Scale? I dunno what this is?
- Thread starter jester4
- Start date
I'm pretty sure I have a leak that is significant so thats why you see the constant addition of stabilizer. I wanted to get 1 season with the kids finally having a pool before I start investigating a leak. I suspect a suction leak from the skimmer. I did screw up the measurement early on, so I figured 1 sock filled is about .8 kilograms so I went with that. I hang the sock in the skimmer and let it dissolve slowly while the pumps run. I knew you guys would catch the heavy stabilizer additions. Lol. Salt too.
BenB
Gold Supporter
- Jul 24, 2020
- 277
- Pool Size
- 19500
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
Most phones from the last few years are IPxx rated, so waterproof for periods of time. I take underwater photos with mine as needed / for fun.
Obviously don't go dunking your phone without checking that
Obviously don't go dunking your phone without checking that
True, but I think its like 1 meter or something like that. Either way if I go for s dip tomorrow ill give it a go. I think try ziplock first though.Most phones from the last few years are IPxx rated, so waterproof for periods of time. I take underwater photos with mine as needed / for fun.
Obviously don't go dunking your phone without checking that
ferretbone
In The Industry
I guess my thinking is to far outside the box here on this one. So let me walk you through my line of thoughts last night and tonight. Because you have missed something, and are not painting a clear enough picture for anyone to help you.
I asked
"What kind of cleaner do you have a creapy crawly?"
A creapy crawly type cleaner sucks the floor. And they get caught on unlevel spots in the liners and sit there. I'm thinking a loud.
"How deep are those drains more than 8ft under. Im guessing. "
I asked that because how much could you really know about and explain in an articulate way what that stain feels like if those stains are 8,10, or 11ft down under water?
So it feels like cement is untrust worthy for now. I'm not testing you, I'm just trying to read how reliable some of this various intell really is.
"What feels like concrete the stain? Or whats under the vinyl?" Again stricken from the record because I dont trust this imput yet.
Thats why I wanted to know how deep your pool is. Have you been playing footsie with the stain all summer, or do you have to dive down for 30 seconds at a time in 8ft plus deep water? Have you really probed the texture? I'm worndering if the rough feeling is coming from under the liner or truly at the surface.
"Have you thrown in any sodium bicarb down there? In fact try to remember what you have thrown into that area I know you said salt and borax. "
Now I'm wondering what if somthing is sitting there un dissolved and feels crusty like cement. And is also white.
"It's got to be some kind of calcium hardening."
This is the only thing left I can think of absent more information. Which to me makes no sense going from what you say. So we are all looking for easier clues to trace down with our offensive sounding questions. Not to be a D, but your comment about you having to buy a $400 camera to find out what those spots are, is why I and others started with sesame street questions bud. Like I started with how deep is your pool. Its 8ft, so discribe the cement more. And what happend to the color of the liner after you scrubbed those first stains.? Thats where we should start. Did the liner stay faded? Or show color again? Did it remove the white stuff?
I asked
"What kind of cleaner do you have a creapy crawly?"
A creapy crawly type cleaner sucks the floor. And they get caught on unlevel spots in the liners and sit there. I'm thinking a loud.
"How deep are those drains more than 8ft under. Im guessing. "
I asked that because how much could you really know about and explain in an articulate way what that stain feels like if those stains are 8,10, or 11ft down under water?
So it feels like cement is untrust worthy for now. I'm not testing you, I'm just trying to read how reliable some of this various intell really is.
"What feels like concrete the stain? Or whats under the vinyl?" Again stricken from the record because I dont trust this imput yet.
Thats why I wanted to know how deep your pool is. Have you been playing footsie with the stain all summer, or do you have to dive down for 30 seconds at a time in 8ft plus deep water? Have you really probed the texture? I'm worndering if the rough feeling is coming from under the liner or truly at the surface.
"Have you thrown in any sodium bicarb down there? In fact try to remember what you have thrown into that area I know you said salt and borax. "
Now I'm wondering what if somthing is sitting there un dissolved and feels crusty like cement. And is also white.
"It's got to be some kind of calcium hardening."
This is the only thing left I can think of absent more information. Which to me makes no sense going from what you say. So we are all looking for easier clues to trace down with our offensive sounding questions. Not to be a D, but your comment about you having to buy a $400 camera to find out what those spots are, is why I and others started with sesame street questions bud. Like I started with how deep is your pool. Its 8ft, so discribe the cement more. And what happend to the color of the liner after you scrubbed those first stains.? Thats where we should start. Did the liner stay faded? Or show color again? Did it remove the white stuff?
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Hey, I actually answered most of your questions on post #10.
"What kind of cleaner do you have a creapy crawly?" - I have a maytronics robot for cleaner. It doesn't get hung up anywhere except the drains
"How deep are those drains more than 8ft under. Im guessing. " - yeah, the heavy one is near the drains so the worst one is about 8ft. I dove down there while my wife was stepping on my back and I can hold my breath a long time so I had time to examine, and it feels and looks like dried plaster. I has gotten thicker and worse as the season went on. As well as the other stains started appearing.
"What feels like concrete the stain? Or whats under the vinyl?" - The stain feels like plaster and doesn't seem to want to come off. The liner is smooth underneath as best as i can tell, cant be sure exactly under the heavy spot. The other stains there I tried with a brush and no affect.
"Have you thrown in any sodium bicarb down there? In fact try to remember what you have thrown into that area I know you said salt and borax. "
Now I'm wondering what if somthing is sitting there un dissolved and feels crusty like cement. And is also white. - no sodium bicarb thrown in. Any salt or borax put in the water is broadcast around the pool then brushed to mix in and followed by the robot to further mix in. I highly doubt there is settling
And what happend to the color of the liner after you scrubbed those first stains.? That's where we should start. Did the liner stay faded? Or show color again? Did it remove the white stuff? - the stains did not come off, maybe the brush I used is not abrasive enough but they remained. I also tried with a gentle cleaning pad and of course, nothing. There were other white spots in the pool at the beginning of the season that when you scrubbed them they turned dark green and then were easily removed. These were small spots or clusters that came off easy. After that they never came back
Aside from taking close up pictures I think I've described it as best as possible. True, I might have been snarky with the 400 dollar camera comment, but it felt like it was making fun of my post. This is not what I have come to expect from this forum which I've read almost top to bottom for the last year and the genuine helpful people. Adding 35mm camera links was also in bad taste, but kinda funny...........
I have done as much reading as possible to identify this problem, but everything points to different types of pools and not related to vinyl. This is why I posted looking for help as my research did not get me anywhere.
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Basically, yes, this is the first thread describing the problem that you are describing.
In fact, that’s why I initially assumed that you had a plaster pool because what you describe is just not a vinyl liner problem.
Even if the CSI was high, any scale would be uniform.
The only way that I know of that you get a spot built up that is raised and hard is from adding chemicals and letting them sit on the floor.
Other than that, there really isn’t anything that will cause the problem.
And it’s not going to grow slowly over time as you describe unless chemicals are being added and allowed to sit on the floor.
The only way that I know that will quickly create the problem that you are describing is if someone throws in two chemicals at the same time, especially calcium chloride and sodium carbonate.
Calcium chloride can stick to the bottom and form a spot like you are describing, especially if the water is cold.
The questions and answers seem to rule out the chemistry or chemical additions.
So, that leaves us with needing to actually see the spots close up.
Getting actual pictures is doable depending on how important it is to you to try to figure this out.
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Phone idea was one I never thought of. I actually did at first but thought the depth I would need to take it at would be greater than the ip68 rating of 1 meter so thought it would be a bad idea to risk it. Adding a ziplock bag could potentially be the correct move. I think this is the direction I will go. Hopefully I can take a swim tonight after work.
I of course want to figure this out as I thought I was diligent with my testing and chemical additions until the additional spots started to form. I admittedly did not ask for advise once they started appearing but after numerous attempts at scrubbing and getting nowhere, here I am. Hopefully I don't sound ungrateful for the help, I really am, I think the tone of the thread has turned sour and hope to remedy that. I wouldn't be here asking for help if I knew more than the members here.
jtpipkin
Bronze Supporter
when i suggested the ziplock , I was being facetious because james was insisting on pics. I would try it with today's phones, but I've also purchased something like this in the past when we did a cruise and wanted to make sure the phones were taken care of while we were out and about - https://www.amazon.com/Universal-Wa...s=waterproof+phone+case&qid=1630599903&sr=8-3
We still use one around the pool today and the little one has done videos and pictures underwater with it and everything was fine.
We still use one around the pool today and the little one has done videos and pictures underwater with it and everything was fine.
CVS will make digital pics from dig cards (SDS??) so I'm pretty sure they can mail off that disposable camera too.
Things are a little more expensive and harder to do here in Ontario. I honestly wouldn't even know where to bring 35mm film anywhere to develop. I can't remember the last time I seen that being done anywhere. I haven't actually looked but can't say thats still a thing. I'm surprised you guys have that so easy there.
Its probably still around but not popular for sure
Its probably still around but not popular for sure
You can still see the liner pattern, so it can't be too thick.
Are you sure that it is a buildup and not bleaching?
Are you sure that it is a buildup and not bleaching?
Its definitely build up. I can feel the bumps. I would say probably about 1/16" thick or so.
ferretbone
In The Industry
I'm with james, I can't think of anything at this point other than neighborhood kids throwing something in the pool. I'll pm you a reps number thats in the stain business if you'ed like so you can txt him those pictures.
Thanks
Thanks. For sure not kids throwing anything in. The only thing that I thought a possibility might be the high alkalinity? That's really the only number out of whack. I did read a blurb somewhere about keeping the ph low in order to combat scale, but who knows.
How much water are you losing per day?
You are adding a lot of cyanuric acid on a regular basis.
Can you describe how you add the cyanuric acid?
You are adding a lot of cyanuric acid on a regular basis.
Can you describe how you add the cyanuric acid?
Hang a sock in the skimmer to dissolve slowly. If its not fully dissolved by the next time I check, I leave it in there and count it as another add, so its not really as much as shown in logs. I'm new to this pool so I don't know what normal evaporation is around here, but knowing that I'm loosing some salt and cya I presume a leak? I figure around 1/2" to 3/4" per day at least