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Thread: Order of Projects?

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    Order of Projects?

    I have a TF100 test kit obtained just last year. I got it well into the swim season and then adverse weather further limited pool use so I didn't stay on top of it nearly as much. As a result, I haven't used that much of most of the chemicals.

    Are those test chemicals still good and if so, how long will they be? On that note, what is the standard use rate for a normal season? Will one season generally use up a kit's standard supply?

    thanks all.
    East Texas Piney Woods
    (more specifically N/E Texas)
    pool data:
    In ground vinyl lined
    23,500
    sand filter

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    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: "shelf life" of test kit chemicals???

    Too many variables - how the kit is stored, what kind of pool issues the users have. I'm on my second season with my kit. I got new DPD powder and toss the old stuff as it was turning blackish grey, which I read on here was bad...

    I store my kit in a dark closet in the house, in the shipping box. It should last you 2 seasons if you don't have algae or CYA adjustment issues. (i'm just about out of my CYA reagent)
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    Clearing cloudy pool?

    Hi all. I started this year with a frog pond (literally!) I have the water pretty much blue but I still have dense cloudiness.

    I am not yet completely adapted to the BBB method but am working on it. Whether for good orr ill, I don't know. But last year I had this problem and flocking took the cloud right down. So I applied flocking this year again and... nada. I can see the first step and that is it! I tested the PH per instructions and it should have been spot on.

    I did use last years test chemicals so may have got a false reading. ( I have another topic concerning the shelf life of test chemicals.) I also used two different Oto test kits (had one already when I got the TF100 kit) and they matched closely.

    I have a cartridge filtration system no more sufficient to pool size than should be. What is the best method for clearing the cloudiness, please?
    East Texas Piney Woods
    (more specifically N/E Texas)
    pool data:
    In ground vinyl lined
    23,500
    sand filter

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    reebok's Avatar
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    Re: Clearing cloudy pool?

    your test results?
    16x32 21,000 gallon in-ground exposed aggregate, 1.5hp pump, 120 sqft catridge filter, birdcage, solar panels, aquavac tigershark qc robot.

  5. Back To Top    #5

    order of projects?

    We are going to do major landscaping around the pool (currently is none). Also, we are likely going to replace the liner too.

    It seems to me the landscaping is going to stir up dust, dirt and I don't know what all. But on the other hand, it seems to me (having never witnessed it before) that a pool relining would be hard on the immediate area surrounding the pool?

    So which comes first? Do both at the same time shuffling the projects like a deck of cards???
    East Texas Piney Woods
    (more specifically N/E Texas)
    pool data:
    In ground vinyl lined
    23,500
    sand filter

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    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Order of Projects?

    Pogo, it's best to keep all your pool issue -related questions in one thread, it gets too confusing otherwise.

    You have to ask yourself if you want to go thru the expense of balancing your pool if you are just going to empty it. Is the relining the pool something you plan to tackle this year? That was not made clear.

    As for clearing your pool, this issue was discussed briefly on the two threads you started regarding your filter/pump combo, but it didn't progress to the point of discussing how to clear your pool. Did you decide to replace your filter/pump, or are you going to work with what you have?

    You should read Defeating Algae, and How to Shock your Pool in Pool School for starters.

    Without current test results, we can't give you proper advice.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    Re: Order of Projects?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pogo
    Are those test chemicals still good and if so, how long will they be? On that note, what is the standard use rate for a normal season? Will one season generally use up a kit's standard supply?
    Taylor says their stuff is good for a year. People have reported two years, sometimes more, if the kit is stored in a cool dark place. My FAS-DPD supply needs replenishing every few months because I have both a pool and separate spa, and never use the OTO test (can't distinguish the colors well enough). On the other hand testing CH once a month is still overkill and I expect those reagents to last forever.
    --paulr
    BBB "Intermediate Swimmer"
    IG plaster pool 18.5K gal, Hayward Pro-Grid DE filter, 3/4 HP Hydramax II; Polaris 380, 3/4 HP booster
    AG spa 325 gal, probably Sundance of some kind
    Water testing instructions on one page

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    Re: Order of Projects?

    Quote Originally Posted by frustratedpoolmom
    Pogo, it's best to keep all your pool issue -related questions in one thread, it gets too confusing otherwise.
    Sorry, since the questions were not specifically related to each other or the forum now posted in, I decided to disperse them. Also it seemed to me that putting 3 different things in one topic would be confusing rather than the alternative. I have found that many people won't read past the first or second issue in a single long posting and some additional comments/answers will be missed by such multiple postings. (this based on several years as a forum moderator myself)
    But it's your site/forum, so from now on I'll lump them as you prefer.

    > I'm sorry if I am slow on the uptake. I was a machinist before getting disabled, not a chemist. This stuff is completely foreign to me. Also, since becoming disabled, I am on more medications than I care to think about and they have had an impact on my comprehension or detail retention. I ask you to please bear with me. I am trying/doing the best I can.

    You have to ask yourself if you want to go thru the expense of balancing your pool if you are just going to empty it.
    We (wife & I) did consider that question. First of all, the pool is a medical asset as much as pleasure for us. In my case moreso since I really don't find swimming that much fun ever since I nearly drowned once as a kid. I had 'gone down for the third time,' as the old gag line goes, when they hauled me out.
    Secondly, we are questioning if we might get better rates on relining by doing it later in the year when these pool guys aren't so busy. In Spring they're naturally hopping.
    Third, depends upon the answer to one of the questions I've posted that are now herein and to which I do not believe we have an answer: to whit, do we want to do liner replacement or landscaping first???

    Is the relining the pool something you plan to tackle this year? That was not made clear.
    That is because it's not clear to me.
    This year? yes.
    What time this year? well, that depends in part on the answer to one of the questions I've posted that are now herein and to which I do not believe we have an answer: to whit, do we want to do liner replacement or landscaping first???
    Also, if we might get better rates on relining by doing it later in the year when these pool guys aren't so busy.
    back around to needing the pool for medical reasons, and, this just now occurred to me, that as a frog pond it is a breeding ground for mosquitoes.

    Right now we have so many issues, interviewing, carpenters, pavers, concrete people, roofers, plumbers, 'handymen,' landscapers (haven't got to them yet at all) andddd pool people, along with dealing with VA, deceased Bro-in-law's estate, farm issues and a whole lot of other things all at the same time and that with with my greatly diminished capacities and no, nothing is very clear just at the moment.
    That's what I was seeking here, some clarity... (ye-gads! a pun! Completely unintended but about now I need a little humor. )

    As for clearing your pool, this issue was discussed briefly on the two threads you started regarding your filter/pump combo, but it didn't progress to the point of discussing how to clear your pool.
    Did you decide to replace your filter/pump, or are you going to work with what you have? We're of two minds on that and not yet decided. We want to install a swg. It has been suggested that a cart filtration system would actually be better. My wife supports this view. But I'm the one who has to clean the bloody filters and am heartily sick of it (cleaning the darn thing 3-4-more times a week) and am all for a sand filter. We intend to speak to some more people about it, get more information on the subject, before making a final decision. A very likely possibility is a larger cartridge system.

    You should read Defeating Algae, and How to Shock your Pool in Pool School for starters.
    I did. It is largely oriented towards people who have sand filters, which I don't.
    I had the algae killed to the white/gray stage already and just needed to clear it out. It was suggested that flockinig was not recommended and that it could take up to a week to clean it with a sand filter (which I don't have) Under these conditions, my cartridge will clog up easily within 15-20 minutes. I can't begin to imagine how long cleaning the pool that way might take. Last year we flocked it and the stuff dropped completely, overnight (as the article mentions) and we then just vacuumed the stuff out minus the filter. Took 20 minutes to get the worst. That's what I was shooting for this year only the flock treatment didn't work completely. It lumped the stuff up just fine but it didn't drop, not over night, not in 36+ hours.
    I just wanted an opinion of my flocking malfunction. I didn't try a full water analysis since my test chemicals were, are suspect. I now fear I got a fault pH reading which would explain why my flocking didn't work anyway.

    Without current test results, we can't give you proper advice.
    I didn't try a full water analysis since my test chemicals were, are suspect. I now fear I got a fault pH reading which would explain why my flocking didn't work anyway.

    I'm going to town today and I'll get a water test at the pool store and compare results just to see what comes up, realizing the pool store might not have it right either. But we insist on working with the store manager who has many years in the pool business and at least gives the method employed here the nod if mentioned and whom I believe, is familiar with her testing equipment. If that (the equipment) is right, I cannot say.

    So, I'm sorry to have bothered y'all. I'll get my water clear and try to pick up what I can here without asking so many questions.
    Apologies too, for the length of this but didn't see any way to avoid it unless by making a number of separate replies.
    Again, sorry. I can't do any better.
    East Texas Piney Woods
    (more specifically N/E Texas)
    pool data:
    In ground vinyl lined
    23,500
    sand filter

  9. Back To Top    #9
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Order of Projects?

    I didn't mean for you to be offended.

    What appears one way to you, i.e. seperate posts, to us seems confusing and chaotic. Your posts are related, I guess I just view it differently than you.

    You also have to understand that Mods, and users who answer questions, are at this time of year, reading several hundred posts a day. It can get overwhelming. So I saw three posts in 5 minutes that I do feel, are related, and thus the comments.

    We want to help you, we don't want to make you feel bad or unwanted, and if that was what was interpreted, my apologies.

    I understand where you are coming from.

    My personal opinion is it's kind of obvious that you should tackle the landscaping first, as all that crud is just gonna mess up the pool, and any balancing work we be for naught.

    If you are planning to replace the liner this year, it seems to me to do it before you go to the time and trouble of balancing your pool. I know you want to use your pool, but being realistic about your plans, IF you can get your water clear in a reasonable amount of time, with all the work being done in the yard and the possible problems that could develop, is it worth it, as actual swim time may be minimal...

    If it were me and I do the filter cleaning, and you don't like cleaing carts, then getting a sand filter is a no brainer. Unless your wife is going to take over the cart cleaning?

    Defeating Algae is the same regardless of the type of filter, I don't think the article is geared towards one type of filter over the other. It is often recommended that cart filter owners have spare carts to continue filtration while one set is soaking/being cleaned.

    In your particular situation, cleaning the cart often is not something you want to do. Again, does it make sense to change to a sand filter, spending a few hundred dollars now on the possible chance you'll get to swim, spend lots of time and money balancing the water, only to dump all that water in a few months to replace the liner? That's a personal decision.

    Again, I did not mean to offend you and we are trying to help. But we need you to help us help you.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

  10. Back To Top    #10

    Re: Order of Projects?

    My Apologies too. For the record, I am not so much 'offended' as frustrated. Case in point. But
    "My personal opinion is it's kind of obvious that you should tackle the landscaping first, as all that crud is just gonna mess up the pool, and any balancing work we be for naught."
    I'm sorry but its not at all obvious to me. In trying to figure it out, I thought about all the disruption of the surrounding area, dirt, debris, all that yes... But... On the other hand, I don't know whats involved with replacing the liner. Do they have to spread out vinyl and lay it out all over the area immediately bordering the pool? workmen traipsing all over the areas?
    No, it was not at all obvious to me, due to my ignorance on the subject. See?

    Anyway, enough of that. I have a storm coming in and have to hurry to get you the info you need. I will conform to your posting requirements. I can do nothing about my current levels of comprehension save beg you bear with me, please.

    Whatever may be 'wise' we're going to clean the water up and go with it. It will be much better for our health- enough so to justify the cost.

    ... I retreated to the pool store yesterday for one and ran my own test this AM.
    Our water was returning to green so I doused it with chlorine. (6% 'Dollar store kind) when I took my water sample. Today the water is solid sky blue and chlorine kaput so those numbers will differ dramatically.
    Numbers-
    Pool store: .................. ours:
    FC..... 4.9ppm ............. 0 (OTO test only)
    TC..... 4.9 .................. 0
    pH..... 7.6 .................. 7.2 (consistent tested with 2 kits0
    T/A... 109ppm ............. 200
    CH.... 10ppm ............... 130/140 this discrepancy in numbers startled me so I ran it twice.
    CYA.. 5ppm ................. no reading- never clouded the dot to any extent.

    Storm is upon me so I have to post and run.

    Again, apologies for my frustration.
    East Texas Piney Woods
    (more specifically N/E Texas)
    pool data:
    In ground vinyl lined
    23,500
    sand filter

  11. Back To Top    #11
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Order of Projects?

    No, they wouldn't risk damaging the liner by laying it out on the surrounding area. They'll unfold it/spread it (whatever) in the pool.

    To clear your pool, you're gonna need the FAS-DPD chlorine test, the OTO isn't gonna suffice.

    I'd trust your CH results, its a complicated test and the pool stores probably rushed through it. Anyway, with a vinyl liner it doesn't matter much. No need to run the test again.

    TA test - which kit are you testing with? Check the drop sizes, are they uniform in size and similar to the drops of other tests? If you repeat the test, wipe the tip with a damp cloth in between drops.

    You'll need some CYA rather soon in order to keep your FC levels up, and a whole lot more bleach.

    Honestly you would be better off getting bleach from Wallyworld or Aldi, etc. as we have had lots of reports of bad bleach from Dollar Stores. You could be wasting your money getting it there.

    Follow the instructions in Defeating Algae, How to Shock your Pool, and Performing the Overnight FC Loss test.

    Did you decide to get a new filter?
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

  12. Back To Top    #12
    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Order of Projects?

    The one great thing about the OTO test is that when the OTO test reads chlorine at zero, then chlorine really is zero.

    Your CYA level is very low, so your chlorine is all getting consumed by sunlight. You need to add some CYA, aim for a level around 40 or 50.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  13. Back To Top    #13

    Re: Order of Projects?

    Quote Originally Posted by frustratedpoolmom
    No, they wouldn't risk damaging the liner by laying it out on the surrounding area. They'll unfold it/spread it (whatever) in the pool.
    Ok, I just didn't know and it was not 'obvious.'

    To clear your pool, you're gonna need the FAS-DPD chlorine test, the OTO isn't gonna suffice.
    I decided to go with the OTO since there was effectively no chlorine.

    I'd trust your CH results, its a complicated test and the pool stores probably rushed through it. Anyway, with a vinyl liner it doesn't matter much. No need to run the test again.
    o-kay

    TA test - which kit are you testing with? TF-100

    Check the drop sizes, are they uniform in size and similar to the drops of other tests? near as I could tell.
    If you repeat the test, wipe the tip with a damp cloth in between drops. Will do.

    Honestly you would be better off getting bleach from Wallyworld or Aldi, etc. as we have had lots of reports of bad bleach from Dollar Stores. You could be wasting your money getting it there. OK, can do.

    Follow the instructions in Defeating Algae, How to Shock your Pool, and Performing the Overnight FC Loss test. OK

    Did you decide to get a new filter? Hadn't completely decided. The jury is still out on getting a swg. If we do, we'll probably stay with carts but a larger system (bigger/more carts.) If we don't, we'll go a sand filter.
    You'll need some CYA rather soon in order to keep your FC levels up, and a whole lot more bleach.
    Agreed. I have some questions on the best way/amount to get to appropriate level.
    Solids-Pucks? mm-no.
    Liquid- from Wally's or pool store- right?
    Here's another question. Doesn't that granulated shock add to the CYA levels? It's been raining here all day. Since I'll have to shock the water again anyway, might I want to use those this time?
    Thanks.
    East Texas Piney Woods
    (more specifically N/E Texas)
    pool data:
    In ground vinyl lined
    23,500
    sand filter

  14. Back To Top    #14
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: Order of Projects?

    Dichlor granular chlorine will add CYA. Look for Sodium dichloro-s-triazinetirone on the active ingredient listing. Careful using it for shocking. It raises CYA very quickly, it will be easy for you to overshoot your CYA target level.

    For every 10 FC it ads 9 ppm CYA. Use the Pool Calculator's section, "Effects of Adding Chemicals" to determine how much Dichlor to add to reach your shock level and how much CYA will increase with each addition. I honestly don't know if that's the cheaper route to take, or the quicker route? Wish I had an answer for that one.

    Ok, glad you have the TF100, I wasn't sure.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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