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Thread: CSI

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    Paul & Crystal's Avatar
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    CSI

    Could someone please help me understand this section of the pool math page...am I supposed to be testing for something here? Thanks!

    CSI Calcite Saturation Index - requires pH, TA, CH, CYA, Temp, uses Borate, Salt
    Less than -0.6 is suggestive of problems for plaster, tile, stone, and pebble pools.
    Greater than 0.6 is suggestive of problems for all pools.
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    My Pool Thread: Old School Pool

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: CSI

    After you enter all your test results PoolMath will calculate your CSI for you. If it is out of range post some test results and we can help.

    More here, Pool School - Calcium Scaling
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    Paul & Crystal's Avatar
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    Re: CSI

    Thanks! I will check that out.
    60K 53 X 23 X 3'-10' IG Grecian Concrete aka "The Beast"
    TF100 XL with Speed Stir
    Dolphin M500 aka "The Beast Master"
    Sta Rite Max E Pro 2 HP - Hayward Pro Series Sand Filter S310T.
    My Pool Thread: Old School Pool

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    Paul & Crystal's Avatar
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    Re: CSI

    Mine says -0.03...-0.19...what do you think?
    60K 53 X 23 X 3'-10' IG Grecian Concrete aka "The Beast"
    TF100 XL with Speed Stir
    Dolphin M500 aka "The Beast Master"
    Sta Rite Max E Pro 2 HP - Hayward Pro Series Sand Filter S310T.
    My Pool Thread: Old School Pool

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    Re: CSI

    Generally speaking, the target for CSI is to keep it very near zero. While your CH test result tells you how much calcium is in the water. The CSI tells you if it will stay in the water, or if the CSI is on the positive side (over about +0.6) will precipitate as scale on the pool surface. On the other hand, if the CSI is too far on the negative side the water will actually pull calcium out of your plaster and tile grout damaging the pool.

    Your CSI levels are fine. The acceptable range, per PoolMath is between -0.60 and +0.60. I generally shoot for between zero and -0.30.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, H400 & Heliocol Solar, Dolphin S-300, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit, Smart Home/Alexa pool control

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: CSI

    I agree with chief. Your CSI is great. -0.6 to + 0.6 is fine. I prefer -0.3 to 0 for saltwater pools to help reduce scaling in the SWG cell.
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    Re: CSI

    Was researching this a little tonight and came across this topic. My CSI is currently -.81. These are my very consistent test results:
    FC 5.0
    CC 0.0
    pH 7.5
    TA 70
    CYA 60
    Salt 3300
    Borates 50

    I can do some sensitivity analysis with pool math but was wondering which of theses results would you guys modify
    and by how much?
    Tega Cay, SC
    2016 build 16x32 polymer IG-Speck BaduMV 2.4 hp variable speed pump-individually run 2" plumbing-4 returns-1 skimmer-Doheny Discovery robot-
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    Re: CSI

    Quote Originally Posted by GamecockTim View Post
    Was researching this a little tonight and came across this topic. My CSI is currently -.81. These are my very consistent test results:
    FC 5.0
    CC 0.0
    pH 7.5
    TA 70
    CYA 60
    Salt 3300
    Borates 50

    I can do some sensitivity analysis with pool math but was wondering which of theses results would you guys modify
    and by how much?
    What's the CH? And how do your numbers compare with the suggested range Pool School - Water Balance for SWGs ?
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
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    Re: CSI

    What is your pool surface? Negative CSI is of most concern to those with plaster surfaces.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, H400 & Heliocol Solar, Dolphin S-300, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit, Smart Home/Alexa pool control

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    Re: CSI

    Sorry, CH is 150. Pool surface is vinyl.
    Tega Cay, SC
    2016 build 16x32 polymer IG-Speck BaduMV 2.4 hp variable speed pump-individually run 2" plumbing-4 returns-1 skimmer-Doheny Discovery robot-
    jetted bench-Pentair Clean and Clear Plus 420 cartridge filter-Circupool RJ60+ SWG-Hotspot FPH heater

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    Re: CSI

    Richard, side by side comparison: my pool/ swg balance

    FC 5.0/4-6
    CC 0.0/0.0
    PH 7.5/7.2-7.8
    TA 150/50-300
    CH 150/50-300
    CYA 60/70-80
    SALT 3300/3200-3400
    BORATES 50/30-50

    CSI -.81/-.6 TO +.6
    I know the negative CSI is ok for vinyl pools, but is this ideal for my SWG or pool metals (ladder, etc)
    Tega Cay, SC
    2016 build 16x32 polymer IG-Speck BaduMV 2.4 hp variable speed pump-individually run 2" plumbing-4 returns-1 skimmer-Doheny Discovery robot-
    jetted bench-Pentair Clean and Clear Plus 420 cartridge filter-Circupool RJ60+ SWG-Hotspot FPH heater

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    Re: CSI

    I do not think your CSI is a concern for the SWG or ladder. If you are inclined to adjust, raise your CH a little or keep your pH around 7.8. Not sure about your fill water or how much rain you get. I have a plaster pool and would just keep my pool closer to 7.8. Adding CH would be last resort. Not much rain this year and my CH has gone from 250 to 425 in 4 months via fill water.


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    Re: CSI

    Jagger,
    My fill water has a CH of about 50. Which is a good thing I suppose.
    Tega Cay, SC
    2016 build 16x32 polymer IG-Speck BaduMV 2.4 hp variable speed pump-individually run 2" plumbing-4 returns-1 skimmer-Doheny Discovery robot-
    jetted bench-Pentair Clean and Clear Plus 420 cartridge filter-Circupool RJ60+ SWG-Hotspot FPH heater

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    Re: CSI

    Quote Originally Posted by GamecockTim View Post
    Jagger,
    My fill water has a CH of about 50. Which is a good thing I suppose.
    Very jealous...if it was not 90+ everyday I would be tempted find an attachment to fill from my indoor faucets and throw softened water in their occasionally


    Free form 17X30. 14,500 Gal. Pentair sand filter and 1.5 hp pump. Aqua-Rite SWCG. TF-100 Test Kit w/Speed Stir

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    Re: CSI

    Quote Originally Posted by GamecockTim View Post
    Sorry, CH is 150. Pool surface is vinyl.
    o

    So are we saying CSI is not a concern for vinyl pools in the same way that CH levels is not a concern for vinyl pools.
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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: CSI

    Quote Originally Posted by jgofnj View Post

    So are we saying CSI is not a concern for vinyl pools in the same way that CH levels is not a concern for vinyl pools.
    I don't think anybody said that. Scaling is a concern for all pools, more here, Pool School - Calcium Scaling
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    Re: CSI

    Quote Originally Posted by jagger2005 View Post
    Very jealous...if it was not 90+ everyday I would be tempted find an attachment to fill from my indoor faucets and throw softened water in their occasionally
    On a previous Pool, I connected my auto fill to soft water. This dramatically reduced my CH climb.
    19204 Gallon L Shape with a 10X10 2nd Step Baja Ledge. Intellichlor IC-40, IntellipH, Cartridge Filter, Pentair Heater/Chiller (Heat Pump). Tons of Deck with Deck Jets. Construction Complete 6/5/17.

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    Re: CSI

    High CSI can cause calcium to precipitation on any pool surface as scale. Low CSI can cause the water to become corrosive to plaster and grout as it draws the calcium out of those surfaces. In a vinyl lined pool there is no plaster surface to damage. The vinyl is not effected since there is no calcium there to be had.

    So high CSI is of concern in all pools. Low CSI not a concern in vinyl lined pools.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, H400 & Heliocol Solar, Dolphin S-300, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit, Smart Home/Alexa pool control

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    Re: CSI

    Thanks Chief! So you would let a -.081 CSI ride in my Vinyl pool?
    Tim
    Tega Cay, SC
    2016 build 16x32 polymer IG-Speck BaduMV 2.4 hp variable speed pump-individually run 2" plumbing-4 returns-1 skimmer-Doheny Discovery robot-
    jetted bench-Pentair Clean and Clear Plus 420 cartridge filter-Circupool RJ60+ SWG-Hotspot FPH heater

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: CSI

    Yes.
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