Spa not maintaining set tempurature

[ColoradoPool2022]

I've searched around this site and elsewhere and can't quite find my situation (or solution) and I've had the "pro" out 3 times who seems fairly useless. So let me ask the pro's here.
Note that I had the following issue which repaired the problem of the heater shutting off well before getting to the set temp-

Pentair ETi 400 shutting off after a few minutes

Hello- My pool guy was out this week repairing a valve that cracked due to water making it's way into the pool return- our pool is currently closed for the winter and the hot tub remains open; somehow the toggle on the actuator got flipped (???) and water made it's way into the pool returns...

www.troublefreepool.com

The issue since fixing the above is that when I set a desired temp in spa mode, it will bring the water up to that temp but then the heater will not turn on again. So I set it at 100 through the pentair screenlogic app (note that when in pool mode I have it at 73) and it brings the spa up to 101 but then the heater will not come back on to maintain the temp at 101. I can track the water temperature dropping in the app so it's not in my head. Even increasing the set temperature to say 103 will do nothing (my thinking was that maybe the delta between that actual water temp and set temp needs to be greater- but the water temp can drop to 98 and increasing to 103 does nothing as I said). However, if I turn off spa mode for a few seconds and then turn it back on, the heater will will kick on again but ultimately we land in the same place.

The "pro" replaced some thermostats and changed a setting (see next comment) but that didn't solve the issue. The setting he changed was selecting "Heater" under the spa mode as shown in the first attachment (screen shot is off the screenlogic app on my PC). Apparently if it's set to "Off" then it will heat up to the set temp but then not turn on again. Why would anyone ever want this setting at all?? After he did this it seemed ok for one or two uses but then resumed not maintaining the temp. Is it possible that what I'm seeing on the PC app is not synched with what's happening at my actual control panel? And why don't I have this issue in pool mode where it's maintaining the temp at 73??

I've seen some comments/suggestions to increase the "max temperature setting" on the heater to 104 for both pool and spa mode and letting the control panel control when the heater turns on. I'm not sure that's relevant to my system set up because when I go to the controls on the heater, nothing happens when I press "Pool", "Spa" or the up/down arrows. However, when the heater is running (after being kicked on by the control panel), I can go to it and adjust the temp but that just adjusts the temperature it's going for. Perhaps I'm misunderstanding the other threads re: the maximum temperature setting?

I've confirmed that the temp readings on my panel, app and actual heater unit are synched. I have not tested that they're correct using a pool thermometer (don't have one) but they "feel" accurate to me.

Lastly, and I may be crazy here, when messing around with things yesterday I had set the spa temperature to 101. After it hit that temp, and then the water dropped to 99, the little red flame on the app came on which I thought means that the heater is fired up. Well I went to the heater and it was not running. And I swear the app then said the temp was 100 as though it it had heated the water. You can even see a few minutes in my history in the second attachment where the app thinks that the heater ran (I circled it in blue). But I swear it didn't turn on and I didn't notice any change in temp.

Please help! Thank you

 

[Jimrahbe]

2022,

How is the heater being controlled by the EasyTouch? By a simple two wire cable to the heater's fireman's switch, or by an RS-485 com cable?

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[ajw22]

How is the heater being controlled by the EasyTouch? By a simple two wire cable to the heater's fireman's switch, or by an RS-485 com cable?

I did not think the ET can do RS-485 control of the connected MasterTemp.

 

[ColoradoPool2022]

How would I determine the type of wiring? From what I can see, there is one thin, flat wire that goes from the easy touch to the heater. It kind of looks like an old landline telephone wire and I can make out the writing "CL2" on it.

 

[ajw22]

How would I determine the type of wiring? From what I can see, there is one thin, flat wire that goes from the easy touch to the heater. It kind of looks like an old landline telephone wire and I can make out the writing "CL2" on it.

Open up the heater and the ET and see where the wire connects on both sides.

I think you will find the wire in the MasterTemp connected to the Firemans switch.

On the EasyTouch PCB the wire should connect to J19.

Pentair MasterTemp Heaters - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[ColoradoPool2022]

I appear to be wired the same as your pics- see attached. I also noticed a bunch of disconnected wires in the easy touch box (see 3rd picture). I'm guessing these are the actuators as part of the winterization of the pool and not related? Thx

 

[ajw22]

Each of those wires goes to the coil of a high voltage relay. If the relay is being used then it should be plugged into one of the AUX sockets on the PCB. Unused relays can be left unplugged.

Show us the lower high voltage relay section of the ET.

 

[ColoradoPool2022]

Each of those wires goes to the coil of a high voltage relay. If the relay is being used then it should be plugged into one of the AUX sockets on the PCB. Unused relays can be left unplugged.

Show us the lower high voltage relay section of the ET.

Here are the pics of the larger, lower panel.

 

[ajw22]

It looks like only one relay on the upper left is being used for the pool lights.

 

[ColoradoPool2022]

It looks like only one relay on the upper left is being used for the pool lights.

Ok. Is that bad? Is it related to my heater issue?

 

[ajw22]

Ok. Is that bad? Is it related to my heater issue?

Not bad and not related to the heater issue.

 

[1poolman1]

I appear to be wired the same as your pics- see attached. I also noticed a bunch of disconnected wires in the easy touch box (see 3rd picture). I'm guessing these are the actuators as part of the winterization of the pool and not related? Thx

Your heater should be set to 104, its highest setting, and left there. It will only be able to be set when the automation completes the control circuit and the heater powers on, so that's why you can't do it otherwise, that line has been cut and the small wire you pointed out completes the circuit when the Pentair calls for heat. That's the first issue that should be addressed to eliminate it as part or all of the problem.

 

[Jimrahbe]

2022,

From the EasyTouch's point of view, it just tells the heater to heat, or it does not.. It does not care if the system is in the pool mode or the spa made, the same exact circuit is used for both.

The heater should be set to full hot...

The EasyTouch monitors the water temp sensor (there is only one sensor, and it used for both the pool and spa). When the EasyTouch sees the water temp is below the set point that you entered, it will close a small relay on the card. This connects the two wires at J19, which tells the heater to heat. When the EasyTouch sees the water temp get above the set point, then it opens the relay and the heater shuts off.. I am not sure what the tolerance is, but I suspect a couple of degrees.

If the system works in the Pool Mode, then it has to work in the Spa Mode, since everything is the same.

Do you have a voltmeter???

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Jimrahbe]

2022,

It does not look like your SWCG transformer is wired to the pump/filter relay as "Required"... If your cell has any lights on, when the system is the Service mode or when it is not in the Pool or Spa modes, the cell could explode.

This problem has nothing to do with the heater issue. But is a major safety issue if not correct.

Could just be the pic.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Jimrahbe]

2022,

I went out to my system and used ScreenLogic to increase or decrease the set point..

Heater enable is on..

Every time I move the set point slightly above the actual water temp, the red flame comes on.. Every time move the set point slightly below the water temp, the red flame goes off.

Does your system do that???

Thanks

Jim R.

 

[ColoradoPool2022]

2022,

It does not look like your SWCG transformer is wired to the pump/filter relay as "Required"... If your cell has any lights on, when the system is the Service mode or when it is not in the Pool or Spa modes, the cell could explode.

This problem has nothing to do with the heater issue. But is a major safety issue if not correct.

Could just be the pic.

Thanks,

Jim R.

Jim- I checked and the lights on the SWCG do stay on in service or timeout mode. Sounds like when I have the company out to open it this Friday I should have them take a look. Checking your other suggestions re: the heater...
Thx

 

[ColoradoPool2022]

Your heater should be set to 104, its highest setting, and left there. It will only be able to be set when the automation completes the control circuit and the heater powers on, so that's why you can't do it otherwise, that line has been cut and the small wire you pointed out completes the circuit when the Pentair calls for heat. That's the first issue that should be addressed to eliminate it as part or all of the problem.

Poolman- what "cut" wire are you referring to? Those one with the red adapters on the end that aren't plugged in (first pic attached)? From the schematic (2nd picture) I assumed these go to the actuators and were unplugged when they winterized my pool (although not sure why one is still plugged in). Or do you think one of them has to do with the temp setting in spa mode? My pool is getting opened this Friday and I can ask the tech but he's not the tech who previously worked on my heater issue in my prior post. The guy coming Friday hadn't yet been trained on the eti400.

In any event, I turned up the heat setting in screenlogic on pool mode to fire up the heater. Went to the heater and pushed the up button. It looks like the max setting was set at 102 so I upped it to 104 (but again, I haven't had any issues in pool mode). I did the same in spa mode and it was already set to 104. So I'm guessing this maximum temp setting matter isn't the root cause?

 

[ColoradoPool2022]

2022,

I went out to my system and used ScreenLogic to increase or decrease the set point..

Heater enable is on..

Every time I move the set point slightly above the actual water temp, the red flame comes on.. Every time move the set point slightly below the water temp, the red flame goes off.

Does your system do that???

Thanks

Jim R.

Jim,
I checked and my app acts the same as you describe- red flame on when the heater kicks on and red flame off when the heater shuts off. What is really odd is when I'm actually using the spa I know that the red flame has come on when it's time to resume heating to maintain temp but the heater is not turning on. So it's like the app is telling the heater to come on but the heater doesn't respond. I've actually gotten out of the hot tub and gone to the heater and no lights are on and I don't hear the burners firing.

And to your other question, I don't have a voltmeter. And note my response above to 1Poolman (in case it adds anything useful).

I have a serious gremlin here!!

 

[ajw22]

When you have the red flame on the APP have you pressed SPA ON on the heater?

 

[ColoradoPool2022]

When you have the red flame on the APP have you pressed SPA ON on the heater?

I get the red flame when I press SPA on the app, not directly on the heater. Pressing SPA (or Pool) on the heater doesn't do anything as it seems to be getting controlled/overridden by the Easy Touch