There are no valves at all. No multiport as uts a cartridge filter system with no waste line. Have you priced the cartridges for a sta rite s8m500.... that and they are beyond a nightmare to clean. The Pentair RP 200 is simple to clean and the cartridges are about $70 versus $700+ fit the s8m500 unit. Im about to the point of an automatic air relief with check valve and call it a day. In my digging i found what i thought might be an issue will post a pic of that mess tomorrow. It will be removed and plumbed back properly. But if this things in there what is hiding under ground further...rhats a million dollar question i might end up having to answer.��
Air leak into strainer basket
- Thread starter Puddleman
- Start date
I took some flashlight pics of the skimmer and the vortexs
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Notice the thousands of tiny air bubbles on the skimmer basket.
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Notice the thousands of tiny air bubbles on the skimmer basket.
Is the basket full of water or is it almost empty?
I’m sorry but my brain is having a hard time figuring this out. Is there a waterfall into the bottom of the basket?
I’d like you to answer that before I comment on your flow vs amount of air issue.
Do you have any empty 5gallon buckets around?
I’m sorry but my brain is having a hard time figuring this out. Is there a waterfall into the bottom of the basket?
I’d like you to answer that before I comment on your flow vs amount of air issue.
Do you have any empty 5gallon buckets around?
Everything is full of water even the strainer stays full of water. Its drawing air from somewhere i cannot figure out. It will fill the filter up with air to the point air starts coming out of the jets. Yet it will still have a full strainer basket. The water level in skimmer is an inch from the top.
I appreciate all of this help. I talked with a pool tech today and he is just as stumped.
As i have said i did not have this issue before changing filters. Yet i have checked everything too many times to count. The Pentair filter is rated at almost 3 times the flow rate of the sta rite s8500m. Thats the only real change. Same pump only replumbed the pressure side as the pump did not need repositioned. I did replumb the suction side from the ground into the pump only after it had the air symptoms. And only then because the previous owners had used DWV drain fittings and the glue was separated feom the fittings.
As i have said i did not have this issue before changing filters. Yet i have checked everything too many times to count. The Pentair filter is rated at almost 3 times the flow rate of the sta rite s8500m. Thats the only real change. Same pump only replumbed the pressure side as the pump did not need repositioned. I did replumb the suction side from the ground into the pump only after it had the air symptoms. And only then because the previous owners had used DWV drain fittings and the glue was separated feom the fittings.
Ok. The reason for my last set of questions is that I think the air is getting in the system through the skimmer. The pump has a high enough flow rate that it is running the skimmer level down and sucking in air. Mine will do that too if I run on high speed with low water. I know you don’t have low water, but I think the pump is still pulling too much flow for your skimmer.
I believe that when you changed out your filter, the pressure got low enough to run the pump at a higher flow on the pump curve. This would also explain why you were seeing more air when you open the bleeder valve. The pressure is getting even lower and you are moving farther right on the pump curve, effectively increasing the flow even more and sucking in more air.
If you have a couple of 5 gallon bucket on hand, you could fill them with pool water and then quickly dump them in the skimmer to absolutely prevent the air from getting the system. Have somebody else watch the pump to see if the bubbles stop while you were pouring. Or set up a video camera to watch for it.
I believe that when you changed out your filter, the pressure got low enough to run the pump at a higher flow on the pump curve. This would also explain why you were seeing more air when you open the bleeder valve. The pressure is getting even lower and you are moving farther right on the pump curve, effectively increasing the flow even more and sucking in more air.
If you have a couple of 5 gallon bucket on hand, you could fill them with pool water and then quickly dump them in the skimmer to absolutely prevent the air from getting the system. Have somebody else watch the pump to see if the bubbles stop while you were pouring. Or set up a video camera to watch for it.
Will try this today. Cause um all out of ideas unless its a motor shaft seal leak that wouldnt explain the air at pressure but maybe when the pressure drops from purging. I dont know just brainstorming. I have read where air can get in that way at Inyo Pools
Ok no change at all on amount of air entering strainer basket doing the bucket dumps
Hmmm. Bummer on the skimmer test.
I don’t believe it is the shaft seal though. The water is pressurized in that portion of the pump and water would leak out, not air leak in when the pump is running.
Looking back at your first few posts in this thread, you say it stopped when it rained. Was it enough rain to saturate the ground? Maybe that was enough to have water sucked in instead of air.
I’m also debating your main drain comments. Was it capped off in the last 40 years?? Clogged?? Who knows... it would be interesting to know.
You also mentioned something about digging up a can of worms... what panned out with that?
I don’t believe it is the shaft seal though. The water is pressurized in that portion of the pump and water would leak out, not air leak in when the pump is running.
Looking back at your first few posts in this thread, you say it stopped when it rained. Was it enough rain to saturate the ground? Maybe that was enough to have water sucked in instead of air.
I’m also debating your main drain comments. Was it capped off in the last 40 years?? Clogged?? Who knows... it would be interesting to know.
You also mentioned something about digging up a can of worms... what panned out with that?
This pic quota stuff stops me from posting pics. Basically i dug down to what should have been the 90 from the skimmer to the pump riser, it was a Tee with a iron plug screwed into a threaded adapter. I filled the jole with water to cover it but that didnt change the air either so i ruled out that as a leak. Still stumped as to where all the air is coming from. I was watching the rerurn jets and they push great enough to cause whirlpools to spin off around the pool surface.
I believe you can use imgur.com for free. Or, you can become a TFP supporter!
ok new info on this issue. after 4 days of pump being off, strainer is full of water did not lose prime. turned it on and filter had zero air in it as when I shut it off last. All air in strainer cleared and it took a good 2 minutes before the small air bubbles started in again. what on earth could I be missing. if it had a suction side leak wouldnt it have lost prime after 4 days? still stumped. I found a automatic air bleeder that has a vac check so its air out nothing back in that I am about to order., Its an ARI S-050 VAC with 1/2" MPT. that will atleast keep the air out of the filter.
I have no weir gate. So nothing is slowing the water at the skimmer. Pool level is high due to rain. Still not losing any water.
Do you have any valves on the discharge side of the pump? If so, try closing it to artificially create some back pressure and reduce the flow.
No valves. But like i said only 1.25inch return lines with 1.5inch suction. That should create some. Filter is up to about 10psi now with vacuuming etc. Not seeing enough change on the amount of air though. Still have to do skimmer dye test.
I will add this, is your pump to big? 1.5hp is some serious suction for a 1.5” line. No main drain either? I can imagine your skimmer has some serious pulling action.
How many returns do you have in the pool? Is there a way someone can hold their hand over the return to slow the flow while someone else looks for bubbles?
What is this skimmer dye test and what does it test for?
What is this skimmer dye test and what does it test for?
Skimmer dye test is using a syringe to put dye at seams etc. In a calm skimmer if theres a crack the dye will seep out of it.
I have been wondering if the pump is too big since changing the filter out to a higher flow unit. Theres 3 jets in the pool for return and they seriously churn the water. I am going to get a flow meter to check but im guessing looking at the churn its pushing 120gpm or so.
I have been wondering if the pump is too big since changing the filter out to a higher flow unit. Theres 3 jets in the pool for return and they seriously churn the water. I am going to get a flow meter to check but im guessing looking at the churn its pushing 120gpm or so.
oddly today I ran the pump for 8 hours straight while I was at work. when I got home the pump was still primed.
I started it to check the air in the filter, was minimal as in just a couple seconds of purging. I am stumped.
have had no real rain to speak of I havent done anything different except I plugged the skimmer line at the skimmer and used a drain king at the pump inlet. it never went under "pressure" I wasnt in the mood for diving to the main drain either.
when I removed the plug from the skimmer I did not get a back-rush of water either. Main drain not clogged?I have noticed the debris is collecting in the deep end near the main drain now,
it used to collect in the shallow end. Yesterday I tried a bag over the main drain cover to see if it would pull down but I couldnt keep my fat butt down long enough to get it in place.
Still going to install a ARI S-050-VAC automatic air relief valve for peace of mind.
I started it to check the air in the filter, was minimal as in just a couple seconds of purging. I am stumped.
have had no real rain to speak of I havent done anything different except I plugged the skimmer line at the skimmer and used a drain king at the pump inlet. it never went under "pressure" I wasnt in the mood for diving to the main drain either.
when I removed the plug from the skimmer I did not get a back-rush of water either. Main drain not clogged?I have noticed the debris is collecting in the deep end near the main drain now,
it used to collect in the shallow end. Yesterday I tried a bag over the main drain cover to see if it would pull down but I couldnt keep my fat butt down long enough to get it in place.
Still going to install a ARI S-050-VAC automatic air relief valve for peace of mind.