Tips to make the Liquidator liveable.....

[fixit5561]

I was wondering guys, is it ok to keep my PH at 7.2-7.4 with my heater? It says(the heater manual) to keep the PH around 7.6 with it to keep the heat exchnager from getting ruined.

What are all your thoughts?

I do have the white stuff floating in my funnel but nothing in the bottom yet,and nothing on the float valves,but too, its only been hooked up for a week now, but hasnt been running but only for 1 night as it added 6.5ppm to my pool overnight so I shut it off for a few days to lower the Cl in the pool as it went to 13ppm. I also have the stock tubing that has started to turn white inside, hope im not on the road to the WS!!!

Brian

 

[Rabbit]

I also have the stock tubing that has started to turn white inside, hope im not on the road to the WS!!!
Brian

Not sure why everyone is making such a fuss over the white stuff in the tubing. I stated in another post that I use to fill my fish tank with the exact same kind and size of vinyl line that came with the LQ. It turned completely white within 150 gallons going through it straight from the tap. The correlation was that Phoenix water has a ton of calcium in it. It's the same exact kind of white. FYI, all the 1/4 inch line I stopped using on my LQ turned white as well, very white. Same as when I use to fill my fish tank. My CH is 400.

I think the calcium in the water is loosing it's hold on the water with the adverse chemical mixture inside the LQ and just starts to float around, pretty much what many others have said. Why doesn't someone put some of the white stuff in a tube and do a calcium hardness test on it as well as a salt test. I suspect both numbers are very high.

I also check pretty much everything in my house once a day. Guess some people just expect stuff to always work forever and don't want to deal with 15 seconds of cleaning

If the white stuff becomes a problem for me, I'll solve it. I won't get all upset about it.

So far the LQ works great, it's made my life much easier. I've not had to add any chlorine manually for over two weeks now, that's a record for me.

 

[Water_man]

Not sure why everyone is making such a fuss over the white stuff in the tubing

Here's why. The WS may do what Artheroschlerosis does to the blood flow. It blcoks it. Some people (duraleigh, for instance) had to take the LQ apart and do an acid rinse. It can block the flow meter and the rate control valve. I don't want to go to a week vacation and come back to find an algae bloom because my pool ran out of FC because my LQ had a cardiac arrest.
Besides, we are here because we like to solve problems not because we are "upset" about the problem but because we enjoy the solution, just as you must have liked solving your low flow challenge.
After all , this is a place for troule free pool, right?
So, how would you deal with WS if it becomes a problem for you?

 

[Rabbit]

Besides, we are here because we like to solve problems not because we are "upset" about the problem but because we enjoy the solution, just as you must have liked solving your low flow challenge.

As far as I can tell I've solved both problems. The flow is impacted by the "white stuff". My increase in line hose diameter means my LQ will be able to eat much more fatty foods and not die of clogged arteries.

Here is a bunch of flow meters I just found, they will measure in just about any flow rate you want and come in just about any pipe size you want.

http://www.kinginstrumentco.com/products/products.html

I guess it all boils down to, money solves everything. I can certainly see how some would not want to spend more on a product that they already have paid money for. I'm just not one of them. I'll be happy when everyone else is saying, hey..this works great

 

[Water_man]

The flow is impacted by the "white stuff". My increase in line hose diameter means my LQ will be able to eat much more fatty foods and not die of clogged arteries.

I don't know how bad is your WS, and perhaps it hasn't "matured" yet - it's all a mater of time. Mine looks now like flowing cottage cheese (although it started like smooth milkshake) so I'm afraid soon enough no 3/8" line and flow control valve would cut it,
and I’m reluctant to start acid washing the system every now and then.

Besides, you still haven't solved the problem of deposits on the hinges of the "out" float valve which already crippled al least one member's LQ here and the manufacturer warns about it big time, although their "remedy" for the problem, namely "pour the bleach slowly", is baloney.
So, if I were your chick I would have said "sorry honey, money can't buy you everything" LOL

 

[Rabbit]

so I'm afraid soon enough no 3/8" line and flow control valve would cut it

I think you would be amazed at the difference.

Besides, you still haven't solved the problem of deposits on the hinges of the "out" float valve which already crippled al least one member's LQ here

One of the first things I did to the floats which I have not mentioned was to put four holes in the main body of the hinge holder. Two on the top (or bottom in the case of the outlet) and one on each side. I just used a sharp exacto blade as I needed to be careful not to damage the inside pipe. This has the effect of increased flow and also not forcing all the liquid through one ever narrowing passage. I now get flow from all 5 sides. It also let's air out of the inlet side and overall increases flow. This should help to lessen any buildup on the critical areas of the valves. I'll post some pictures later.

Did everyones outlet float come with sand in it? This was a smart move on Hasa's part. The weight helps close off the valve more easily. Another thing to consider is that you actually want the tank to drain down enough each time to close off that outlet valve. It will be less likely to have crystal formations on the only tiny area of the float that matters. The inlet flow also needs to be greater then the outlet flow to cause the outlet float to move a full swing, this will help keep the hinge area free moving. I also cut off the stops on the floats. They did nothing of use.

I see everyone trying to figure out what causes the "white stuff" and that's great. I think it's more important however to find ways around it. Even if you figure out the cause the cure might be out of reach.

 

[Water_man]

One of the first things I did to the floats which I have not mentioned was to put four holes in the main body of the hinge holder. Two on the top (or bottom in the case of the outlet) and one on each side. I just used a sharp exacto blade as I needed to be careful not to damage the inside pipe. This has the effect of increased flow and also not forcing all the liquid through one ever narrowing passage. I now get flow from all 5 sides. It also let's air out of the inlet side and overall increases flow. This should help to lessen any buildup on the critical areas of the valves. I'll post some pictures later.

Did everyones outlet float come with sand in it? This was a smart move on Hasa's part. The weight helps close off the valve more easily. Another thing to consider is that you actually want the tank to drain down enough each time to close off that outlet valve. It will be less likely to have crystal formations on the only tiny area of the float that matters. The inlet flow also needs to be greater then the outlet flow to cause the outlet float to move a full swing, this will help keep the hinge area free moving. I also cut off the stops on the floats. They did nothing of use.

I see everyone trying to figure out what causes the "white stuff" and that's great. I think it's more important however to find ways around it. Even if you figure out the cause the cure might be out of reach.

Good job, Rabbit. You retrofitted almost the entire LQ's cardiovascular system so now it can eat all the junk food in the world and be a couch potato and still it won't have a heart attack. Not to mention you don't spend a dime on drugs. Please post pics when you can with captions as you did with the 1/4" -> 3/8" conversion. I'll take a closer look at the float valves and most likely will have some more questions.
What about the flow meter (stock or retrofit.) Have you picked a model with the least flow resistance?
Finally, the WS particles seem larger than normal pool cloudiness particles, including CC, and I wonder if this won't damage the pump in the long run.

 

[Rabbit]

Good job, Rabbit. You retrofitted almost the entire LQ's cardiovascular system so now it can eat all the junk food in the world and be a couch potato and still it won't have a heart attack. Not to mention you don't spend a dime on drugs. Please post pics when you can with captions as you did with the 1/4" -> 3/8" conversion. I'll take a closer look at the float valves and most likely will have some more questions.
What about the flow meter (stock or retrofit.) Have you picked a model with the least flow resistance?
Finally, the WS particles seem larger than normal pool cloudiness particles, including CC, and I wonder if this won't damage the pump in the long run.

Thanks, I'll post some floats pics in a couple minutes.

As to the size of the WS particles, I figure the chemical already exists in the pool. The chemical reaction going on in the LQ is just causing it to group and clump. I would be more worried about it collecting on the filters then actually causing any harm to the pump itself. I'm not saying I have 100% solved this issue, but I think I'm on the right track. I'm still checking in on flow meters, I've found many..but all of them are kind of expensive. I'm also thinking of ways to automate the entire LQ with a solenoid valve a chlorine level probe and some software. Well a few others things as well. I'm a C# programmer with an electronics background. Built many a PC card and other data acquisition toys.

 

[Water_man]

Thanks, I'll post some floats pics in a couple minutes.

As to the size of the WS particles, I figure the chemical already exists in the pool. The chemical reaction going on in the LQ is just causing it to group and clump.

This is not so accurate. The top solution of the LQ has a higher pH than that of the pool, plus a much higher concentration of sodium ions, not to mention FC. The combination of high pH and flow conditions with a relatively high surface solid/liquid interface affects the deposits of the supersaturated calcium salt, and the result is large crystals of calcium carbonate.

I would be more worried about it collecting on the filters then actually causing any harm to the pump itself.

I don't think it should affect a DE filter. The calcium carbonate is inert and the filter is designed to hold inert particles. .

I'm also thinking of ways to automate the entire LQ with a solenoid valve a chlorine level probe and some software. Well a few others things as well.

This will be very exciting.

My response is in the "quote" marked in blue.

 

[Rabbit]

This is not so accurate. The top solution of the LQ has a higher pH than that of the pool, plus a much higher concentration of sodium ions, not to mention FC. The combination of high pH and flow conditions with a relatively high surface solid/liquid interface affects the deposits of the supersaturated calcium salt, and the result is large crystals of calcium carbonate.

Now, if we can just figure out how to make more of these sink to the bottom and stay put we would in effect be removing calcium from the pool water and adding a bit less salt. I think that's something Hasa claims the LQ can do. My CH is 400, so any less is a plus. It was up to 760 at one time, the previous home owners had no clue how to take care of a pool.

 

[Water_man]

Re: Tips to make the Liquidator liveable... - Borates!

As chem geek predicted in his calculations in this thread, 50 ppm borates can solve the WS problem. Last season I had noticeable WS, although there were no performance or flow problems. This year I added 50 ppm borates for all the other benefits, and my LQ operates now on 12% bleach instead of 6% last year. This means increased WS potential! The pool has been running now two months. No WS!