Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: Start Up Chemistry Results

  1. Back To Top    #1
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Start Up Chemistry Results

    Hi all. Been open for about 2 weeks, water improving, but still a little cloudy, so wanted to send along some test results for recommendations (as I just got our new TF-100 kit). Doe the chlorine results (i.e. TC) from the 'daily test kit' make sense based on the FC and CC results? Also, thinking I need to lower the TA (although my Ph has been relatively stable and in range).

    Ph 7.2
    FC 2
    CC 10
    TC .5
    TA 150
    CH 125
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Mod Squad Jimrahbe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Bedford, TX
    Posts
    9,277

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    D,

    I would leave TA alone as long as your pH is somewhat stable.

    I'm much more worried about your FC being at 2 ppm. 2 ppm is the absolute minimum you can go with a CYA of 30 and since you did not provide us with your CYA reading I'm going to have to assume it is higher.

    See this chart... https://www.troublefreepool.com/cont...art-slam-shock

    This chart is the key to the whole TFP process. You must maintain an FC in relation to your CYA level...

    I also assume some typo, as you can't have a CC level of 10 and a TC of .5

    It works better for us, when your report your readings, if you only use the results from the TF-100. Do not report the chlorine reading from the "daily" test kit.

    Like this...

    FC
    CC
    pH
    TA
    CH
    CYA

    Thanks for posting,

    Jim R.
    Finished in 2015 - 17K Gal, IG, 20' x 25' Almost Rectangular Pool, Pebble finish, three rockport water falls. Pentair Equipment: EasyTouch 4, IC40 SWG, 3 HP VS Pump, CCP520 Cartridge Filter.
    TF100 with SpeedStir and SampleSizer, ColorQ Pro 7, Dolphin Premier Robot Cleaner, added Screen Logic 2, added small 3 person Caldera Spa.

  3. Back To Top    #3
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Hi Jim, Thanks for the reply. Apologies for not including the CYA, it was 50. I agree on the chlorine readings not making sense, so I re-tested. FC is 2 (4 drops of R-0971, however, I also got a reading of 3 at 6 drops) and CC is 7 (14 drops of R-0871).
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  4. Back To Top    #4
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    20,303

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Before we all start to panic at the high CC results, let me ask: Did you listen to the pool store and "shock" your pool on opening? Perhaps with some kind of non-chlorine "shock" using monopersulfate? MPS will mess up the CC test. https://www.taylortechnologies.com/C...P?ContentID=24
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  5. Back To Top    #5
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    I avoid the pool store as much as possible. When I opened, I did use a liquid shock to help jump start the process (bottle doesn't say anything about MPS). I had not made the switch to true bleach.
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  6. Back To Top    #6
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    20,303

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Quote Originally Posted by DOMO View Post
    I avoid the pool store as much as possible. When I opened, I did use a liquid shock to help jump start the process (bottle doesn't say anything about MPS). I had not made the switch to true bleach.
    Yes, you did. Pool store liquid shock and clorox bleach are the same stuff, just in different concentrations.

    Ignore the readings from the colormatching test and stick with FAS-DPD until things get sorted out.

    FC 2 and then 3... if you got that by testing with drops and it went clear, and then a minute or two later it went pink again so you resumed the test, your FC is 2.

    The high CC could be coming from ammonia, or something rotting in the bottom of the pool. Can you see anything or is it too murky? In either case, more bleach is the answer. And removing any organics by scooping or vacuuming, even if you have to do it blind.

    Consider that bleach is an oxidizer. Burning things oxidizes them. Think of it as flameless burning. If the fire isn't hot enough, you get a lot of soot and smoke. That's what CC is. Half-burned stuff. The cure to a smoking fire is more heat and more oxygen. The cure to a lot of CC is more bleach.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  7. Back To Top    #7
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    OK, thanks. So, will add bleach. Does 1 gallon sound right? I did some more cleaning of organic materials yesterday, so hope that helps. I am see the bottom but it's a little cloudy, but enough to see the bottom drain. Will post back once the bleach cycles. Thanks!
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  8. Back To Top    #8
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Hi all been a hectic week and we've had some ugly weather up here. Please see sat night's results below. Calcium looks a little better, Alkalinity still high. Waster marginally clearer (but still not perfect) after slamming with bleach. Assuming I need to keep going on that?
    Ph 7.2
    FC 3.5
    CC 7.5
    TA 150
    CYA 55
    CH 100
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  9. Back To Top    #9
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Hi again. Please see today's test results below. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!
    Ph 7.2
    FC 8
    CC 0
    TA 140
    CYA 60
    CH 125
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  10. Back To Top    #10
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    20,303

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Quote Originally Posted by DOMO View Post
    Hi again. Please see today's test results below. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!
    Ph 7.2
    FC 8
    CC 0
    TA 140
    CYA 60
    CH 125
    You're nowhere near shock level. Reread the SLAM directions. You have to keep things up until the water is clear (even after brushing) the CC is .5 or less, and you pass an overnight loss test, all at the same time.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  11. Back To Top    #11
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Thanks for the reply. I have read the SLAM directions, but I must be stupid as apparently I'm not understanding what is needed to get to shock level. I poured 3 big bottles of bleach in but that clearly wasn't enough. I don't understand what is needed to get to SLAM level in relation to my results.
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  12. Back To Top    #12
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    20,303

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Quote Originally Posted by DOMO View Post
    Thanks for the reply. I have read the SLAM directions, but I must be stupid as apparently I'm not understanding what is needed to get to shock level. I poured 3 big bottles of bleach in but that clearly wasn't enough. I don't understand what is needed to get to SLAM level in relation to my results.
    Shock level for 60 CYA is 24. To raise 10000 gallons from 8 to 24 will require 237 ounces of 8.25% household bleach per poolmath. That's so close to two full 121 oz jugs that you might as well just empty both at once. In a few hours that 24 will be down a few points, and you plug in the current value with 24 as the target and add some more to keep it at 24.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  13. Back To Top    #13
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Hi. Thanks again for your help. Please see last nights results after dropping 2 bottles of bleach in the night before. How is it possible that my FC # is lower? I'm confused!!

    Also, we have been battling a yellow staining issue on our finger glass shell (have recently used Jack's Magic Blue Stuff, but no noticeable improvement. Is our Calcium # low and is it possible that is contributing to that problem?

    As always, thank you for the help!

    Ph 7.0
    FC 4.0
    CC 2
    TA 110
    CYA 60
    CH 100
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  14. Back To Top    #14
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Hi again. So here are yesterday's results. I am concerned that as I continue to dump bleach in I am not getting the FC up to SLAM level (although it has climbed slightly, but certainly not at the 24 level I need). Also, rather concerned that my Calcium level has dropped so dramatically, and it was already on the lower side at 100 previously (and we are dealing with a yellow staining issue on our FG pool shell, so thinking this needs to be addressed?). Please help!

    Ph 7.2
    FC 9.0
    CC 0
    TA 120
    CYA 65
    CH 30
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  15. Back To Top    #15
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    20,303

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    How often are you checking the FC and adding more bleach? You can easily lose half the FC to sunlight in a day, and if you're fighting algae, even faster. Don't worry ab but FC & CC during a SLAM. The rest can be fixed in a couple hours, once you've eradicated any algae. If the water is clearing up and it's still really thirsty for bleach, then you need to check the hiding places like behind lights and beneath steps and ladder rungs.

    How does the water look?
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  16. Back To Top    #16
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Thanks for the reply. Have been checking every 24-36 hrs. We don't get much algae as we're FG. No ladder rungs or hidden areas. Water is pretty clear, can see the bottom drain, but not perfectly clear as we usually get. The appearance of the water however is tainted by the yellow staining we have developed on our shell which we are trying to remove.
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  17. Back To Top    #17
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    20,303

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    I suggest you run the SLAM process exactly as described to completion. Then deal with balancing. And lastly, the acsorbic acid treatment for stains. FC has to be low to treat the stains, so if any algae remains, it will come back with a vengeance. Taking FC up to shock level once and then ignoring it is not a SLAM.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  18. Back To Top    #18
    DOMO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Rowley, MA
    Posts
    373

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Thanks. A few days ago it was recommended 2 bottles of bleach to bring to SLAM level, but it never got there. Have done that twice now at my CYA level, but haven't been able to get FC anywhere near SLAM level. On the staining, not sure what the ascorbic acid procedure is (is there a link for that)? I have tested the stains with vitamin C and the stains did not react.
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

  19. Back To Top    #19

    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Monterrey, NL, Mexico
    Posts
    492

    Re: Start Up Chemistry Results

    Quote Originally Posted by DOMO View Post
    Thanks. A few days ago it was recommended 2 bottles of bleach to bring to SLAM level, but it never got there. Have done that twice now at my CYA level, but haven't been able to get FC anywhere near SLAM level. On the staining, not sure what the ascorbic acid procedure is (is there a link for that)? I have tested the stains with vitamin C and the stains did not react.
    The main problem is that you add the 2 bottles of bleach and then recheck 24 hours later, when Slamming you need to check every 10-15 minutes. If it falls below 15 you need to add immediately more to get back up to 24, then repeat checking and adding until it does not fall. Then you can check FC every 4-6 hours. You cant just add and leave unattended a SLAM.

    Felipe
    7,500 gal Rectangular, Easytouch 8, Air+water temp sensors, Screenlogic2, IC40, intellibright5g color12v, Intelli pH, SD 70 filter w/Zeolit, Magicstream Laminars, waterfall. Raised Monolithic concrete lined with glass beads.

    In Sunny Monterrey,Mx!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •