Is there a non-TFP method that makes sense?

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I'm in mostly full agreement that automation would be the answer here. If someone could work out a sensor or some other largely "hands off" way of accurately testing the water, a SWCG + a Stenner-style pump with MA powered by automation would solve most of the problems. Basically, if an IntelliChem actually did what it said on the tin.

Of course, people would still need to manually brush the pool now and then, they would still need to refill the acid, still need to empty the skimmers, etc. No matter how much automation you throw at the problem, pools will never be fully hands off. And I don't mean this in the "nobody needs more than 640k" way, I legitimately believe it's not possible to fully automate all of the care required for a pool. Not in any reasonable, trouble-free way.

Now that I have the SWCG dialed in for summer mode, I'm down to testing and doing acid additions once a week. Pre-SWCG, once I had things worked out, I was testing every 3 days or so. I spend on average 25 minutes a week max messing with my pool: quick brushing, run the tests, empty the skimmers. I spent a bit more time today since I had to dose some CYA in addition to the normal weekly testing and acid addition. Unless we get some huge paradigm shift in technology, I think this is as time-friendly and trouble free as it gets.
 
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My Pictorial "take" on this topic...

In my opinion... Pool care is as "easy as pie" (thanks to the TFP methods of pool care). And if you stay true to the three basics outlined below, it's not very time consuming at all AND you'll have a clean and crystal clear pool all the time. If you don't stay true to the basics, it will be one headache (and expense) after another.
1. Test regularly
2. Maintain regularly
3. Clean regularly

1. Test regularly - pH, FC, cH, TA, CYA... After weekly testing for awhile, you'll start getting a feel for your pool and what it needs chemically and how often it needs it, depending on the seasons. Then you can back off the frequency of some of the tests (bi-monthly, monthly). But never back off of FC and pH testing (especially in the summer!) Otherwise, I think you'll be asking for "trouble".

Do your OWN testing. Don't trust the pool store. Some stores are ethical of course but some are not. Some may even go so far as to skew your test results so they can sell you "things" you DON'T need.


You can test like this,
1688689976047.png

Or you can get super crazy (like a few of us have) and test (monitor) like this.
1688690799100.png

It doesn't matter. Either way, testing and monitoring is important!


2. Maintain regularly. If you maintain properly, all you need are these...

1688691434182.png AND sometimes this (as applicable) 1688691682073.png


Or... If the "bottle drag" to the edge of the pool is NOT your thing, then there are very good options which will save you in maintenance time.
1688691266882.png 1688691808321.png




That's it. You don't need any magical potions and you certainly should NEVER use these. Doing so will surely result in you "chasing your tail "for sure.

1688692100340.png


And last but not least -
3. Cleaning

You can clean like this...

1688692909648.png

OR... You can drastically reduce your cleaning time (as well as your filter maintenance time) and invest in a "Robot". (highly recommended)

1688693166285.png


And if you want to minimize skimming your pool, then maybe one of these are in your future...
1688693584124.png
Again, it doesn't matter how you get those nasty "biologics" out of your pool, just so long as you do.
And keep your skimmers clean too!

p.s. I'm not promoting any one type of product over another. Those shown above are just my own personal "picks". ;)
r.
 
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I dunno, but I have been enmeshed in the various pool subreddits and folks have some, er, interesting ideas. And they all claim they’re right.

Some poor poster had ph of 6.6, TA of 160 and less than 1 TC, but with no visible algae, and I got into it with someone who said the first thing they should do is get their phosphates down. Why? Because with 4000 phosphates they’re sure to get mustard algae. I pointed out that if you have a properly balanced pool you won’t get it in the first place. They said that since it’s chlorine resistant you have to keep FC up to dangerous levels to prevent it. What’s dangerous? Over 10. Does the CYA level matter on that? No. All argued with a veneer of “I know what I’m talking about and you don’t understand science.”

In another thread today, the OP was a pool newbie who had algae. They had “overshocked” their pool so TC was 15 and wanted to know what to do. Someone was insisting they needed a chlorine reducer immediately. Why, I asked? They’re fighting organics which will eat that all up and even if not it will come down over time. But that would take days, or a week! So, I asked? Apparently we have to agree to disagree.

There are always folks who recommend TFP. And there are some odd ducks who insist we’re a “cult.” I’m not sure why or how that would be, but whatever.

I’m grateful for this place and (before this) Ben’s old poolforum. I’ve built and maintained 3 pools - first with BBB and second and third with SWGs. I often go a week or even more between testings and things just don’t move much. And have never had a serious algae bloom, except at a late startup last year - SLAMming worked exactly as it was supposed to. Doesn’t seem like it can get much more simple. People like to make it complicated, which I don’t understand.
 
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chazas said:
there are some odd ducks who insist we’re a “cult.” I’m not sure why or how that would be, but whatever
Click to expand...
Funny how we *dont* do 85% of what's out there and we're labeled a cult at times.

We pass on :

Ozone
UV
Copper/silver
Baqua
Weekly shock
Algecide
Dilithium crystals
Clarifier
Tabs
Every 5 in 1 mystery potion

And probably several more. If anything we should be called minimalists who have streamlined the heck out of it. 🤷‍♂️
 
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After 5 years of practicing the TFP method of pool care, my pool water couldn't be any cleaner or clearer and not ONCE have had to perform an OCLT or SLAM or a full or partial drain because of water chemistry problems.

If TFP is a "CULT", then SIGN ME UP for another 5 years.

Season 7 Reaction GIF by The Office
 
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SJPoe said:
I have so many questions... LOL
My tiny little 'Pool/Outside Temp + Pump speed Node-Red setup seems so...trivial ;)
Click to expand...
@SJPoe
When I wanted more than what Pentair automation could offer, I played around a little bit with Node-Red right at first (with lots of help from a couple of our members here)
I found it to be like a building block concept which was pretty cool. But right around that same time, I got pointed in the direction of GitHub, Raspberry Pi's and the like. I ended up hooking up with the developers of njspC, dashPanel and eventually REM. They were starting to get super-serious with developing those controller platforms and which now I can't say enough good things about.

Maybe cruise on over there and have a look around. It just might pique your curiosity.
GitHub - tagyoureit/nodejs-poolController: An application to control pool equipment from various manufacturers.

GitHub - rstrouse/nodejs-poolController-dashPanel: A dashboard panel for tagyoureit/nodejs-poolController

GitHub - rstrouse/relayEquipmentManager: A hardware controller for GPIO, I2c, SPI, and generic devices.

Thanks!
r.
 
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Ironically, the easiest way to care for a pool is also the cheapest (over time), and the healthiest. Automate everything possible, and you can spend as little as 5-10 minutes a week. You can pay someone else to do the "big stuff" (repairs, filter cleaning, opening/closing, etc).

Not even never using it and letting it go without maintenance is an alternative. It will eventually cost more money and effort.

I didn't read every post, so pardon if this was mentioned, but I feel it to be one of the most important aspects of owning a pool. A pool is a responsibility. One that if neglected can cause mild to serious risk to pool users. Sorry, but you don't get to short cut that, or ignore that. Who here said it best: "a pool is like a pet, you don't have to play with it every day, but you sill have to take care of it every day!" (A pool is way less work than a pet, BTW.)

Neglecting a pool is like serving your family and guests spoiled food. Not an option. And using a weekly pool service or pool store is neglecting your pool (with some exceptions based on climate). If you drive a car, you have to maintain it. If you have a pool, same. And you need to take some amount of effort to test and/or dose the water yourself, even with a service. You cannot rely on outsiders to alleviate you of YOUR responsibility (maintaining healthy water). And since you MUST test your own water yourself, you might as well spend the other 2 minutes a week and do the rest!

So if people are too lazy to take care of a pool, the only responsible solution is to move. Which is going to be way more expensive than automation and 10 minutes a week.

Sidebar: if you don't have 10 minutes a week to maintain a pool, which is a source of beauty in your home and yard, a fun and excellent exercise, a very healthy aspect of your social life (with family and friends and neighbors), quite enjoyable even off season, and a host of other benefits, then you have a much bigger problem than doing pool chores. Respectfully, you don't need to find a way to "do less pool," you need to reevaluate what is sucking the life out of your life.
 
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chazas said:
I dunno, but I have been enmeshed in the various pool subreddits and folks have some, er, interesting ideas. And they all claim they’re right.

Some poor poster had ph of 6.6, TA of 160 and less than 1 TC, but with no visible algae, and I got into it with someone who said the first thing they should do is get their phosphates down. Why? Because with 4000 phosphates they’re sure to get mustard algae. I pointed out that if you have a properly balanced pool you won’t get it in the first place. They said that since it’s chlorine resistant you have to keep FC up to dangerous levels to prevent it. What’s dangerous? Over 10. Does the CYA level matter on that? No. All argued with a veneer of “I know what I’m talking about and you don’t understand science.”

In another thread today, the OP was a pool newbie who had algae. They had “overshocked” their pool so TC was 15 and wanted to know what to do. Someone was insisting they needed a chlorine reducer immediately. Why, I asked? They’re fighting organics which will eat that all up and even if not it will come down over time. But that would take days, or a week! So, I asked? Apparently we have to agree to disagree.

There are always folks who recommend TFP. And there are some odd ducks who insist we’re a “cult.” I’m not sure why or how that would be, but whatever.

I’m grateful for this place and (before this) Ben’s old poolforum. I’ve built and maintained 3 pools - first with BBB and second and third with SWGs. I often go a week or even more between testings and things just don’t move much. And have never had a serious algae bloom, except at a late startup last year - SLAMming worked exactly as it was supposed to. Doesn’t seem like it can get much more simple. People like to make it complicated, which I don’t understand.
Click to expand...
Sounds like you spend some time on the ‘salt water pools’ FB page. I had to swear that off for my sanity.
 
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Newdude said:
Funny how we *dont* do 85% of what's out there and we're labeled a cult at times.

We pass on :

Ozone
UV
Copper/silver
Baqua
Weekly shock
Algecide
Dilithium crystals
Clarifier
Tabs
Every 5 in 1 mystery potion

And probably several more. If anything we should be called minimalists who have streamlined the heck out of it. 🤷‍♂️
Click to expand...

dfwnoob said:
Minimalist. I like that. The minimalist approach to pool care.
Click to expand...

So what you’re saying is… we’re a minimalist cult?
 
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Dirk said:
Ironically, the easiest way to care for a pool is also the cheapest (over time), and the healthiest.
Click to expand...
Hear, hear!!

To me, you need to scoop, brush (somewhere), check or run the cleaner, and empty the skimmer on some sort of regular basis (3x per week?) else your pool is not a beautiful part of your landscape, and could become a slum. May as well take 5 mins to check FC and pH.

If you need to stretch it out, use dosing - SWCG or stenner and tank, 2nd stenner for acid - as easy as it gets.

As far as an easier way, sure, but not trouble-free. With experience, you could schedule it all and be very close, more often than not, but not always.
 
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MyAZPool said:
Maybe cruise on over there and have a look around. It just might pique your curiosity.
Click to expand...
(Careful not to thread hijack here...) That looks awesome, but probably way more than I need. I have one VSP pump, and a wifi temp gauge...and I like to be able to turn the pump on (or now up to max when want to vacuum etc), and the wife likes to ask Alexa what the pool temp is :)

Plus, I really don't need to tweak my OCD quite so aggressively ;)
 

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