Pentair Ichlor30 and Automation

[Bluthgg]

Hi all,

I recently had a pool installed last year (October time frame). Since I have a SWCG (iChlor 30) and a SuperFlo VST pump - is there anyway I can connect the two to make sure the SWCG is only on when the pump is on? I believe in the manual I saw an RS485 connection between the power center and an IntelliFlo pump (though I have SuperFlo). Or maybe intelliconnect? Any recommendations?

I've been running the pump 24/7 and have the SWCG on - but I would like to run the pump at lower RPMs overnight or even shut it off if necessary without worrying about the SWCG.

With the VS pump I will get air in the lid at lower RPMs which can cause enough of an issue where the flow switch doesn't trip on the salt cell. Usually I will bump this up part way through the day to clear the bubble. I have had them test for air leaks and also have left the pump off with no noticeable leak as well. As far as I'm aware this is common with VS pumps.

Another question - if I have the salt cell "on" but the flow is low (so it's flashing) is that bad for the system or will it cause anything harmful with the iChlor30? I am making sure to generate enough Chlorine throughout the day.

Thank you!

 

[ajw22]

If the manufacture date of your Superflo VST pump was after 10/15/20 or 11/2/20 then you should have the RS-485 communication. In that case you can use the new Pentair IntelliConnect to control the pump and Ichlor30.

If you have an older pump then you can get an EasyTouch or IntelliCenter and control the Superflo VS pump through some high voltage relays with its digital inputs.

Another question - if I have the salt cell "on" but the flow is low (so it's flashing) is that bad for the system or will it cause anything harmful with the iChlor30? I am making sure to generate enough Chlorine throughout the day.

No, nothing bad will happen when the cell is indicating low flow and not generating chlorine. As long as there is some water flow. You do not want the cell powered with no water flow at all as that can cause an explosion in the cell.

 

[Bluthgg]

Thanks Allen! I’m going to doubt it’s 10/15 as the equipment came late September. Kind of wishing I got the intelliflow but if I'm being honest, since i'm running the pump 24/7 I think this should be fine. I was a bit worried that having the SCWG on with low flow would be an issue!

Do you have recommendations on the easytouch or intellicenter? Worth it to have overall?

 

[ajw22]

Do you have recommendations on the easytouch or intellicenter? Worth it to have overall?

Looks like you have a simple pool with no spa. I would just find settings that work with your pump and ichlor running 24/7 and set it and forget it. There is a lot of unnecessary tweaking that people do with their automation that really does not make a difference.

 

[Bluthgg]

Thanks again! Yes, I'm leaning towards that as well. I'm glad low flow isn't going to cause issues!

 

[Bluthgg]

Hi everyone,

A link to the video of what I'm seeing can be found here --> SuperFlow VST Air Bubble

I know there are numerous threads on this and I feel like I've read most of them! I know with a VS pump it's common to see air in the pump basket - what I'm wondering though - should it be increasing, or steady when running at the same RPM? Ideally I'd love to run the pump on a lower RPM especially since I'm running 24/7 but not if I'm getting these air bubble issues so frequently. My current schedule will run at 1800 for 13 hours, 2250 for 10:45 and then 2700 for 15 minutes (to purge any air).

• I can't seem to see bubbles in the return (except for the closet one from SWCG - which I've read is normal)
• The air bubble gets larger when running for an extended period of time at a lower rpm (~1800 or lower)
• I've checked the lid and gasket and I've lubed the o-ring
• I've checked the two drain plugs (they both have o-rings and look ok - I also added some teflon tape)
• I have not checked the union/gasket coming into the pump yet (waiting on my larger channel-locks to arrive)
• The air-bubble doesn't seem to increase if I shut the pump off (though I probably should re-test this again to make 100% sure)
• If I run at higher rpms (>2300) I can't see any air bubbles in the bakset

I've tried the water hose method but no dice. I'm going to try the soap bubble method next around the 3-way valve, drain plugs, etc. I've backwashed back in late December and can do it again but PSI hasn't really increased on the filter. Water levels look normal as well. Half-way up the skimmer.

Just want to make sure I'm not missing anything or maybe someone sees something differently in the video!

 

[ajw22]

I think you answered your own question...

I've read most of them! I know with a VS pump it's common to see air in the pump basket

What RPM do you want to run and what happens when you run at that RPM?

 

[Bluthgg]

Ideally I’d like to run at a much lower rpm if possible. At Least for the majority of the day. The threads I read don’t make it clear if the bubble should be getting larger and larger over time at the same rpm.
Is what I’m seeing (the video) normal for a BS pump or should it be a small air bubble That doesn’t increase?

 

[Bluthgg]

For reference, here is the pump running at 1800 RPM after 13 hours:

- SuperFlow VST 13 Hours Air Bubble

Compared to SuperFlow VST Air Bubble which was at 2 hours, it's quite large. This is one thing reading those threads I can't tell if this SHOULD be happening. I understand air getting in is normal at lower speeds (though 1800 doesn't seem really low). But should it continually increase like this?

 

[ajw22]

That bubble looks a bit large. But if no bubbles are being thrown out of the returns I would not worry about it.

I would check the water level of your skimmers and that your weir door is moving freely. My guess is due to winds or whatever your skimmer gulps some air once in a while and the air accumulates in the pump basket. At lower pump speeds the water flow is not enough to purge the air.

Post pics of your equipment and skimmers.

How many skimmers and main drain fo you have?

 

[Bluthgg]

Thanks again for the help Allen.

I have one skimmer and one main drain. Picture can be seen here (note the drain is missing a cover, they were out of stock during pandemic).

The drain goes to the skimmer basket and then is run back to the equipment pad.

Here is the equipment pad:


I took a quick video of the skimmer weir door. I can put more water in as well as it does look a bit low this morning.

Skimmer Weir

 

[ajw22]

I would try running your water level at or above the third screw.

 

[Bluthgg]

Been filling since your post! I’ve also had pump off since early this morning. Still full of water (minus the quarter sized air bubble that was in there).

Almost to third screw.

 

[Bluthgg]

Here is a video of the weir door and inside the skimmer with the water level to the third screw --> Higher water level skimmer

I've left the pump off until now. So from 9:30AM to 7:30PM there was no change in the pump basket. Stayed full of water minus the small air bubble that was in it. Will run overnight at 1800 RPM and check back in the morning.

I don't think I ever noticed a vortex in the skimmer basket, but maybe I'm looking at it wrong? Maybe the small movements still mean area can get in.

 

[Bluthgg]

Here is the video for this morning. Looks better after 12-13 hours of run time at 1800 rpm. At least if I compare to yesterday. Still seems like a decently sized air bubble in it though.

• Day 2 (increased water level) - 1800 RPM for 13 hours
• Day 1 - 1800 RPM for 12 hours

It's raining quite a bit today so probably won't be able to go out to test much. I might try bumping the RPM down to 1500 for tonight to see what it looks like in the morning. Any other suggestions?

 

[ajw22]

I would say the Day 2 bubble is acceptable and normal size.

What is the water level in your skimmer?

Monitor how the bubble size correlates with the water level.

 

[Bluthgg]

Since it's been raining this morning, a bit higher. I won't drain any just yet and check back later today/tonight.

 

[-MacGyver-]

Was holding off on replying since I have a Hayward VSP. But figured I'd provide my experience. My system isn't running, won't be for another 6+ weeks so cannot provide images until then.

My VSP does the same thing, but gets worse. I go about 2 - 3 weeks before I backwash and leave the pump running 24/7 at various low speeds, never the highest speed. After about 2 days the water is no longer touching the clear part of the pump basket cover. By the time a backwash is needed its down about a 1/4" from the lowest point of the cover.

It was worse, when the valve was set to pull mostly from the skimmer, and the water level would get to just above the inlet. Now its set to pull full from the main drain and skimmer (two lines, my main does not go through the skimmer luckily) and that made is better, as the water is now not just above the inlet. Don't ever get air bubbles at the returns until after the backwash.

My input lines to the pump are about 95-100 feet long and are 1.5" flexible PVC, there is a lot of restriction as a result. Think the installer should have used 2" rigid. Which is why I have to pull in from both main and skimmer, to keep from not pulling in air from the cover gasket - no matter how much o-ring safe lubricant I use air still gets in when in skimmer, or main, only.

Another thing I noticed about your install, that is similar to mine, is that the input to the pump does not have a short length of pipe to control head pressure. I think I calculated mine needed to be about 18 inches, but the value on my input is glued right to the input of the pump, no length of pipe. Another thing I did not know until well after they finished. (Caveat, I'm no expert and this may not contribute at all, just making an observation).

If that bubble at 13 hours is the largest you get you are in good shape.

 

[Bluthgg]

Appreciate your insight!

What I'm surprised is that 1600 RPM is too low of flow for the ichlor30. I just set to 1600 for this afternoon to test (just a small bubble in the pot that's forming) and giving me low flow. I would have thought that would be more than enough given the 2 inch pips/filter/pump/etc.. and the short enough runs. I'm going to try backwashing later today since my water is so high due to all the rain today.

Regarding the input to the pump - yes I am seeing that in the manual. Wish I would have caught that during the actual install (I did have them come back and add a check valve/sacrificial anode per manual). It says 5 x the suction pipe diameter, which would be 10 inches. It looks like that should be able to be done easily given the location of the pump and filter. How hard is it to remove a pipe from the 3 way valve? Unfortunately there isn't enough room to add a coupler.

 

[-MacGyver-]

My brother is a plumber and I have seen him use a tool to remove pipe left in a fitting after cutting the pipe away. He had to do this at my house on the DWV line due to where that builder put the sump pump connection, the stress cracked the pipe coming from the sump pump near the joint of the fitting. He was then able to glue a new piece of pipe into the fitting. We could not replace the entire fitting as there was not enough PVC material protruding from the wall to attach a new fitting without doing some significant repairs on the wall.

Another caveat. You *MUST* know what you are doing when using tools like this and removing pipe from the fitting. You have to have enough clean PVC, and a snug enough fit, for the PVC cement to work. Not having a clean enough surface, or removing too much material, the joint WILL FAIL! In my case he felt comfortable doing this on my DWV pipe due to no pressure. (Mods if you feel this entire comment should not be mentioned feel free to remove, or add any other warnings you see fit. Don't want to give anyone ideas to ruin their plumping that does not know what they are doing.)

So, while it *could* be done not sure I would trust the joint in that location when doing so. Instead, go with a new valve. In my situation I would need a new valve and the fitting that goes to the pump, which is why I have not tackled this on my system.