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Thread: Rise in Salt.

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    Rise in Salt.

    I believe I know the answer to this question, but it is digging at the back of my brain, so I thought I would just ask. Is there any way that the salt levels can be increased WITHOUT adding any salt? For some reason my level went from 4000 ppm on March 6th to 4700 on April 3rd. I talked with the pool cleaning service to confirm that no salt was added by them, but don't know if it was lip service.
    32,384 gal pebble sheen pool, TritonII Tr-140 sand filter, 3 HP pump, 2 AquaCal cool/heat pumps, Raypak gas heater, RoloChem Dual ORP/Ph Controller with 3- SGS Commercial 5000 Cells, Pool temp maintained @87 degrees, semi public pool, pump runs 24/7, FAS-DPD, K-1766 with Speed Stir.

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Rise in Salt.

    How are you measuring your salt levels?


    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Rise in Salt.

    Yes. Lots of things add salt to your pool. All types of chlorine, muriatic acid, tap water and humans all add salt to your pool.
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    Re: Rise in Salt.

    pooldv..... Did not consider the human factor, as this pool is in a retirement community and the Snow Birds are here.........Joyfulnoise...... 3 diferent types of tests, pool store, test strips (by me) and SaltDip Digital Tester (by pool cleaners).
    32,384 gal pebble sheen pool, TritonII Tr-140 sand filter, 3 HP pump, 2 AquaCal cool/heat pumps, Raypak gas heater, RoloChem Dual ORP/Ph Controller with 3- SGS Commercial 5000 Cells, Pool temp maintained @87 degrees, semi public pool, pump runs 24/7, FAS-DPD, K-1766 with Speed Stir.

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Rise in Salt.

    Ok, this is likely a measurement problem. To get a true, 700ppm increase in salt would require 187lbs of salt added to a 32,000 gallon pool. This is not a chemical issue. This is a measurement issue.

    Is the pool store using a drop-based titration test? Unlikely, they usually use strips. Strips are highly unreliable and often have an error of +/-400ppm when brand new. They age and they go bad very easily.

    Digital testers are electrical conductivity meters essentially reading TDS. Unless the tester is specifically calibrated with a known standard sodium chloride solution or standard TDS solution, they can easily lose calibration. Also, an electronic meter is going to detect ALL forms of conductive ion species including the calcium ions in your pool. So unless you have accurate and independent measures of all other components of the TDS, teasing out the salt concentration is exceedingly difficult.

    You need to get a Taylor K-1766 salt test kit. It measures chloride ions (Cl-) directly and is an EXACT test. There are no interferences from other ions. It has a standard +/-200ppm tolerance for a 10mL water sample but can also be made more precise simply by testing a larger volume of water (a 25mL sample has a +/-80ppm tolerance). This is the ONLY test that I recommend for salt level measurements. Everything else is a proxy test that measures "something else" and infers the salt level from there. Even your SWGs do not accurately measure salt levels.

    Do yourself a favor and ditch all the other tests and purchase a K-1766. It's roughly $25 and you'll get 50 to 100 tests out of it before any of the reagents expire; that's more tests than you ever really need.
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: Rise in Salt.

    I totally agree with Matt. Strips are notoriously erroneous and the digital ones are too dependent on other things in the water which is difficult to account for. Do your self a favor and get a K1766, you'll be glad you did.

    Quote Originally Posted by JoyfulNoise View Post
    Ok, this is likely a measurement problem. To get a true, 700ppm increase in salt would require 187lbs of salt added to a 32,000 gallon pool. This is not a chemical issue. This is a measurement issue.

    Is the pool store using a drop-based titration test? Unlikely, they usually use strips. Strips are highly unreliable and often have an error of +/-400ppm when brand new. They age and they go bad very easily.

    Digital testers are electrical conductivity meters essentially reading TDS. Unless the tester is specifically calibrated with a known standard sodium chloride solution or standard TDS solution, they can easily lose calibration. Also, an electronic meter is going to detect ALL forms of conductive ion species including the calcium ions in your pool. So unless you have accurate and independent measures of all other components of the TDS, teasing out the salt concentration is exceedingly difficult.

    You need to get a Taylor K-1766 salt test kit. It measures chloride ions (Cl-) directly and is an EXACT test. There are no interferences from other ions. It has a standard +/-200ppm tolerance for a 10mL water sample but can also be made more precise simply by testing a larger volume of water (a 25mL sample has a +/-80ppm tolerance). This is the ONLY test that I recommend for salt level measurements. Everything else is a proxy test that measures "something else" and infers the salt level from there. Even your SWGs do not accurately measure salt levels.

    Do yourself a favor and ditch all the other tests and purchase a K-1766. It's roughly $25 and you'll get 50 to 100 tests out of it before any of the reagents expire; that's more tests than you ever really need.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
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    Re: Rise in Salt.

    While I do agree that the Taylor K-1766 test kit, that I recieved this morning, is a more acurate testing method, the level of salt is the same as the other 3 tests, 4800ppm. I still can not figure how the water had a rise of 700 to 800ppm in salt, in 1 month. Yes, the bather load is more, but that is alot of sweat from these Snow Birds, coupled with the fact that filter is backwashed 5 out of 7 days. Other readings are great, FC 7.8, CC .0, Ph 7.3, Alk 80, Cal Hardness 160 and Cya 40 and yes I use Fas-DPD.
    32,384 gal pebble sheen pool, TritonII Tr-140 sand filter, 3 HP pump, 2 AquaCal cool/heat pumps, Raypak gas heater, RoloChem Dual ORP/Ph Controller with 3- SGS Commercial 5000 Cells, Pool temp maintained @87 degrees, semi public pool, pump runs 24/7, FAS-DPD, K-1766 with Speed Stir.

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    Re: Rise in Salt.

    With all that backwashing I would say someone added salt and didn't admit it. If the SWG is happy then it shouldn't take too long for it to be lowered.

    Get a list of all the chems that the service is adding, how often, and the approximate amount of each chem.
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