Pentair Acid Pump Help

Gtmg

New member
Feb 5, 2020
4
Houston, Texas
Moved from HERE

I installed a Pentair Acid Pump & Tank and hooked it up to my Jandy automation panel last spring.

It is not a smart pump, but since I hooked it up to my Jandy automation I can schedule acid injection and/or do the injection manually via my Jandy Zodiac iAqualink online and phone based app. I can set it to run for 1 minute which puts in around 4-5oz of acid into the pool - at the same time I turn up the speed of my pump to help disperse the acid a little more...

You could also hook it up to a standard 24V DC power supply and add a timer and a manual switch to control it.
Hi. I am considering doing the same thing with a Pentair Acid Pump and Jandy controller as you describe here. How has it worked for you? Any issues with the pump? Do you mind discussing the specifics of how you connected it to the Jandy iAqualink?
 
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Thanks. I ended up finding another thread where this was described in detail.
FYI: I really like the Pentair tank (and pump). I run the IntellipH system, but I also run it without the controller during the winter, similar to the way @santacruzpool runs his. If you decide to use the Pentair tank without the IntellipH controller, I believe they are available without the controller, for some savings.
 
FYI: I really like the Pentair tank (and pump). I run the IntellipH system, but I also run it without the controller during the winter, similar to the way @santacruzpool runs his. If you decide to use the Pentair tank without the IntellipH controller, I believe they are available without the controller, for some savings.
I found the Pentair tank and pump without the controller. I was thinking I would connect it to an aux on my Jandy similar to how santacruzpool did but just went and looked and all of the four aux on my iAqualink are in use for other equipment. So what if I just provide the 24V DC power to it and use a timer to turn it on and off? Any issues with this approach?
 
I found the Pentair tank and pump without the controller. I was thinking I would connect it to an aux on my Jandy similar to how santacruzpool did but just went and looked and all of the four aux on my iAqualink are in use for other equipment. So what if I just provide the 24V DC power to it and use a timer to turn it on and off? Any issues with this approach?
Yes. Ideally, your system should provide some safeguards. Just running a timer doesn't provide any.
1.
You want the power source to the acid pump to somehow be tied into the power source for the filter pump. This is so that even if the timer calls for acid, the acid pump can't run unless the filter pump is also running. This is to prevent a bunch of concentrated acid sitting in your pad plumbing and not going anywhere.
2.
A second safeguard has the same function, and this uses a flow switch. Power to the acid pump is not allowed unless the flow switch is closed. This is to prevent the same danger, but in case the power to the filter pump is available, but the filter pump is not actually running (like if it failed for some reason).
3.
A third safeguard is to ensure that the acid pump can't pump too much acid into the pool at once. Like if the timer fails to shut off the acid pump. This safeguard is more difficult to achieve. The IntellipH controller has this safeguard built in, as it only allows a few ounces of acid to be pumped at a time, but I suppose even it could fail. The ultimate way to achieve this safeguard is to minimize the available acid. The Pentair tank itself sort of has this built in, in that it only holds so much acid. About four gallons. If you follow the recommendation of cutting that to 1:1 dilution (half-strength acid), then the tank really only has about 2 gallons of acid at any given time. So even if you get a major malfunction, your pool will at worst get two gallons of acid in one shot, which will trash your pH for a time, but not cause any significant damage. Folks that hook up big Stenner tanks, or 50 gallon drums, are just asking for trouble.

Personally, I wouldn't trust any sort of digital timer alone for this task, and certainly not one of those manual timers. Either can get out of sync, or just fail, and without some or all of these safeguards, you're risking damage to your plumbing or your pool.

OK, that all said, it's possible one of your relays is actually coordinated to only close when the filter pump is running. That's how my Pentair automation works. So I just wired my acid pump power source to that. I actually use two relays: one for the power source, and one as the timer. So they both have to be closed for acid to flow. I also have a flow switch in the mix, for that added protection. So in your case, because you don't have an extra relay for the timing, you could do one or two safeguards: you could plumb in a flow switch, and wire that into your timer circuit. Or you could wire the acid pump power source up to the filter pump's relay, and then use a separate stand-alone timer for dosing, so that even if the timer called for acid, nothing would happen unless the filter pump was also powered on. Or you could do both (that's how mine is setup). You could use the pool circuit relay (that's what Pentair calls it), even if it's used for something else, even if it's not 24VDC, by using an additional stand-alone relay (I do something similar to that).

If you need a sketch of how to wire all that, I might be able to help, though I don't know anything about Jandy controllers. I expect they work similarly to Pentair controllers, but we'd have to verify that. @santacruzpool could help, probably, if he'd check his TFP alerts once in a while, instead of binging YouTube videos all day long! (Oh, wait, I might be projecting!) ;)
 
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Yes. Ideally, your system should provide some safeguards. Just running a timer doesn't provide any.
1.
You want the power source to the acid pump to somehow be tied into the power source for the filter pump. This is so that even if the timer calls for acid, the acid pump can't run unless the filter pump is also running. This is to prevent a bunch of concentrated acid sitting in your pad plumbing and not going anywhere.
2.
A second safeguard has the same function, and this uses a flow switch. Power to the acid pump is not allowed unless the flow switch is closed. This is to prevent the same danger, but in case the power to the filter pump is available, but the filter pump is not actually running (like if it failed for some reason).
3.
A third safeguard is to ensure that the acid pump can't pump too much acid into the pool at once. Like if the timer fails to shut off the acid pump. This safeguard is more difficult to achieve. The IntellipH controller has this safeguard built in, as it only allows a few ounces of acid to be pumped at a time, but I suppose even it could fail. The ultimate way to achieve this safeguard is to minimize the available acid. The Pentair tank itself sort of has this built in, in that it only holds so much acid. About four gallons. If you follow the recommendation of cutting that to 1:1 dilution (half-strength acid), then the tank really only has about 2 gallons of acid at any given time. So even if you get a major malfunction, your pool will at worst get two gallons of acid in one shot, which will trash your pH for a time, but not cause any significant damage. Folks that hook up big Stenner tanks, or 50 gallon drums, are just asking for trouble.

Personally, I wouldn't trust any sort of digital timer alone for this task, and certainly not one of those manual timers. Either can get out of sync, or just fail, and without some or all of these safeguards, you're risking damage to your plumbing or your pool.

OK, that all said, it's possible one of your relays is actually coordinated to only close when the filter pump is running. That's how my Pentair automation works. So I just wired my acid pump power source to that. I actually use two relays: one for the power source, and one as the timer. So they both have to be closed for acid to flow. I also have a flow switch in the mix, for that added protection. So in your case, because you don't have an extra relay for the timing, you could do one or two safeguards: you could plumb in a flow switch, and wire that into your timer circuit. Or you could wire the acid pump power source up to the filter pump's relay, and then use a separate stand-alone timer for dosing, so that even if the timer called for acid, nothing would happen unless the filter pump was also powered on. Or you could do both (that's how mine is setup). You could use the pool circuit relay (that's what Pentair calls it), even if it's used for something else, even if it's not 24VDC, by using an additional stand-alone relay (I do something similar to that).

If you need a sketch of how to wire all that, I might be able to help, though I don't know anything about Jandy controllers. I expect they work similarly to Pentair controllers, but we'd have to verify that. @santacruzpool could help, probably, if he'd check his TFP alerts once in a while, instead of binging YouTube videos all day long! (Oh, wait, I might be projecting!) ;)
Dirk, thanks for the helpful response. I will plan to connect the pentair acid pump to a 24V DC power supply and that into the relay of the pump. As you said that will prevent the acid pump from being powered if the pump is not running. Now I just need to find a good reliable timer that preferably is programmable in increments less than one minute. I will likely need some assistance with the wiring of the Jandy unit.
 
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If you find you cannot set a timer for less than a minute, and that minute dispenses too much acid, you could handle that in two ways (at least).

You can always dilute your acid further, and by doing so, a minute of injecting would dispense less acid.

Or you can dispense half as often, for example, once every two days instead of every day. Assuming your timer can handle that type of scheduling.

In the winter, mine runs for about 3 minutes a day, so less than a one minute timer interval isn't necessary for my pool.

There is another consideration though. I like my IntellipH controller because it dispenses a small amount every hour. This puts less acid into the pool during any given shot. Which is probably safer for inquisitive swimmers. But more importantly, by dispensing 8 to 12 times a day, hourly, my pH stays very stable throughout the day, instead of getting jolted just once a day, or every other day. I believe a more stable pH lends itself to healthier plaster. Nothing I can prove, and certainly not for decades, because I won't know if this theory yields an extra year or two of my plaster's longevity or not. But I like to pretend it will!

Point being, if you can find a timer that can do seconds, multiple times a day, that might be something to look at.

And yet another consideration: do you have an SWG? Or any plans for one? Pentair recommends the acid injector be located before the SWG. Which means injected acid will pass through the SWG's plates. It's not a good idea to run this acid past SWG plates that are actively producing chlorine gas. An IntellipH handles this by controlling a Pentair-brand SWG (they "talk" to one another): it turns off the SWG temporarily while acid is being injected, then turns the SWG back on when the acid is done. If this sounds like something you'd want to mimic, you'd have to figure a way to time the acid injection only while your SWG is not active. That might be as simple as running the acid pump at 8:00am, and then starting your SWG run at 9:00am.

These are some of the reason's I like my intellipH, because I don't have to think about all this sort of stuff. Well, except when explaining why I like my IntellipH!! ;)
 
I have my timer set to the minimum the Jandy system allows - 1 minute.

I am using 14% acid - and I am also diluting it 1:1 - so I have around 7% acid I am dispensing. I typically needed about 16oz of 14% acid a week for my pool, due to high TA fill water. So I need 32oz of my diluted mix every week on average. That means a single minute dose every day puts in about 35oz. I can manually bump that up or down depending on testing.

Just this weekend I was doing "manual" additions using the button I assigned to the acid pump in the Jandy app.

My post shows everything I did - let me know if you have any questions.

I couldn't get my pump relay to be a secondary safety override for my acid pump. So I am relying on my schedule and the Jandy "smarts" (or lack thereof) to hopefully not turn on when the pump is off - I have done an experiment of forcing the acid pump to run while the pump is off, and it turns on the pump for the minute that the acid pump runs, and then shuts off...

I just make sure I have my schedules always overlap - the acid pump schedule is always set to run sometime in the middle of my daily pump runtime.
 

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Hooking up the control line in tandem with the pump relay, always tripped the pump breaker...

Even with some professional electrical help it wouldn't work. The pump Relay has a shared line going to the SWCG already (so it is protected from turning on when the pump is off), and the consensus was the extra draw from the DC power supply was enough to trip the GFCI breaker.
 
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