vanessadickson said:
Has your system paid for itself in the first year? Seems like a larger pool like yours would. Can you share your monthly chemical or yearly prior to the SWCG, and how much the system cost to install?
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- Thread starter RAR
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Has your system paid for itself in the first year? Seems like a larger pool like yours would. Can you share your monthly chemical or yearly prior to the SWCG, and how much the system cost to install?
I should know more about the cost and I'm sorry I don't. I really think your focus ought to be on whether you'd rather do salt or haul bleach. It will be a lot to handle in jugs for your pool. It will work fantastically though, that I assure you.
MiaOKC
0
Our 1970s pool is about 35,000 gallons, on the north side of our house, full sun all day long, in OKC. I'd calculated our sf once, I remember it was bigger than our first apt, somewhere in the 800-850sf range. Deep end is 7.5ft. We keep it open year round, but it's only warm enough to swim May/June - Sept/Oct. No cover.
My estimates of our costs are as follows:
Bleach, 121 oz, 8.25% Walmart brand $2.90/jug + 8.375% sales tax (for the most part, 12% pool liquid chlorine is not available in my area. None of the big pool stores/big box stores carry it, so I just go to the grocery store weekly to stock up). I need one jug day most days in the summer, my CYA has been between 25 and 45 at various points this summer. I need more bleach with rainy weather, and much less when the weather gets cooler. I'm guessing at a $90/mo bleach cost during my swim season, then far less once the weather cools off. I didn't test my water much over the winter, just kept an eye on the pool. During weird warm spells last winter, we added a little bleach, but for the most part, we chucked a floater in the water and tried to keep the leaves out using our robot.
Our pool has flooded several times this summer, so have used more bleach than anticipated. The last time, I loaded up the bleach (I wasn't precise, not trying to shock/SLAM, just trying to bump it up since there wouldn't be circulation for a while), turned the pump off, and added one container of floc ($16.99). It cleared the pool in less than a week and compared to the two weeks it took me last time (with the pump on constantly and shocking and brushing), plus the savings in having to shock only one week instead of two more than offset the cost of the floc (plus electricity savings in pump hours).
With bleach overruns during flooding times (could be avoided if we had better drainage around the pool, which is on the to-do list) I'm guessing we've spent an add'l $150 on SLAM bleach over the course of the summer above and beyond regular maintenance.
Baking soda: I have needed to add some baking soda earlier this summer, maybe $10 total.
Borax: $0 none needed this year
Stabilizer: Spent about $30 on 8lbs of CYA at the beginning of the summer, IIRC.
Electricity: We run our pump during our utility's low period, $0.05/kwh, in two four hour increments, 9am-1pm and 9pm-1am, and I think this costs us about $12/week in the summer. In the winter, it's set to go if there is a freeze and I cannot recall how many hours I ran it on a consistent basis last winter. I probably had it run a few hours overnight, and in non-summer months we pay $0.09/kwh. We do not have a new or fancy pump, I think it's 1hp or 1.5hp and came with the house.
Overall, I guess we are paying about $150/mo during swim season (guess 6 months last year, closer to 4 months due to weirdly cool weather this year), which is worth it to us since we use our pool nearly every day, and hang by the pool instead of going to movies, out to eat, whatever.
For our large pool, on my wish list is a Stenner pump, simply to release us from the EVERY NIGHT task of adding bleach. It's become part of the routine "alarm set? garage door closed? pool bleached?" but it is kind of a PITA after three months of nightly nagging of DH. It's not that big of a deal to procure the bleach weekly, it can be inconvenient, sure, especially if Walmart is nearly out of bleach on Sundays as often happens, and we can only get 4 jugs, so need to go back by Wed. to get more.
The hauling isn't such a problem, they aren't heavy (although, the cashiers joke with us and we tell them we are cleaning up a murder scene when we have a cart devoted completely to bleach), but the nightly chore is a drag. I'd love a Stenner pump that let's me cut it down to even weekly or every two weeks. I am not that enthused by the SWG, even if I didn't have my rock wall and coping (it's already falling apart, the SWG couldn't hurt it anymore) but because my neighbors did it for their large pool and said it couldn't keep up during last summer when it was so hot and drought-y. I understand you need to oversize the SWG for the pool, and don't know if they did, but to have done all that to automate and STILL need to add bleach? Bummer.
Good luck!
My estimates of our costs are as follows:
Bleach, 121 oz, 8.25% Walmart brand $2.90/jug + 8.375% sales tax (for the most part, 12% pool liquid chlorine is not available in my area. None of the big pool stores/big box stores carry it, so I just go to the grocery store weekly to stock up). I need one jug day most days in the summer, my CYA has been between 25 and 45 at various points this summer. I need more bleach with rainy weather, and much less when the weather gets cooler. I'm guessing at a $90/mo bleach cost during my swim season, then far less once the weather cools off. I didn't test my water much over the winter, just kept an eye on the pool. During weird warm spells last winter, we added a little bleach, but for the most part, we chucked a floater in the water and tried to keep the leaves out using our robot.
Our pool has flooded several times this summer, so have used more bleach than anticipated. The last time, I loaded up the bleach (I wasn't precise, not trying to shock/SLAM, just trying to bump it up since there wouldn't be circulation for a while), turned the pump off, and added one container of floc ($16.99). It cleared the pool in less than a week and compared to the two weeks it took me last time (with the pump on constantly and shocking and brushing), plus the savings in having to shock only one week instead of two more than offset the cost of the floc (plus electricity savings in pump hours).
With bleach overruns during flooding times (could be avoided if we had better drainage around the pool, which is on the to-do list) I'm guessing we've spent an add'l $150 on SLAM bleach over the course of the summer above and beyond regular maintenance.
Baking soda: I have needed to add some baking soda earlier this summer, maybe $10 total.
Borax: $0 none needed this year
Stabilizer: Spent about $30 on 8lbs of CYA at the beginning of the summer, IIRC.
Electricity: We run our pump during our utility's low period, $0.05/kwh, in two four hour increments, 9am-1pm and 9pm-1am, and I think this costs us about $12/week in the summer. In the winter, it's set to go if there is a freeze and I cannot recall how many hours I ran it on a consistent basis last winter. I probably had it run a few hours overnight, and in non-summer months we pay $0.09/kwh. We do not have a new or fancy pump, I think it's 1hp or 1.5hp and came with the house.
Overall, I guess we are paying about $150/mo during swim season (guess 6 months last year, closer to 4 months due to weirdly cool weather this year), which is worth it to us since we use our pool nearly every day, and hang by the pool instead of going to movies, out to eat, whatever.
For our large pool, on my wish list is a Stenner pump, simply to release us from the EVERY NIGHT task of adding bleach. It's become part of the routine "alarm set? garage door closed? pool bleached?" but it is kind of a PITA after three months of nightly nagging of DH. It's not that big of a deal to procure the bleach weekly, it can be inconvenient, sure, especially if Walmart is nearly out of bleach on Sundays as often happens, and we can only get 4 jugs, so need to go back by Wed. to get more.
The hauling isn't such a problem, they aren't heavy (although, the cashiers joke with us and we tell them we are cleaning up a murder scene when we have a cart devoted completely to bleach), but the nightly chore is a drag. I'd love a Stenner pump that let's me cut it down to even weekly or every two weeks. I am not that enthused by the SWG, even if I didn't have my rock wall and coping (it's already falling apart, the SWG couldn't hurt it anymore) but because my neighbors did it for their large pool and said it couldn't keep up during last summer when it was so hot and drought-y. I understand you need to oversize the SWG for the pool, and don't know if they did, but to have done all that to automate and STILL need to add bleach? Bummer.
Good luck!
MiaOKC said:
A proprly sized SWG, maintained according to the BBB NEVER needs chlorine added. Either the neighbors dont have ther right level CYA to hold their chlorine, or the wrong size SWG for their pool. Thats whats magic and wonderful about a SWG and what Pool School teaches. My SWG in a big pool runs at about 15% capacity most of the time. On those really sunny hot days I just turn the knob up to about 25-30%. Way better than any trip to Walmart for chlorine, a real drag for me bc I live way out in the country.
SWG paid itself off in a year, but more importantly for me was the TIME I save by having the system chlorinate for me while I do other things.
Hey Mia! 
That is some good info, so thanks for posting all that.
I am going to look into the drum option from a commodity supplier or two around here and when I do, I'll post a thread. I don't know how it will go, but these companies supply my customers with bulk common stuff like bleach and acid. I just don't know what they will do for individuals wanting one 55 drum of 12% at a time. It sure would be nice if they would do it though. I know these companies exist around OKC for sure as well.
RAR, I don't know where you are, but it may be an option for you too. Either way, I am going manual bleach for the first season and see how it goes. I'll be treating somewhere around 30K gallons in mine.
I hear you too Vanessa and believe me, I have thought a lot about going salt at some point. It just conflicts with my material selections and I'm not sure I want a salt pool.
That is some good info, so thanks for posting all that.
I am going to look into the drum option from a commodity supplier or two around here and when I do, I'll post a thread. I don't know how it will go, but these companies supply my customers with bulk common stuff like bleach and acid. I just don't know what they will do for individuals wanting one 55 drum of 12% at a time. It sure would be nice if they would do it though. I know these companies exist around OKC for sure as well.
RAR, I don't know where you are, but it may be an option for you too. Either way, I am going manual bleach for the first season and see how it goes. I'll be treating somewhere around 30K gallons in mine.
I hear you too Vanessa and believe me, I have thought a lot about going salt at some point. It just conflicts with my material selections and I'm not sure I want a salt pool.
MiaOKC
0
Vanessa, I do not know enough about what the neighbors do to say one way or another, they just mentioned that to me in passing. Since I'm not in the market for a SWG, I didn't do much to follow up with it. I did think that I'd read on TFP that the SWG needs to be oversized, but I could be dreaming that - again, since it's not top of mind for me, I may have just glossed over it. Sorry if I added confusion to the discussion by relating that info.
Brushpup, you are welcome! In June, my goal was to raise my CYA to close to 50 to help me maintain my chlorine levels better this summer than last when I kept it around 25 or 30. I got it up to 45 at one point, I think, but we have had tons and tons of rain, and I bet I've pumped 24 inches of water off my pool this summer between rain and vac to waste to clean up flood dirt, so at this time, the CYA is closer to 25. However, we just had a bizarre week, where our highs were in the low 80s every day and overnight lows in the 60s. That is not the Oklahoma summer I am used to! So it hasn't been a terrible thing to let the CYA drift down. When I tested the other night and found it at 25 after our most recent pump-off and clean-up, I threw the floater back in. We are not quite done with swim season yet and I think we will be getting hotter temps soon, so the extra stabilizer will come in handy.
Brushpup, you are welcome! In June, my goal was to raise my CYA to close to 50 to help me maintain my chlorine levels better this summer than last when I kept it around 25 or 30. I got it up to 45 at one point, I think, but we have had tons and tons of rain, and I bet I've pumped 24 inches of water off my pool this summer between rain and vac to waste to clean up flood dirt, so at this time, the CYA is closer to 25. However, we just had a bizarre week, where our highs were in the low 80s every day and overnight lows in the 60s. That is not the Oklahoma summer I am used to! So it hasn't been a terrible thing to let the CYA drift down. When I tested the other night and found it at 25 after our most recent pump-off and clean-up, I threw the floater back in. We are not quite done with swim season yet and I think we will be getting hotter temps soon, so the extra stabilizer will come in handy.
So I'm really torn between flagstone deck, or something else and the SWCG. I've been doing some searching here on TFP, and it sounds like the argument for higher CYA and lower FC for salt water pools is the ability to self maintain the chlorine and not letting it fall below the minimum. Using a lower CYA would make the SWCG work too hard and may not be able to keep up during sunlight/uv exposure.
So can we use the same principle for a liquid chlorine injected pool; ie, Stenner pump? Using a CYA of 60-80 and maintaing a FC of 4-5? Assuming the high CYA will minimize FC/UV loss to .5-1 ppm a day while maintaing FC levels via an injection system such as the Stenner?
So can we use the same principle for a liquid chlorine injected pool; ie, Stenner pump? Using a CYA of 60-80 and maintaing a FC of 4-5? Assuming the high CYA will minimize FC/UV loss to .5-1 ppm a day while maintaing FC levels via an injection system such as the Stenner?
The answer is a resounding, "Maybe". Stenner systems don't quite create the VERY high FC levels right at the source like an SWG does, so they may not be quite as effective as an SWG operating at the same FC levels. I don't believe anyone knows for sure.
TFP proposes suggested guidelines for pool water management but those guidelines are not absolute with no room for variance. If I decide to hook up a stenner pump, I will use the manually chlorinated guidelines. Any cost savings running FC lower than that would be immediately oblitereated if you develop an algae bloom.
Not sure where you saw that but that will NOT be the case. 2-3 ppm FC loss daily is just about average.
I will jump in here- I've been taking care of my pool since May. Just keeping the chlorine level up and measuring 1 to 2 times a day was a royal pain. And twice it suddenly dropped on me and I had mustard algae, forcing me to SLAM to the pool, which is another pain the rear end. I went with a pool pilot nano+ (you'll need a digital for your size pool). I HIGHLY recommend going with a SWG. I haven't put in a drop of chlorine in the pool since I installed it. No algae. I can skip a day or two of testing the water. Now I just keep an eye on the rest, like CYA and PH and they change pretty slow. So I would do whatever it takes to go SWG- running to costco every 2 weeks for jugs of bleach stinks.