
    A lot of my views on these items were discussed in this link "Is there no tech support?" - http://www.troublefreepool.com/is-th...rt-t17866.html
    It always pays to do your Homework!
    Good Luck, and Best Wishes!!!
    22 x 40 IG vinyl lined, 23,570 gal.
    1 hp. Pac-Fab Challenger pump 300# sand filter
    Intex 8110 SWG, Hayward CL220 offline feeder
    Hayward 250K Btu gas heater
    Aquabots

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by New2Me
    If it is a flippin huge pool, do you have a flippin lot of space to add equipment? And a flippin huge amount of cash to add equipment? What is the chlorine demand for your pool? How long do you run your filtration system? Do you have hard make-up water? Do you want ease of use, and/or ability to handle complex configuration? Use with automation system/controller? When it stops working (and it will, they all do at some point) will you want to attempt to restore it to operation yourself, or call a warranty service tech (got a long warranty?)
    I would advise you to use the next few months to download several of the manufacturers owners manuals, and read them to compare/contrast their systems.
    Can you understand their basic operation, and how to change the control parameters, or set/remove alarms?
    Does the installation and maintenance seem different from the others?
    How can you tell if it's working or needs to be cleaned, how do you clean it, and does the cleaning require parts that aren't included?
    A lot of my views on these items were discussed in this link "Is there no tech support?" - http://www.troublefreepool.com/is-th...rt-t17866.html
    It always pays to do your Homework!
    Good Luck, and Best Wishes!!!
    That's a flippin lot of questions to think about?!?!?!?!

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by PoolGuyNJ
    I like both the Auto-Pilot that Jason suggested and the Pentair IC-60. I am not a big fan of using cells in parallel except for with the Auto-Pilot system and its manifold design. That eliminates the Hayward, Jandy, and Zodiac and they have their share of issues.

    Actually, I have not found one that doesn't have some issue but the Auto-Pilot and Pentair have fewer given the number of unit that get installed over time.

    Scott
    Scott-Are you thinking of the CIC-60 unit? That is the one that Pentair uses for commercial applications, and they provide a manifold system (I am working on a commercial pool currently that is roughly 250,000 gallons, and we are putting 25 CIC-60's in a manifold application in. Pentair can manifold up to 9 units in one manifold, and they can all be hooked in series. This particular project will be an 8-8-9 manifold. It does require a separate control unit to turn it off and on).

    Other than that, like my sig says, I am still searching for the next SWCG myself! I am in salp's camp with SGS as the next one I will probably buy (I have had the GoldLine, AutoPilot and IC-40 so far), and I agree that they all have their challenges!

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    The IC-60 is a new US only model.

    Here's the link on Pentair's site.

    http://www.pentairpool.com/products/san ... tor-75.htm

    The SGS unit is interesting and bears further review. I hope they will be at the Atlantic City show at the end of the month.

    Scott
    Owner of - PoolGuyNJ LLC
    Expert Pool and Spa Repairs, Renovations, and Augmentation. Helping people decide what is the right gear for meeting their needs. Expectations Set, Expectations Met, No Surprises.

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    Thanks Scott! I was not aware that Pentair made the IC-60 Guess I better pay better attention!

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    I am working on a commercial pool currently that is roughly 250,000 gallons, and we are putting 25 CIC-60's in a manifold application in. Pentair can manifold up to 9 units in one manifold, and they can all be hooked in series. This particular project will be an 8-8-9 manifold. It does require a separate control unit to turn it off and on).
    wow! that sounds like a lot of pain to install and maintain
    did you ever consider truly commercial systems?

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    New2Me's Avatar
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    Re: Buying a SWG

    The SGS unit looks just like a knock-off for defunct Chloromatic ESC-24/36/48 manufactured by Monarch (Davy Industries) in Australia. The Aussies seem, IMHO, to have refined most of the "kinks" out of ECG. A look at some of the replacement cells available, like from Kawana (http://kawanachlorinatorspares.vsn.com.au/,) shows the easy cleaning access. Some other ECG from Australia are Compupool (http://www.compupool.com.au/product/..._cleaning.html, and their american knock-off? http://www.circupool.com/), and of course, AutoChlor (http://www.tdconsulting.com.au/salt_...&type=Domestic) who have, IMHO, one of the best ECG web sites, they have more science and less marketing BS. If you are using bleach now, the calculator for cost comparison is a very cool tool!

    If you want an American made product, you might want to look at Resilience (http://www.resiliencepool.com/products/a5/,) I think that they also make the Intermatic I-Pure systems (http://www.poolandspacontrols.com/pr...enerators.aspx.) I haven't read about many problems with either of them on this forum, but then again, I don't know how many people here use them!

    Of course, the simplest, and least expensive self-cleaning ECG is the Intex, but for a pool the size of yours you would need at least two, probably three, and you have to make your own connectors, but the wiring is super simple!

    I would also mention that whatever you are going to use, get/price spares before you buy, be prepared for when you need to change/clean cells and sensors (it always seems to happen when there is little time to mess with), and keep some chlorine (bleach, di/tri-chlor, etc..) handy for when you need to shock. Remember, also, that you really can't "shock" with ECG, it simply does not produce enough chlorine fast enough to be effective(unless you install a massive cell capability.)
    Good Luck, and Best Wishes
    22 x 40 IG vinyl lined, 23,570 gal.
    1 hp. Pac-Fab Challenger pump 300# sand filter
    Intex 8110 SWG, Hayward CL220 offline feeder
    Hayward 250K Btu gas heater
    Aquabots

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    And the debate goes on.......

    Strannik-It is a pain, but the cost of the "true" commercial units is way out of range for this client. Honestly, I don't think they will do it at all, but I have to provide the info and pricing for them to consider.......

    New2Me-I agree that the Aussies seem to have it together the best. I used to use the "ChlevaChlor" unit with good results, but have no source for it (if it is still around). I've been through several units, and none have made me a 100% fan, so I continue to try and find one I can truly get behind. I am pretty lucky in that I have always been given the units that I have had, as we use my pool as a "test pool" for many different things, and I need to fully understand a product before I can get behind it to recommend it to a client.

    I wish it were easier! One day I will find the perfect unit and then I can move on to whatever else isn't working on my pool!

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    polyvue's Avatar
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    Re: Buying a SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by New2Me
    The SGS unit looks just like a knock-off for defunct Chloromatic ESC-24/36/48 manufactured by Monarch (Davy Industries) in Australia. The Aussies seem, IMHO, to have refined most of the "kinks" out of ECG. A look at some of the replacement cells available, like from Kawana (http://kawanachlorinatorspares.vsn.com.au/,) shows the easy cleaning access. Some other ECG from Australia are Compupool (http://www.compupool.com.au/product/..._cleaning.html, and their american knock-off? http://www.circupool.com/), and of course, AutoChlor (http://www.tdconsulting.com.au/salt_...&type=Domestic) who have, IMHO, one of the best ECG web sites, they have more science and less marketing BS. If you are using bleach now, the calculator for cost comparison is a very cool tool!

    If you want an American made product, you might want to look at Resilience (http://www.resiliencepool.com/products/a5/,) I think that they also make the Intermatic I-Pure systems (http://www.poolandspacontrols.com/pr...enerators.aspx.) I haven't read about many problems with either of them on this forum, but then again, I don't know how many people here use them!

    Of course, the simplest, and least expensive self-cleaning ECG is the Intex, but for a pool the size of yours you would need at least two, probably three, and you have to make your own connectors, but the wiring is super simple!

    I would also mention that whatever you are going to use, get/price spares before you buy, be prepared for when you need to change/clean cells and sensors (it always seems to happen when there is little time to mess with), and keep some chlorine (bleach, di/tri-chlor, etc..) handy for when you need to shock. Remember, also, that you really can't "shock" with ECG, it simply does not produce enough chlorine fast enough to be effective(unless you install a massive cell capability.)
    Good Luck, and Best Wishes
    Wow! For a Man of Leisure, you've certainly done your homework. Thanks for your well-researched post!
    14,555 gal in-ground 16'x29' white plaster Pool w/spa (2007); Goldline Aqua Logic AQL-PS-8 control w/Aqua Cell 15 Salt Water Chlorination (SWCG); Hayward TriStar 1HP (1.85 SF) main / 1.5HP (1.60 SF) spa pumps; Hayward Swimclear cart filter C4025, ColorLogic LED lights; Tankless SP-18-4 electric heater; Polaris 280 cleaner.
    __
    View of spiral galaxy in Ursa Major NGC6217 - Hubble Telescope 2009

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by New2Me
    and of course, AutoChlor (http://www.tdconsulting.com.au/salt_...&type=Domestic) who have, IMHO, one of the best ECG web sites, they have more science and less marketing BS. If you are using bleach now, the calculator for cost comparison is a very cool tool!
    Just a small clarification, this is not the manufacturer's website

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by simicrintz
    Strannik-It is a pain, but the cost of the "true" commercial units is way out of range for this client. Honestly, I don't think they will do it at all, but I have to provide the info and pricing for them to consider.......
    you might be surprised here (although i don't know the price of Pentair units, so it might be me who will be surprised )

    The catch with Autochlor commercial units is that they don't have NSF approval, so they can only be used on commercial pools in states which don't require it (if there are any).
    The reason for that is that the models change so quickly it doesn't make sense to get one, by the time you go through the process the model you were getting certificate for is obsolete.

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by Strannik
    Quote Originally Posted by simicrintz
    Strannik-It is a pain, but the cost of the "true" commercial units is way out of range for this client. Honestly, I don't think they will do it at all, but I have to provide the info and pricing for them to consider.......
    you might be surprised here (although i don't know the price of Pentair units, so it might be me who will be surprised )

    The catch with Autochlor commercial units is that they don't have NSF approval, so they can only be used on commercial pools in states which don't require it (if there are any).
    The reason for that is that the models change so quickly it doesn't make sense to get one, by the time you go through the process the model you were getting certificate for is obsolete.
    I am dealing with that issue (NSF cert.) on some work in Las Vegas currently. If you don't have the NSF approval, you don't get the work! And, if you change even a single nut or bolt on any piece, you lose the NSF rating In my business, there is no way that you cannot change something, as every application is completely unique, and there are no "bolt in" applications.

    Oh well, nobody ever said it would be easy........

  18. Back To Top    #18

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    Re: Buying a SWG

    then you know what i mean

    same story with Autochlor, commercial units (especially bigger ones) are made for specific applications, hence the NSF approval would be void before it's even issued.

  19. Back To Top    #19
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    Re: Buying a SWG

    Wow! For a Man of Leisure, you've certainly done your homework. Thanks for your well-researched post!
    I'm glad to give back! The best research I did was finding TFP! I've book marked a LOT of ECG pages, and read most of the owners manuals available online. Most contain the same info, not that much would I consider very useful. The good ones at least give chlorine production amounts and specific models performance. Comparing a model's "Pool Size" vs. the actual amount of chlorine produced differs from maker to maker. I've often thought of starting a Consumer Reports style table thread, listing available makers/models, but there are hundreds of them!
    22 x 40 IG vinyl lined, 23,570 gal.
    1 hp. Pac-Fab Challenger pump 300# sand filter
    Intex 8110 SWG, Hayward CL220 offline feeder
    Hayward 250K Btu gas heater
    Aquabots

  20. Back To Top    #20

    Re: Buying a SWG

    I have the Auto-Pilot Total Control with SC-60 and it is rock solid. Keeps the chemistry levels solid spot on. The support is outstanding. For my 28,000 galon pool it runs at the lwest setting with a 10% purifier output, enough to set chlorine at between 1-2% levels. I run the pump 6 hours a day. Half of that ay 40 gal/minute.
    Richard
    Temecula, CA
    28,000 Gal. In-Ground plaster and tile, Total Control AutoPilot with SC-60 SWG and PH control, Pentair EasyTouch 8, EasyTouch Wireless Remote, Intelliflo VS+SVRS pump, Intellibrite lighting, Pentair Quad 100, Solar heating, Pentair Mastertemp 400 Gas Heater, The Pool Cleaner 4x, Aquabot Turbo T2 Robotic Cleaner, Water feature spillover from SPA.

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