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Thread: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

  1. Back To Top    #1

    Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    This will either be a lot of fun, or you'll all be lamenting my joining this forum shortly!

    The case: Help build a 20x40 pool
    The characters: 41 year old homemaker who is a do it yourself kind of person (did a 90k remodel/finishing project for 40k and a lot of hard work...I tiled, stained, plumbed, and loads more) I learned a lot during that remodel and am almost foolish enough to think that I might can sub out the pool...but 75% is leaning towards choosing a pool builder. My husband, working his tail off to pay for this project as he did with the house remodel ...he'd rather work than pick up a trowel.
    Uses: Mostly family use/lap swimming/summer swimming lessons/future foster child summer camp...so we might have high traffic for 4-6 weeks of the summer.

    I'm limited on space, will add pictures....so I can't do much in terms of free from....standard rectangle/grecian/roman type.

    Here are my questions:

    vinyl or gunite (no one does pebble tec finishes around here...so diamondbrite or quartz?)
    If I go with vinyl, is tru-tile worth it in terms of extending the life of the liner since it will not be exposed?

    Depth: I would just like to go from 3.5-6.5 but fear kids may dive and liability...but then again the deeper 8.5 means more struggle in the deep end as far as younger kids..our children are 10, 11, 14.

    Pool requests...deep end swimout, largest entry steps possible if going vinyl...two LED lights, 3 water jets...no spa, no heater.

    Equipment needs...Jandy or Hayward? What is Intelliflow and do I need it? 2 inch pipes v. 1.5 pipes...??

    Plan on putting in a cabana so the equipment can be stored and have storage for pool toys...hoping a 10x12 would suffice, plan on building it ourselves...replace existing farm fence with privacy vinyl (will install ourselves as well...any manufacturers you recommend?)

    The north side of the pool will need to be non accessible, (butts up against the vinyl fence and horses on the other side..don't want kids mixing with both or encouraging the horses!) plan on putting the 3 aqua jets on that side with river rock filling in that whole length of the pool...or if anyone else has design ideas that might work there...only 2-3 feet to work with between fence and pool.

    Getting quotes right now on gunite and vinyl...they all seem so high compared to prices I see in other areas....I know I don't look like I'm made of money, and I hate playing the bargain game...that's what happened with my house remodel (full kitchen demolition including taking a wall out and adding bathroom/replaced all flooring in house/added 1200 sq. feet in open attic) when I got the quotes I balked and said I'll do it myself! It raised the value of my house by 95k!! Only cost me 40k, but contractors wanted 90 to do the work.

    Is one vinyl manufacturer better than the other (Tara, Jafco, etc.) and would upgrading ml's on sides of pool extend longevity of liner? Polymer v. steel..are some manufacturers known for better grade steel? Pacific v. Fort Wayne seem to be in my area...

    Here are the shots of the house...








    I'm game for anything, just need the size to stay 20x40...I had a design for gunite, can't find it, but it's just a rectangle with two swimouts in the deep end and the entry steps are on the corner...

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Casey's Avatar
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    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    If you're going to do a DIY <I am too>, I'd go with vinyl.

    waste, a very good man/member here, has started a few threads on DIY steel walled pools. You can find them a few pages back. I was, as a matter of fact going to bump them all today. Maybe I'll just go ahead and do that.

    As far as liners go, the higher the mil the stronger they are.

    Good luck and please do keep us posted! I'm gonna go raise those threads so you too can take a peek! 8) There, all done. Now they're all together and right below this thread. 8)

    I'm going to go re-read them myself!
    I'd bet you my bikini you'll never get TFP water from a pool store!

    24' Sharkline Venture De Filter

  3. Back To Top    #3

    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    Thanks so much, I'm about to dive in and read all those!! I am fascinated by the Swede's concrete pool, but I don't have his biceps and worry my project would take too long..I homeschool the kids, run a scouting troop, teach 2 languages, and a writing class...when I did the remodel on the house, 5 months of intense reading was what the kids got for school..they are incredibly well-read but I need to focus on their math and science...building a pool would be interesting from a Chemistry/physics perspective but don't know how that would correlate to standardized testing!
    Pool builders will hate me b/c I am very detail oriented and a little knowledge can ruin a relationship!

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    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    Hi , Just got done building mine in N.E. Pa. 16x32 be glad to give ya any tips. chuck

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    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    Chuck! That would be great!! Here are my questions (hopefully they will help someone out in the future)

    1. Which framing did you buy? Steel/Polymer/Concrete/Gunite? If you went with liner pool...how did you decide which manufacturer had the best quality? I really want made in USA.. so much now is being made in the Far East and you never know what materials they really use..that drywall story in Florida makes me think twice about where things are made..
    2. Which pool equipment did you decide on? Did you get any discounts paying cash or begging?
    3. Did you sub out the pool deck? Concrete? Pavers?
    4. Lastly, so I won't bug you too much, what do you know NOW that you wish you'd known when you started your project...

    Oh sorry, one more, how long did it take you to complete the project?

    Thanks!
    Tara

  6. Back To Top    #6

    In the Industry

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    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    What area are you located Tara, sorry if I missed it. The intelliflos are very nice and energy efficient pumps, but they are about 2 times more expensive. I think that they pay themselves off well.
    Matthew
    Involved in the pool and spa industry
    Pittsburgh, PA

  7. Back To Top    #7

    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    I'm just at the border of AL and TN near Huntsville...I would rather sub out the pool myself and use the savings on upgrading the equipment...I just wasn't sure if the Intelliflo was designed for spa/pool combinations or if it was overkill on just a pool...I know that size of the pool affects what kind of pump, but if it saves me money over 5 years that's great!
    Tara

  8. Back To Top    #8

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    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    there is a lot of research into that and it seems that it does. It also makes tweeking water feature flow rates possible and extremely easy. Its worth looking into. My favorite filter is the clean and clear 520. This is from pentair as well. If you buy an intelliflo, clean and clear 520, and then either a pentair salt cell or heater, master temp is great, they upgrade you to a 3 year warranty for buying 3 major items at the same time.
    Matthew
    Involved in the pool and spa industry
    Pittsburgh, PA

  9. Back To Top    #9
    reallytiredteacher's Avatar
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    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    We are knee-deep in building our own inground with vinyl liner. It's 18x36, 8 feet deep and we are trying to get the concrete floor in, but here in So Missouri, it has rained EVERY SINGLE DAY for the last 2 WEEKS!!! That makes working pouring concrete IMPOSSIBLE.

    We purchased a HYDRA brand polymer kit from Royal Swimming Pool in Memphis TN. (http://www.royalswimmingpool.com) Kits start about $6,000 and go up from there. We searched everywhere and that was the best deal we could find in what seemed like a quality kit. We chose Polymer walls over steel because the steel can rust/bend and the polymer is more duarble in wet climates. (I googled to see pros and cons of each) Royal offered a cash discount of 3% of our entire purchase when we sent a bank wire to pay (that was over $200 for us). The freight shipping was included at no extra charge. I am pleased with their knowledge and helpfullness, even after the sale. The kit came with 2 different installation books/instructions and a DVD.

    We only hired someone to excavate/level and then concrete co to bring out the various mixes we needed. Other than that, my husband and myself along with our 3 children (8, 13, and 16) and their two teenage boyfriends (who have definitely earned "free pool passes") have done ALL the work. We will have a total of $10K into this pool which includes the inground cleaner, diving board, LED pool light show, wrap around concrete deck with extra long ends for lounging/entertaining, and a wooden privacy fence. Our price quotes were $20-$22K to have this fully installed and that did not include the concrete deck or fence, diving board cost, or any of that stuff. Everyday I remind myself several times that we are saving $12,000 by doing this ourselves!!!

    The biggest task thus far is shaping the slopes and getting the angles like they need to be to lay the 2" of sand/portland mix on top of them to be a base for the drop in liner. Tons of hand work (picks, hoes, rakes, and shovels..oh my!) and several days of hot work since the pool site is naturally in full sun! The sides were easy to put up and level with a transit, they were then concreted in with the steps.

    Our vinyl liner is 28mil which is one of the thickest ones...20mil are the thinner ones. Royal Swimming Pool had tons of liner choices. Not sure if it's made in US. I bought my diving board elsewhere...more spring, better quality. I always shop around to get the best stuff at the lowest prices. I am happy with our kit purchase. If the weather would cooperate, this project would've taken 2 weeks max...prob about 10 full days of work from initial ground-breaking to liner and filling with water. But with our big, honkin rains everyday this project is approaching it's third week! Guess what...forecast says RAIN again tomorrow!!!


    Hope this helps....I have pics, but thus far they are not pretty and consist of just what I call the "Pool Hole" which is framed and still in need of interior/floor concrete.

    Don't mean to scare you...just so sick of this rain that is slowing us down. We'll hang in there are should be swimming next week.
    22K gal IG Vinyl 18'x36' rectangle (Hydra Pool Kit, Homebuilt DIY Spring09) 8' deep end
    Aqua Genie (No Main Drain, No Separate Returns), Hayward 1.5hp Pump, 24" sand filter & 2" Pipes, Jandy WaterColors LED Light, Flyte DeckII/FibreDive Board

    :sun: Added for 2010~ SWG CompuPool CPSC36, "The Pool Cleaner 2x" suction cleaner, PICS of our DIY build, and our DIY Lime Green SLIDE refinishing project!

  10. Back To Top    #10

    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    Wow, you are one reallytired teacher!! I am awed by your CAN DO attitude!! It's folks like you that make me say "NO!" to those pool builders...I fully respect them and know they would save me a lot of angst, but what's life without a little angst? I think the next week will bring you some sunny days, the air feels much better and not so sticky, so I predict at least 5 days so you can pour that concrete...
    The savings are amazing, what pool equipment are you using?? I'm guessing their quote is coming in at 40k...we'll see..if they could get it under 30k I'd let them build, but I've priced all the parts and come up with about 18k for everything..well maybe 2k more for fencing...so that 10k could be used for much better purposes..like building my training arena for our summer camps!

    PLEASE post pictures of your build! Can't wait to see!!
    Tara

  11. Back To Top    #11
    reallytiredteacher's Avatar
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    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    Our pool size and equipment is at the bottom of this post in my signature. We got good quality, namebrand equipment, but nothing too fancy (and pricey which goes along with it!) Our pool is now mainly for our kids and their friends along with our entertaining/gatherings in the summer. We will use it for regulation size Basketball Goal, Volleyball, Diving Board, Slide, and all that teenage pool stuff.

    Our plan is when the kids go to college, etc(6-8 years)...then we'll redo the basic concrete/coping and have the surface refinished, colored, stamped, etc...maybe add rock and waterfalls. Right now it's our family project and the kids can't wait to stamp their handprints into a corner of the concrete deck as the project is finished. We have all been in the "pool hole" (as it's not only affectionately known but also loathed since this project has drug out due to Torential Rains daily for the last two weeks!) picking and scraping the clay dirt to get our slopes just right...even my 8 yr old has picked up rocks and help spread concrete!

    My question that I posted earlier is asking if it's best to use 1 1/2" pipe or 2" sch40 PVC when plumbing the pool? I think our Hayward pump will be fine to support the larger pipes. We bought some 1 1/2" and are plumbing it tomorrow (wed June 17) so I need to switch right away if I'm going to. We are using an Aqua Genie and have been told by users that the circulation of water in the pool is so good that they only vacuum their pool every 4 to 5 weeks! You should check into that option and see if you are interested in using that rather than traditional skimmer that needs numerous returns. Larger pools use 2 Genies. Just a thought.
    22K gal IG Vinyl 18'x36' rectangle (Hydra Pool Kit, Homebuilt DIY Spring09) 8' deep end
    Aqua Genie (No Main Drain, No Separate Returns), Hayward 1.5hp Pump, 24" sand filter & 2" Pipes, Jandy WaterColors LED Light, Flyte DeckII/FibreDive Board

    :sun: Added for 2010~ SWG CompuPool CPSC36, "The Pool Cleaner 2x" suction cleaner, PICS of our DIY build, and our DIY Lime Green SLIDE refinishing project!

  12. Back To Top    #12

    Join Date
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    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    Quote Originally Posted by reallytiredteacher
    We are knee-deep in building our own inground with vinyl liner. It's 18x36, 8 feet deep and we are trying to get the concrete floor in, but here in So Missouri, it has rained EVERY SINGLE DAY for the last 2 WEEKS!!! That makes working pouring concrete IMPOSSIBLE.

    We purchased a HYDRA brand polymer kit from Royal Swimming Pool in Memphis TN. (http://www.royalswimmingpool.com) Kits start about $6,000 and go up from there. We searched everywhere and that was the best deal we could find in what seemed like a quality kit. We chose Polymer walls over steel because the steel can rust/bend and the polymer is more duarble in wet climates. (I googled to see pros and cons of each) Royal offered a cash discount of 3% of our entire purchase when we sent a bank wire to pay (that was over $200 for us). The freight shipping was included at no extra charge. I am pleased with their knowledge and helpfullness, even after the sale. The kit came with 2 different installation books/instructions and a DVD.

    We only hired someone to excavate/level and then concrete co to bring out the various mixes we needed. Other than that, my husband and myself along with our 3 children (8, 13, and 16) and their two teenage boyfriends (who have definitely earned "free pool passes") have done ALL the work. We will have a total of $10K into this pool which includes the inground cleaner, diving board, LED pool light show, wrap around concrete deck with extra long ends for lounging/entertaining, and a wooden privacy fence. Our price quotes were $20-$22K to have this fully installed and that did not include the concrete deck or fence, diving board cost, or any of that stuff. Everyday I remind myself several times that we are saving $12,000 by doing this ourselves!!!

    The biggest task thus far is shaping the slopes and getting the angles like they need to be to lay the 2" of sand/portland mix on top of them to be a base for the drop in liner. Tons of hand work (picks, hoes, rakes, and shovels..oh my!) and several days of hot work since the pool site is naturally in full sun! The sides were easy to put up and level with a transit, they were then concreted in with the steps.

    Our vinyl liner is 28mil which is one of the thickest ones...20mil are the thinner ones. Royal Swimming Pool had tons of liner choices. Not sure if it's made in US. I bought my diving board elsewhere...more spring, better quality. I always shop around to get the best stuff at the lowest prices. I am happy with our kit purchase. If the weather would cooperate, this project would've taken 2 weeks max...prob about 10 full days of work from initial ground-breaking to liner and filling with water. But with our big, honkin rains everyday this project is approaching it's third week! Guess what...forecast says RAIN again tomorrow!!!


    Hope this helps....I have pics, but thus far they are not pretty and consist of just what I call the "Pool Hole" which is framed and still in need of interior/floor concrete.

    Don't mean to scare you...just so sick of this rain that is slowing us down. We'll hang in there are should be swimming next week.
    Welcome to TFP!! (as well as you ma23peas )

    How far along are you with this? I will happily help you in any way I can with the process I've installed a 'couple' of liner pools in my time and may have a helpful hint or two 8)

    I sincerely hope that the build goes well and that you ever have a trouble free pool
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

  13. Back To Top    #13
    reallytiredteacher's Avatar
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    May 2009
    Location
    Southern Missouri
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    38

    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    We are putting in our DIY vinyl liner IG and I would love any hints for putting down the sand/portland dry mix on the floor as well as any tips on putting in the liner and how to work that to remove wrinkles.

    We're Newbies to this GREAT site as well as Newbies to IG pool installation! Live and Learn!
    22K gal IG Vinyl 18'x36' rectangle (Hydra Pool Kit, Homebuilt DIY Spring09) 8' deep end
    Aqua Genie (No Main Drain, No Separate Returns), Hayward 1.5hp Pump, 24" sand filter & 2" Pipes, Jandy WaterColors LED Light, Flyte DeckII/FibreDive Board

    :sun: Added for 2010~ SWG CompuPool CPSC36, "The Pool Cleaner 2x" suction cleaner, PICS of our DIY build, and our DIY Lime Green SLIDE refinishing project!

  14. Back To Top    #14

    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    Hello,

    I enjoyed reading your post have you tried a service that helps the ownerbuilderpools.com? They have a great book that is very helpful. Good Luck

  15. Back To Top    #15

    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    Hi Tara, As i said , ours is a 16x32. We went with a polimer kit from NationalPoolWholesale , i primarily went with this one because it was one of the only ones offering a 48in wall rather than the standard 42in. We only went 6ft deep but made an extended shallow end // 14 ft . Hired a friend to dig, we went from grass to dug and pool erected in 1 day, then the project slows down. The best advice is use a lazer level , we got within a quarter inch of level, and now with water in it the water line looks perfect. I had a pool guy do my bottom sand and portland , but i had it shaped perfect for him. Send me your email and ill send ya a bunch of pics of the process. Chuck

  16. Back To Top    #16
    Casey's Avatar
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    SW PA
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    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    CPETRO/CHUCK! Don't be stingy with the pics! Post them in your own thread so we can all learn from your build!
    I'd bet you my bikini you'll never get TFP water from a pool store!

    24' Sharkline Venture De Filter

  17. Back To Top    #17

    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    ma23pea,

    Last summer, as I remember, you had some real good detailed and well thought out plans for
    a pool. Just curious to know if you are going in a different direction as pool construction
    can take lots of twists and turns. Did you just not like the plans you developed and just
    decided to start over, or have I got you mixed up with another planner?

  18. Back To Top    #18

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Ayr, Ontario
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    7

    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    When I built mine I hired a bunch of guys who did this for a living. It was a friend of mine in the business and he went and got his buddies. They all came and did it on the week end. 2 Days from digging until the water went in. Concrete decking was done on another weekend. One guy did the excavation, and led the project, but I was the GM. The pool is a vinyl liner with steel walls. The sloped areas and bottom is concrete and the liner goes inside. It's a real art to putting down the smooth plaster over the concrete, so I was glad there were people who new what to do.

    If I had to do it again, I would do more research on size of plumbing lines and number of skimmers and return inlets. The other thing I would do different is that all lines would be in a larger pipe like a drain pipe. That way if you ever have an issue you can pull the lines out without digging the whole thing up. The other thing I would do different is purchase higher end accessories like vacuum heads and poles as well as the pump and filter. I couldn't stand the pump so I replaced it, with one where the lid always will come off, not one of those where the lid screws on. The pump was also too powerful for the setup and the kreepy would vibrate to fast. One addional thing I would do is not use metal edging at the top of the pool. With my design the edging is on the inside and the concrete on the outside. This causes the top edge of the metal to be exposed and it takes all of the abuse. The problem is it is powder coated white aluminium, which wears off. So I would never do that again. I would go with natural stone over hanging the pools edge or concrete.

    The pool has been in service no for 9 years, and has had the liner replaced once. Never let people use your pool when your not there (long story). Anyway the new liner is in and it is the same as the old. One continuous pattern. The pump and clorinator have also been replaced, but that is it other than the vacuum accessories.

    Life is a learning curve and building a pool is a large one. There are many, many things to consider.

    Good luck with your project.

    Walter
    2001 model 16'x26'x52" AG, buried 2 feet
    pentair sand filter
    WaterCo pump w/2 speed motor
    Intex SWG

  19. Back To Top    #19

    Join Date
    Sep 2007
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    Lafayette, Louisiana
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    Re: Help me build a 20x40 pool...

    Just going to jump in here and say you can certainly sub this out yourself if you are willing to fully educate yourself before you start and are prepared for alot of work.

    I self contracted my IG gunite pool. All is well and I'm happy I did it. I have nothing but top quality components and I know every part of this pool now. I saved somewhere in the neighborhood of $30K off what any of the local PB's would have charged for an inferior job.

    I'll chime in with any advice you might need if you decide on this route too...

    There's a link to my pool build in my signature.

    Good Luck!
    Fortune favors the well prepared

    The build...
    viewtopic.php?t=3974
    Freeform 24' x 38' IG gunite. 3 1/2' to 8' deep. 28,500 gallons. AutoPilot Total Control SWCG. Pentair Intelliflo VF. Pentair CCP520 cartridge filter. Colorlogic LED lights. Tahoe Blue Diamond Brite. 1200 sq ft stamped concrete deck.
    More details as they happen...

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