Ok I am a blank page- we are getting a back yard pool for the first time- need as much advice as I can get

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DonFant said:
I have not bought anything yet. This will be a Self-install with the help of my 2 sons-in-law's. I'm looking to buy a
12' x 21' x 54" Saltwater Titan Oval Pool from ThePoolFactory.com : An Oval Uni-Bead Beach Haven Liner 40 Guage, AquaPro High Pro DE 72 D.E. filter 2HP Speed pump 2 year warranty,
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I like DE filters. They provide the finest size filtration out of sand, cartridge, or DE. They are little more work however. I see you are in VA. I'm not sure what your swim season is going to be, for me in NJ, one charge of DE lasts me the season. I bump my filter whenever pressure indicates it is needed. At the end of the season, I break down the entire filter, clean everything, and store it for the winter. When it comes time to open in the spring, I charge it with DE, and that lasts me through the next season.
DonFant said:
Hayward Aqua TrolRJ Salt Chlorine Generator System,
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Just be aware that an RJ unit is a RETURN JET unit. That means it does not have a flow switch, and therefore needs to be installed just before the return jet in a vertical position. This is so if your pump were to stop and water was to stop flowing, gas would still vent from the generator out of your jet. Do not install an RJ unit in a horizontal run of pipe. On that note, I would consider installing hard pipe instead of hoses.

DonFant said:
Lacus Wide-Mouth Above Ground Thru Wall Skimmer & return Fitting with a Stainless Steel panel. I'm considering a Heater-? SwimSmart Plug-in 110 Volt 40K BTU Electric Heat Pump. A Multi-Color LED Pool Return Light w/Remote Control, a Confer Step1X with outside Ladder.
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What light are you looking at? If it is an Aqualuminator model, I would stay away from it.

DonFant said:
I have already taken care of the building permit in my County, and I am having an electrician come out for an estimate.
I've got to till up a portion of the site, but no more than a foot deep at the highest side.
I am wide open for help/suggestions/ critical or not, I just want to do the best I can the First time.
Is my list missing anything? Too much? Not enough? What about Salt and Chemicals, and Cleaners, and Pool Robots that clean the bottom? Lots of stuff huh? I really appreciate your insight and opinions.
I've read that a SWG should be I guess big enough to run 2 times the volume of the Pool?
I must admit, it seems like a lot of stuff. All I want is quality equipment at a reasonable price for a 12'x21'x54" above ground pool.i
I am seeking advice; I may not go with a heater due to the price. I still have to pay for an electrician :)
If any of these items above seem to be over kill or not, please feel free to give me your thoughts, also I'm going to need helpful ideas on how to add Salt, Chemicals, etc. Wow! Maybe a membership is in order :) :) :)
Thank you all!!
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Heaters are nice, especially in the colder areas - they help to extend the seasons when the nights get cooler but the days are still warm I don't have one, but then I would need a big one for my pool, likely propane. I use a solar cover and it does make a difference.

Read the info in pool school to find out what you need. In a nutshell you will need chlorine. It has to be free of any additives. Bleach used to be great, but now it all seems to have various things in it (fragrances, thickners/anti splash, chloromax stuff, etc). You can get pool chlorine or liquid shock at a pool store or many big box stores. You will need CYA. CYA stops the sun from burning off all of your chlorine in a matter of minutes. It may be called CYA, or cyanuric acid, or stabilizer. It comes in liquid or granular forms. Liquid is if you have a lot of cash you need to get rid of. You will need acid to adjust pH down, muriatic acid is the preferred choice. Dry acid adds other things to your water. Baking soda will raise pH if that is what you need to do.

If you are installing a SWGC then you will need salt, but that can wait until you get the pool under control with bleach. You will want to use bleach to get your pools chlorine up before you start relying on the SWGC.

You will need a pole that can reach the middle of your pool, a vacuum hose, a vacuum, a skimmer, and maybe a leaf rake (you can use a leaf rake as a skimmer, and maybe a skimmer as a leaf rake, depending on how many leaves reach the bottom of your pool). Robots are nice, but not necessary. I have one, and it does save me time.

One thing you do want is a good test kit, TF Test Kits is a site sponsor and also has great prices as well.
 
phonedave said:
has great prices as well.
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+1.

The Taylor k2006 is 2.7X smaller than the TF100 for the same money.

The Taylor K2006C is sized wrong for us and you'll throw out 2/3 of the CH and TA tests while running out of FC tests. And it has no stirring device ($45). The TFpro wins hands down for the same money.

And either kit comes in a salt version with a $10 savings for bundling, making them even better values than their Taylor counterparts
 
VA season runs June through September, with warm water only in July and August -- IF you use a bubble cover to capture the sun heat. That's a lot of work for essentially two months of pool time, which typically coincides when you will be away on your vacations a fair bit. So... a heater is a must for full enjoyment in this region. Since I have a soft-side pool, I have to use a solar heater that runs on a separate water circuit. But with your hard sided pool, you can opt for something better. A heat pump option can extend the season April - October without breaking the bank on operation costs. A gas line is the cheapest to operate but requires professional installation and digging deep for the gas lines. Pure electric is the cheapest to install but the highest operations cost. Works fine for areas in the south where they barely need the heater but for us in VA, you will be running up the bill.

Even if you don't install it now, figure out your plan and make certain that the electrician lays out the circuit needed to support it. That might mean a new power circuit for your breaker, adequately sized, a different gauge electric wire in the conduit and in the outlets by the pool. The good people at Raypak have a calculator -- and when I called them they spent a full hour on the phone helping me figure out options. It's worth doing the research now.

In addition, since your pool pump is not double-insulated, make certain that you also build a water bonding system, making sure all systems are connected with a copper wire to avoid a difference in static voltage built between components. Search "Bonding" on this forum, there is a lot of information. Some electricians know about it, some, who dont do pools, don;t. For some reason, the reference page on the PoolSchool seems to have been removed / moved. A hard-sided metal pool will be significantly easier to bond than a soft sided pool. But it HAS to be done.
 
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ioinva said:
In addition, since your pool pump is not double-insulated, make certain that you also build a water bonding system, making sure all systems are connected with a copper wire to avoid a difference in static voltage built between components. Search "Bonding" on this forum, there is a lot of information. Some electricians know about it, some, who dont do pools, don;t. For some reason, the reference page on the PoolSchool seems to have been removed / moved. A hard-sided metal pool will be significantly easier to bond than a soft sided pool. But it HAS to be done.
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It has nothing to do with if your pump is double insulated or not. All pools need to be bonded. Not only is it code almost everywhere, it also keeps you from, you know, dying.
 
ioinva said:
VA season runs June through September, with warm water only in July and August -- IF you use a bubble cover to capture the sun heat. That's a lot of work for essentially two months of pool time, which typically coincides when you will be away on your vacations a fair bit. So... a heater is a must for full enjoyment in this region. Since I have a soft-side pool, I have to use a solar heater that runs on a separate water circuit. But with your hard sided pool, you can opt for something better. A heat pump option can extend the season April - October without breaking the bank on operation costs. A gas line is the cheapest to operate but requires professional installation and digging deep for the gas lines. Pure electric is the cheapest to install but the highest operations cost. Works fine for areas in the south where they barely need the heater but for us in VA, you will be running up the bill.

Even if you don't install it now, figure out your plan and make certain that the electrician lays out the circuit needed to support it. That might mean a new power circuit for your breaker, adequately sized, a different gauge electric wire in the conduit and in the outlets by the pool. The good people at Raypak have a calculator -- and when I called them they spent a full hour on the phone helping me figure out options. It's worth doing the research now.

In addition, since your pool pump is not double-insulated, make certain that you also build a water bonding system, making sure all systems are connected with a copper wire to avoid a difference in static voltage built between components. Search "Bonding" on this forum, there is a lot of information. Some electricians know about it, some, who dont do pools, don;t. For some reason, the reference page on the PoolSchool seems to have been removed / moved. A hard-sided metal pool will be significantly easier to bond than a soft sided pool. But it HAS to be done.
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I have my electrician coming over tomorrow 5/1/25 to basically run electricity to a storage building that will be where I hook up next to the pool. He is going to install and external outlet on the building. (It will be on a seperate breaker running out of our main breaker box).
He did question me about grounding the pool, I (being totally new to this) have never heard of it. He was going to check with our County building permit people concerning the pool being grounded. Now, Bonding-? I'm clueless, should I go out and buy some copper wire and run it around the edges of the pool? Under it? Attached to it? If so, where does it need to be attached to the pool? I would have thought that there would be more discussion about grounding/bonding.
I am grateful for your insight. Thank you very much!
BTW I will probably get a heater to install, it really doesn't make sense to have a Beautiful but (COLD) pool. :)
 
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DonFant said:
I have my electrician coming over tomorrow 5/1/25 to basically run electricity to a storage building that will be where I hook up next to the pool. He is going to install and external outlet on the building. (It will be on a seperate breaker running out of our main breaker box).
He did question me about grounding the pool, I (being totally new to this) have never heard of it. He was going to check with our County building permit people concerning the pool being grounded. Now, Bonding-? I'm clueless, should I go out and buy some copper wire and run it around the edges of the pool? Under it? Attached to it? If so, where does it need to be attached to the pool? I would have thought that there would be more discussion about grounding/bonding.
I am grateful for your insight. Thank you very much!
BTW I will probably get a heater to install, it really doesn't make sense to have a Beautiful but (COLD) pool. :)
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The pool equipment will be grounded and the pool needs to be bonded! HOW'S THAT FOR CONFUSION!! 🤣

Seriously, the filter pump, salt water generator and heater need to be plugged into grounded outlets. The pool has to be bonded - basically there is a ring of copper that is buried around the perimeter of the pool, I think it's around 18 inched deep. The water has to be bonded and all the equipment is bonded to the loop and water - the equipment should have bonding lugs on them. Any metal ladders and/or pool accessories also need to be bonded. The pool wall is interesting as I have a steel wall pool and it is on a resin bottom rail so it didn't need to be bonded; resin wall pools don't get bonded. 20+ years ago my pool just had a wire running from the pool wall to the pump for bonding. Your municipality should have the codes needed for the pool, I think the ring around the pool has to be a certain distance from the pool wall and the bonding wire needs to be copper and a certain guage. Our electrician did all the electrical after the pool was up. Remember the spot for equipment needs to be accessible to the pool ... can't cut the grass too well if you have pipes for the filter in the way! 😉
 
Grounding is for your electrical system. In normal operations, in a basic sense, electricity comes into a device on the hot wire, and leaves on the neutral (not really, but for these purposes the idea is just fine). The ground is there to provide an alternate return path should something go awry (such as a metal part coming in contact with a hot) allowing the fault to trip the breaker.

A bond connects two different conductors that would not otherwise be connected, so that they are at the same electrical potential. If you shuffle your feet across the carpet, you will built up an electric charge in your body - which in an of itself does nothing. But then you touch a metal doorknob and you get a shock. Why? Because you were at a higher potential than the knob, and when you touched it, the potential equalized. It had nothing to do with your household electric service. Now, if you took a piece of wire and connected it to the doorknob and held the other end in your hand, you could shuffle around on the carpet all day long, and when you touched the knob, you would not feel a shock, because you are BONDED to the knob. The bonding allows the electrical potential between you and the knob to remain equal.

To bond a pool, you connect everything in the area that can conduct electricity together with a wire. The metal pool wall, the earth, the water, the metal handrails, the metal pump housing, etc. These things can build up different electrical potentials, just like your hand and the doorknob. However, in some cases, the difference in potential can be quite large (usually because of a problem with the electric service in your area). The earth could be a high potential and the pool water at a low potential (because they are not connected, the water is in a big vinyl bag) but you can walk on the ground with no problem. But then while standing on the ground you stick your hand in the pool, and you get zapped, just like the doorknob, but bigger. Bonding connects all of these things together, so that they all become the same potential and you do not get a shock when bridging between two (of more) of them.
 
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phonedave said:
Grounding is for your electrical system. In normal operations, in a basic sense, electricity comes into a device on the hot wire, and leaves on the neutral (not really, but for these purposes the idea is just fine). The ground is there to provide an alternate return path should something go awry (such as a metal part coming in contact with a hot) allowing the fault to trip the breaker.

A bond connects two different conductors that would not otherwise be connected, so that they are at the same electrical potential. If you shuffle your feet across the carpet, you will built up an electric charge in your body - which in an of itself does nothing. But then you touch a metal doorknob and you get a shock. Why? Because you were at a higher potential than the knob, and when you touched it, the potential equalized. It had nothing to do with your household electric service. Now, if you took a piece of wire and connected it to the doorknob and held the other end in your hand, you could shuffle around on the carpet all day long, and when you touched the knob, you would not feel a shock, because you are BONDED to the knob. The bonding allows the electrical potential between you and the knob to remain equal.

To bond a pool, you connect everything in the area that can conduct electricity together with a wire. The metal pool wall, the earth, the water, the metal handrails, the metal pump housing, etc. These things can build up different electrical potentials, just like your hand and the doorknob. However, in some cases, the difference in potential can be quite large (usually because of a problem with the electric service in your area). The earth could be a high potential and the pool water at a low potential (because they are not connected, the water is in a big vinyl bag) but you can walk on the ground with no problem. But then while standing on the ground you stick your hand in the pool, and you get zapped, just like the doorknob, but bigger. Bonding connects all of these things together, so that they all become the same potential and you do not get a shock when bridging between two (of more) of them.
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What a great explanation! Thank you! My electrician came out yesterday. I rented a POJ Trencher, it was a beast! An old beast, but I was able to get the trench dug.
He is running wires through conduit to my storage building, there is going to be a seperate box on the building and separate hook-ups.
There will be a Heater, Pump and SWG. He also ran a separate bonding wire through the conduit. He is going to Bond everything together. I'm glad I ran across the need for Bonding, I feel 100% better about the installation now.
 
DonFant said:
There will be a Heater, Pump and SWG. He also ran a separate bonding wire through the conduit. He is going to Bond everything together. I'm glad I ran across the need for Bonding, I feel 100% better about the installation now.
Click to expand...
The bonding wire should not be in the same conduit with high voltage wires.

Low voltage and high voltage wires should not be mixed.
 
ioinva said:
VA season runs June through September, with warm water only in July and August -- IF you use a bubble cover to capture the sun heat. That's a lot of work for essentially two months of pool time, which typically coincides when you will be away on your vacations a fair bit. So... a heater is a must for full enjoyment in this region. Since I have a soft-side pool, I have to use a solar heater that runs on a separate water circuit. But with your hard sided pool, you can opt for something better. A heat pump option can extend the season April - October without breaking the bank on operation costs. A gas line is the cheapest to operate but requires professional installation and digging deep for the gas lines. Pure electric is the cheapest to install but the highest operations cost. Works fine for areas in the south where they barely need the heater but for us in VA, you will be running up the bill.

Even if you don't install it now, figure out your plan and make certain that the electrician lays out the circuit needed to support it. That might mean a new power circuit for your breaker, adequately sized, a different gauge electric wire in the conduit and in the outlets by the pool. The good people at Raypak have a calculator -- and when I called them they spent a full hour on the phone helping me figure out options. It's worth doing the research now.

In addition, since your pool pump is not double-insulated, make certain that you also build a water bonding system, making sure all systems are connected with a copper wire to avoid a difference in static voltage built between components. Search "Bonding" on this forum, there is a lot of information. Some electricians know about it, some, who dont do pools, don;t. For some reason, the reference page on the PoolSchool seems to have been removed / moved. A hard-sided metal pool will be significantly easier to bond than a soft sided pool. But it HAS to be done.
Click to expand...
My electrician came out yesterday. I rented a POJ Trencher, it was a beast! An old beast, but I was able to get the trench dug.
He is running wires through conduit to my storage building, there is going to be a seperate box on the building and separate hook-ups.
There will be a Heater, Pump and SWG. He also ran a separate bonding wire through the conduit. He is going to Bond everything together. I'm glad I ran across the need for Bonding, I feel 100% better about the installation now.
 

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DonFant said:
They are sepereratly wrapped, heavy Guage, but separate.
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For reference, the bond wire isn’t supposed to be wrapped. The purpose of it is to be in electrical contact with the dirt and the surrounding environment and be a specific depth below ground. You can leave the existing wire in the conduit and use it for pipe tracing later down the line if you leave one end accessible.
 
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Bperry said:
For reference, the bond wire isn’t supposed to be wrapped. The purpose of it is to be in electrical contact with the dirt and the surrounding environment and be a specific depth below ground. You can leave the existing wire in the conduit and use it for pipe tracing later down the line if you leave one end accessible.
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I believe that my electrician ran the additional wire through the conduit since we were (digging a trench) laying conduit / electric to my building. And, I believe that he is going to check with the building inspector to see if he can use it, if not, not much of a loss, but if so, then it's there. He is well aware of using bare Copper wire to create the bond to all of the equipment and pool. I really don't know, but between him and the County Inspector, they should figure it out. Thank you for your help.
 
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