Pool is empty and under major reno... time to install a hydrostatic valve and/or replace main drain?

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T

TBizzle

Member
Jul 10, 2022
12
Puyallup, WA
Longtime lurker on these forums and blocks, I registered my TFP account today just so I could post this.

Quick details:
-Approx. 28k gallon inground concrete and plaster pool, probably build in the early/mid 70's.
-Live in Puyallup, WA with our pool sitting about 1000-1500 feet away from the river (guestimate)
-I'm already having to cut out/Corroseal rust spots from rebar and concrete contaminants, doing shell repairs with hydraulic cement, etc.
-Plaster repairs are planned for next week, waistline tile the week after, paint the week after that...
-Don't believe the main drain works at all (clogged maybe? filled in on purpose?)
-Main drain cover was just a piece of metal not attached...
-There is no hydrostatic valve anywhere in the deep end basin (9ft deep) or main drain
-I care about entrapment hazards/safety, want to be VGB compliant (just learned about it!), but I am also on a very tight budget

So here are my two questions:
-Do main drains even matter, or should I just fill it in with hydraulic cement and seal it over with plaster before I repaint the pool?
-Can/should I retrofit a hydrostatic valve while the pool is drained to address pool pop concerns? If yes, how complex is this? I have tools, muscles, and no fear, but limited time and money.

My assumption is I would need to cut out the concrete at/around the existing main drain and install/attach a new unit with a hydrostatic valve, then repair the concrete, plaster, etc. I am currently between jobs and have a goal to open this pool by July 31st in time for a summer party we have planned, and before I go back to work in August.

Thank you in advance!!!
 
A main drain is never needed in the pool.

How many skimmers do you have?

How deep is the deep end?

The pool has sat in the ground for 50 years without a hydrostatic drain. Why do you think it needs one now?

You have the pool drained now? What have you done to prevent the pool from popping out of the ground?
 
Welcome to the forum.
Be ware that paint will not last long. It will start to chalk nearly immediately. And flake in a year or two.
Modern paint does not last like the ones made in the past.
 
I am SO in for this one!!! His pool is 9 wonderful feet deep!!! SWEET!

I hear you on the tight budget. Good job doing what you can to get the pool up and swimming!

Like Marty said paint does not last but it can get it swimmable for now. I am going to ping someone else who painted their pool and link to their thread @Household6 It's Pool Repair Weekend!

I would love to see pics of the pool so we can cheer you on with your progress!

Kim:kim:
 
As ajw22 said, the pool hasn't popped in 50 years, why worry now. Drilling into the structure of a pool is not the best thing you could do. You could introduce a leak that was never there in the first place. You would also have to get through about a foot or more of reinforced gunite to get to the earth under the pool for a hydrostatic valve to work properly. When originally installed, they ae put in place first and then the gunite/shotcrete is placed around them.
 
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Hi Everyone - Thank you so much for the replies!
  • One skimmer (hate it by the way... plan to replace when we address the pool deck and coping)
  • Lazy L shaped pool that is between 3-6 feet in the shallow end and slopes quickly to ~9-9.5 ft in the deep end

As for the Hydrostatic Valve / @ajw22 "Why do you think it needs one now?"- Paranoia. Everything else done on this property has been a can of worms due to poor maintenance or low quality/skill from the builder and previous owner. If I can fix it, I want to. I intend to leave this home as part of my legacy, many decades from now.

I've identified all the loose spots with the hammer tapping technique, with two of us working in a grid pattern to avoid missing any spots. Since my last post, all the rusted spots have been cleaned out, converted/neutralized with Corroseal, and packed with Drylok Hydraulic Cement. I have a little more work to do on cleaning old thinset from the top border and we are ready for fresh plaster repair.

Another very hot day, so taking a break just now while I wait out the sun. Today was mostly focused on creating a safe workspace... pictures to follow shortly :sleep:
 
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Finally got some photos uploaded, so I'll sort them below in two sections (Before & Recent/Now)

But first, a photo of what we thought we were getting when we bought this house (listing photos):
ISecyuksnmfd640000000000.jpgISmulvpl5ga68i0000000000.jpg
ISu0o78s9oi38i0000000000.jpg

In full disclaimer, the entire house has been a complete gut and renovation over the last 6 years. Still... the real estate photographer did a great job putting lipstick on our first pig.

Before:
Attach77_20170628_172627.jpg
20170612_113536.jpg20170612_113511.jpg
 
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Current (recent, including some photos as of today):IMG_20220710_141214.jpg
IMG_20220712_132218.jpg

Got up early to fight the sun...

All delineated plaster and failed patches/repair spots have all been removed, and the stairs are ready for replaster and tile (backsplash/face only)

I'm exhausted! Heading back out for more clean-up.
 
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TBizzle said:
-Do main drains even matter
Click to expand...
I'm a new pool owner so take my comments with a grain of salt....

I think main (floor) drains are useful for at least four reasons:
1- If you have an in floor cleaning system (IFCS)
2- It helps circulate the water a little better/quicker when adding chemicals or salt
3- It allows you to brush debris on the pool floor directly into the floor drain
4- It allows you to partially or fully bypass the skimmer if you plan to be away for extended periods of time

I found reason #4 very useful just recently. My pool has an IFCS, acid injection system, SWCG and auto fill so the only thing that limits how long I can be away from the pool is my skimmer basket. We were away from our house for a week recently and I was worried about the skimmer basket getting plugged with debris while we were gone. So, I switched my suction to 85% floor drain and 15% skimmer. It worked great. Yes, we came home to more floating debris than I've seen before but the skimmer basket was fine. I suspect we could have been gone a couple more weeks easily. If I didn't have a floor drain, I wouldn't feel comfortable leaving my pool for extended periods of time.

Now if you don't have an IFCS, don't care how quickly chemicals get mixed, don't brush your pool and have somebody that will clean your basket while you're gone, you probably don't need a floor drain :)

If I ever build a pool, I'll have TWO floor drains!
 
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bertschb said:
I'm a new pool owner so take my comments with a grain of salt....

I think main (floor) drains are useful for at least four reasons:
1- If you have an in floor cleaning system (IFCS)
2- It helps circulate the water a little better/quicker when adding chemicals or salt
3- It allows you to brush debris on the pool floor directly into the floor drain
4- It allows you to partially bypass the skimmer if you plan to be away for extended periods of time

I found reason #3 very useful just recently. My pool has an IFCS, acid injection system, SWCG and auto fill so the only thing that limits how long I can be away from the pool is my skimmer basket. We were away from our house for a week recently and I was worried about the skimmer basket getting plugged with debris while we were gone. So, I switched my suction to 85% floor drain and 15% skimmer. It worked great. Yes, we came home to more floating debris than I've seen before but the skimmer basket was fine. I suspect we could have been gone a couple more weeks easily. If I didn't have a floor drain, I wouldn't feel comfortable leaving my pool for extended periods of time.

Now if you don't have an IFCS, don't care how quickly chemicals get mixed, don't brush your pool and have somebody that will clean your basket while you're gone, you probably don't need a floor drain :)

If I ever build a pool, I'll have TWO floor drains!
Click to expand...
Thank you for the thorough reply. Sadly, our pool is too old and is an incredibly basic design. Alas, one day I will build a new pool (somewhere else) and, when I do, your reply will come to mind as I install two floor drains and in IFCS :cool:
 
If you build a pool you will HAVE to have 2 main drains, or a channel drain, because of codes in most areas. If you do have two, the flow will be split and there will be less suction at each. Even channel drains have multiple ports in them so the flow in any one area is reduced.

With the exception of an IFC, a pool with a cleaner (which should be all pools) can stay just as clean, if not more. If it is a suction-side cleaner it acts as a moving main drain, not just cleaning but circulating water from the bottom of the pool. A pressure-side cleaner is always mixing water from the surface down to the bottom of the pool with the added benefit of cleaning when it is actually running. While a robotic cleaner isn't working all the time, the time it is running they move a lot of water and mix chemicals and clean very well.

At least 75% of all the pools I've ever dealt with have not had a working main drain with no issues.
 
1poolman1 said:
If you build a pool you will HAVE to have 2 main drains, or a channel drain, because of codes in most areas.
Click to expand...
My pool was built last summer and has a single main rectangular floor drain. It may have two pipes running to it but it's in the center of the pool. I would prefer to have two physical drains to split the floor into thirds. It would pull debris into the filter quicker because the debris would always be closer to a drain as it gets swirled around by the IFCS. If I had a robot or suction cleaner, one floor drain would be fine. Having said that, I agree a floor drain isn't required.
 
bertschb said:
My pool was built last summer and has a single main rectangular floor drain. It may have two pipes running to it but it's in the center of the pool. I would prefer to have two physical drains to split the floor into thirds. It would pull debris into the filter quicker because the debris would always be closer to a drain as it gets swirled around by the IFCS. If I had a robot or suction cleaner, one floor drain would be fine. Having said that, I agree a floor drain isn't required.
Click to expand...
About 32" long, maybe 6" wide, channel drain with multiple suction ports (3).
Remodelers tell me they are easier to install than splitting the drains. Probably easier for a builder as well. They are not inexpensive.
 
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