DE Filter Sucking Air in?

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justducky21

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May 16, 2017
10
Purcellville
Hi, Everyone! First Post here.

Wow, I have learned a lot in a little time a lot of info learned via this site -couldn't be more thankful.

So as the story goes, we bought a house in 2016 the previous owners had it opened for us when we moved in, we were able to enjoy 2.5 months or so of swimming. We battled PH issues and general debris but the overall pool was a blast, then the fall came and it got away from us, and we had to quickly winterize the pool which pretty much meant blow the lines and that was all we could get done. We didn't see the pool cover in the Barn until way too late.

Fast forward to now, and I want the pool open and its GREEN ugh.

So I've started the SLAM process and I have been battling multiple issues, which I am slowing checking off the list.
The first Issue: I had was water loss, I did a dye test around skimmer basket and return lines and have since puttied around them, seems that this has solved my issue.
Second issue: lots of air in the pump housing, we replaced the O-ring and pump plugs, when the pool is on re-circ (rather than filter) the pump is fine no air bubbles through the 'viewing window' turn the multi-valve port to filter and we get a bunch of air bubbles in the window and the return water rate is much lower. We did clean the filter and re-did the ring with Magic Lube on the filter and it's still somehow getting air in.

Does anyone have any ideas or where I should look for this air leak? I can't wait to start getting this pool set to filter.
 
The filter is on the pressure side of the pump if there was a leak there water would be coming out not air going in. The only place for air to get sucked into the system while the pump is running is on the suction side of the pump. You won't always see a lot of bubbles in the pump strainer basket even if the pump is sucking air.

Another thing is you shouldn't move the multiport valve while the pump is running or you will blow out the gasket in the valve.

One more thing is there should be an air vent on top of the filter to vent the air from it after cleaning it.
 
The filter is on the pressure side of the pump -- or should be if someone connected things wrong. If there's a leak in the filter, water should be spraying out with the pump on.

So... air is getting in somehow on the suction side. On recirculate, there's probably enough flow that you can't see the bubbles speeding through the basket. But on filter, things slow down enough that the air bubbles rise into a great big on inside the pump basket.

What did your filter grids look like? Was the fabric hard and brittle feeling? They could be calcified. What's the pressure when running, and do you remember what it was before filter cleaning?

I see two problems: a suction side air leak and a restriction inside the filter.
 
Richard320 said:
The filter is on the pressure side of the pump -- or should be if someone connected things wrong. If there's a leak in the filter, water should be spraying out with the pump on.

So... air is getting in somehow on the suction side. On recirculate, there's probably enough flow that you can't see the bubbles speeding through the basket. But on filter, things slow down enough that the air bubbles rise into a great big on inside the pump basket.

What did your filter grids look like? Was the fabric hard and brittle feeling? They could be calcified. What's the pressure when running, and do you remember what it was before filter cleaning? I see two problems: a suction side air leak and a restriction inside the filter.
Click to expand...

Filter grids looked good, no breaks or holes and didn't seem brittle, just dirty.
I don't remember what it was before cleaning but its 25 PSI right now.

Where should I look for a suction side air leak? or what types of things should I look for a restriction inside the filter?

I looked to see if there were any noticeable leaks where the filter meets the inlet, but I see nothing - is there a gasket or O-ring I need to replace there?
 
I read that previously, which is why I replaced the Oring on the pump basket and it fixed the bubbles when on re-circulate but not when I set it to filter so I assumed it had to be another air leak somewhere between the pump basket and the inlet of the filter.

Would I need to replace the spider ring in the multiport valve?
 
This seems the opposite of the behavior you'd expect. The problem isn't the filter.

My guess would be that a valve is set wrong or there is a plumbing issue. What does the gauge read on filter, and what is the flow from the returns like? What does the gauge read on recirculate, and how does the flow from the returns compare to when the valve is set to filter?

Usually you'd see the opposite behavior with an air leak since the back pressure of the filter reduces the rate the pump pulls water in.

Right after the pump basket is the impeller. This is what actually moves the water. Any leak after the impeller results in water coming out, not air coming in. The part of the pool before the impeller is under negative pressure and is referred to as the "suction side". Leaks on the suction side are air leaks into the plumbing while the pump is running, but can drip when the pump is off.
 

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I have the exact same issue...no air bubbles visible when on recirc...eventually the basket has no air bubbles after five minutes or so. Switch back to filter, and slowly the air bubbles come back, eventually the entire top of the pump housing is air...about a half inch. Pump never starves for water or loses prime but it sure makes me nervous when I ain't home to watch it. I've done the "incense test" on suction side fittings, and replaced the O-ring. Nothing obvious...water DOES spit out between the lid and basket where the o-ring is when I shut it off...that's leading me to a possible crack in the lid, or just that the O-ring isn't quite thick enough anymore...could the mating surfaces wear enough to not allow sealing? I can't tighten the lid any more (it's a Waterway screw-on type), so I'm thinking that's the next area for inspection.
 
Okay so I went back over all the exposed PVC pipes with glue/sealant and now when I set the valve to filter I have no suction issues i.e. bubbles in the basket. But it seems now I have a flow issue hardly anything is coming out of the return jet. I am going to backwash (even though I just cleaned the grids) and see if that helps.
Any other thoughts as to why I would have a filter flow issue?

- - - Updated - - -

Also, my PSI is zero when it's on recirculate, and 25 when it's set to filter.
 
justducky21 said:
I am going to backwash (even though I just cleaned the grids) and see if that helps.
Any other thoughts as to why I would have a filter flow issue?

- - - Updated - - -

Also, my PSI is zero when it's on recirculate, and 25 when it's set to filter.
Click to expand...

If your water is dirty at all, your DE can become clogged quickly. Is your filter the type you can backwash or bump?
 
Back wash while during SLAM... frustrated

How many times is normal?
I can't seem to go more than every hour before the pressure is high and I have zero flow.

I am not sure what todo especially during the work week.
I have been setting it to recirculation and putting the bot in.
I feel that after a week I have hit a wall. I need to filter all the water but simply can't back wash or disassemble the de filter. Even if I were able to backwash every hour what should I do about the water loss?

We are on well water, with high sediment content.
 
Re: Back wash while during SLAM... frustrated

justducky21 said:
How many times is normal?
I can't seem to go more than every hour before the pressure is high and I have zero flow.

I am not sure what todo especially during the work week.
I have been setting it to recirculation and putting the bot in.
I feel that after a week I have hit a wall. I need to filter all the water but simply can't back wash or disassemble the de filter. Even if I were able to backwash every hour what should I do about the water loss?

We are on well water, with high sediment content.
Click to expand...

Nothing you are describing sounds unusual at all. It's a downside of DE. The high quality filtration becomes a problem with really dirty water. A sand filter might be a better answer.
 
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