No Available Chlorine

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Yeah... that's the downside of higher strength bleach. There's less market for it so sometimes sellers have the stock on hand for a while and if they don't store it well... it loses strength more quickly. If you check the date codes and they're not from this summer or are sitting outside and dusty... pass on them. Go with the high turnover 8.25% stuff from WalMart, Target, grocery store, etc. Pool stores usually have fresher stock of the high % stuff... just wear your ear plugs in the store or you'll walk out with $400 in likely useless chemicals.
 
Hi Scott,

I just read through your entire thread, and have a couple questions. What percent was the gallon of MA that you added to lower your pH? The 75 oz which, actually I'm seeing 74 oz, BUT from what I am seeing in POOL MATH that amount is the dry acid measurement Not the liquid.

If it was 15.7% MA your pH will be fine, and should be around 7.2ppm, (the 28.3% would put you right around 6.9ppm, and if it was the 31.45% that full gallon by my calculations would have actually lowered your pH to around 6.78 ppm all of which except the 15.7% or lower% would cause you to have too low of a pH).

(I guess the most important question is: Did you recheck the pH level again at least 30 mins after the gallon of MA was added, as I see no recheck pH level listed, but if you did, what was it at that time?)

scott802 said:
On the muratic acid to get my ph from 7.8 down to 7.2 it says add 75 oz of muratic acid. I've already added 128 oz 1 gallon so I should be fine.
Click to expand...
It was implied in this portion of the quoted comment #15 that since you'd already added more than the amount needed to lower your pH that "It should be fine" but my concern is did you actually recheck it to ensure that it Was Fine?

My goal for asking you these questions is to try to ensure you didn't accidently lower your pH too low with that extra MA addition, as that would also not be good for your pool, nor safe/comfortable for swimming.

With your FC level now being above 10ppm a pH check at this time would not read accurately it would in fact read high because of the high FC level. So if the MA used was in fact higher than 15.7% You'll need to adjust the chemicals, possibly lower the FC level to be able to do an accurate check, add Soda ash, or Borax, per Pool Math calculations to correct this issue before moving further into the SLAM process, and especially before swimming in there.

I'm sorry for any inconvenience or confusion that this may cause, but I just want to make sure everything is correct up to this point before you continue to move forward with it possibly being incorrect. Have a wonderful day :).
 
I won't lie, this is much much more difficult than I thought.
So first, I bought the TF-100 test kit but obviously it takes a bit of practice to get it right. (You don't have to be a chemist but it's not all that simple either).
The first mistake I made was adding the muratic acid and not re-checking the PH level.
The PH reading included with this test kit is difficult to interpret at best. The color variances are subtle (at best) so it's my lack of experience with all this I'm sure.

So, now I've gone and added all this liquid chlorine from Lowes. 7 of the large 128 oz containers.

I have just retested my chlorine (at least this is one test I feel comfortable with)

FC - 11.5
CC - 2.5
TC = 14

Does that seem right? After adding all that chlorine I'm nowhere close to the 31 level I need for the SLAM. Furthermore, the water looks even worse than before and is turning an ugly green murky tint.

What are my next steps now?

Thanks all
 
Also, I checked the date codes. This stuff is July 2015 and was stored in the shade in the garden section inside the warehouse.
It's one gallon 128 oz jugs and I'm assuming at this point I am going to need to add about another 7 of these to even get close to TC level of 31.
 
The water color is great!! that's what you are looking for! You need much more chlorine. It can take a number of additions before you get to the SLAM level. It all depends on what is in the water and how accurate your pool gallons estimation is.
 
To answer the other questions, the muratic acid I used says 128 oz 31.45% it's the stuff I bought at Leslie's pool store. Nasty and strong stuff.

What now?

- - - Updated - - -

I guess what I'm wondering is if I completely need to start this whole painful process over again since I didn't recheck the ph level, or do I need to start an entirely different process to neutralize the chlorine etc etc etc
 
Hold a WHITE piece of paper behind the tester. It makes the variations more noticeable. Now that I've said that; there are some folks who like a different color. Find what works best for you. Remember, it's a comparison so as long as you have the same background on everything the match will be valid.
 

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OUCH, and Oh pooo, that was what I was concerned about.

To answer your question: No, you don't have to start all over. We can try to get it fixed now that we know there's a problem in there that needs to be fixed because of the error at the beginning.

I want to check on a couple things so I don't instruct you incorrectly on how to fix the issue, and I'll get back with you. :).

Possibly in the mean time one or more of our Experts here will also chime in on how they would go about correcting it too.

I hope this helps, and have a nice day.
 
Ok after speaking to others who are much smarter than myself, which sometimes I feel equals about everyone LOL. Per Our site Admin Leebo: Paraphrasing: It was suggested that your best plan of action would be to let your FC drop to below 10ppm. You then need to recheck your pH level, adjust the pH properly to around 7.0-(7.2) ppm, and then resume your SLAM at that point.

The reason the pH can be an issue with all the extra MA added is that it may in fact actually be lower than that and that could be an issue as it could cause damage to your pool equipment because of it, and none of us want to see that happen so if you get the pH fixed you can ensure the pH won't be causing potential damage along the way.

I hope this helps, and I hope your levels aren't too high yet, so you'll be closer to below 10ppm for your recheck. Sorry for the inconvenience :(. Have a wonderful day. :)

EDIT- Per another one of our Experts here James W. Paraphrasing: The pH will raise itself some along the way too because CO2 (Carbon Dioxide) would increase because of the low pH level which would cause off gassing, the chlorine adds, aeration, etc. would all also somewhat increase the pH level as well. So the level could be corrected already by the other things going on, or being added to your pool.
So you may not need to do anything, but assure that it is now within range, and then you can just move on. :)
 
Couldn't I just add some of that chlorine neutralizer to the water to speed up the process, to get my chlorine level low enough that I could retest the ph level?
I'm definitely not smart enough to know what that is, but I know my local pool store sells it.;)
I sure hope I didn't cause my own problems, I've added a lot of ascorbic acid in the last month trying to get rid of continuous staining of the vinyl liner - metal stains. The ascorbic acid clears it up but keeps coming back. I assume that ascorbic acid has no affect on chlorine levels though.

sorry for all the questions! you all have been incredibly helpful. I suppose this whole process will become easier with time, but it's certainly not simple by any means.

- - - Updated - - -

At this point I will wait and see how to get the chlorine level low enough so I can set the ph properly before I continue to add chlorine.
Thanks again
 
Ascorbic acid neutralizes chlorine. If you have excess Ascorbic acid in the water, there will be a residual chlorine demand to overcome it. Typically if you do an AA treatment, you need to follow up with a metal sequestrant or else the metal stains will return once the AA is fully oxidized by the chlorine.


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I wouldn't add anything to it to decrease the chlorine, the sun, algae/organics, etc. will take care of it for you.

So, just stop adding bleach and, let it drop on it's own. Keep checking the levels every few hours, and hopefully you're not too far up the ladder with your Fc level yet, so it shouldn't take long to drop it back down to around 9ppm, so you can recheck the pH level, and adjust it if needed at that time. Then once that's done you can start hitting it hard again with the bleach to raise those levels back up to Shock level, and complete your SLAM.

I noticed earlier today you posted that your FC was at 11.5 ppm, so hopefully by tomorrow it will drop down enough to be able to do the pH check, and then you'll be back, and rolling full steam ahead. I personally hope when you are able to retest the pH that, as JamesW mentioned (as paraphrased above) that the pH is back in the range you need it to be already. That way you won't have to worry about adjusting it yet you will be assured that the low pH will not be a potential issue along the way.

Here is a link that might help explain the effects of chlorine from AA that might be of interest to you, and might help shine some light on your questions. http://www.troublefreepool.com/threads/22830-Chlorine-Demand-from-Ascorbic-Acid-Treatment

Also, there is no need to apologize for asking any question you have because that's why we are all here is to learn, and to help each other, so if you have a question just ask away. :). I hope this helps. Have a nice night :).
 
I too wouldn't add anything to "help" the FC drop. Very strong odds say your pH level is just fine and you will be able to continue right along with your SLAM. The issue here is that we don't have even a "guess" as what your pH level is after adding a good bit of acid to help lower the pH levels. IF your pH is where we're guessing it is then you shouldn't have any issues. IF however we are wrong and it's lower, then there's a good chance you're slowly damaging your liner, various seals in the pump, and a handful of other issues. The thing here is simply too many IF's that simply can be eliminated by a set of test results to assist us.

What is your current chlorine level??
 
How soon after you added chlorine did you test?If you are fighting algae, you should test your FC about an hour after you add the chlorine. The FC can fall quickly if it's consumed by algae. It may seem like you never reached your target, but you might have and it fell quickly. Adding and testing frequently helps you gain ground faster. (The M in Maintain.)
 
Good Morning all,
New test results as of Saturday morning 09/26 8:30 am CT using the T-100 test kit. Only thing I didn't test again right now is CYA. The speed stirrer is a great help.

FC = 1.0
CC = 1.5
TC = 2.5

Ph = 7.2 (matches exactly)

TA=80

water is fairly clear but has a green tint.

Should I continue with the SLAM and add more chlorine at this point? It seems that I should. I have NO idea where all the chlorine went to just overnight. I thought all the CYA in the water should prevent loss.

To be certain I am going to retest the CYA level and will keep this group posted.

Thank you!
 

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