Need help organizing thoughts

[sadds]

First post here. Been reading through and learning.

So my wife and I are considering building a pool. We had our first consult and worked through a design. Got the quote and were blown away at the cost.

Here's what we are looking at:
We are located in north texas 3 kids early elementary
Rectangular pool with autocover (non negotiable)
Salt water
Heat pump/chiller
No spa
Raised beam/water feature
Sr smith slide
1050' of decking
Pentair products, vsf, automation (but old system need to talk to them if we move forward)
Ect

So after getting the quote and seeing the cost it's got me rethinking everything. do we need a slide, do we need a raised beam, do we need a pool!

The pentair 140 h/c is 10k after installation. I am hesitant to use gas because we have buried propane that is our central heat and is expensive. However, maybe with the cover and being Texas I could use gas and use it to get the temp up earlier in the year and with the cover use it sparingly.

Then I have gotten on a tangent that if I am going to use a gas heater maybe I should look at a spa as well. Wife wants a spa, I don't care. I think it might help with resell down the line. But of course adding a spa probably won't reduce my already sticker shocked price.

if i get a spa, with the cover, should we do it sunken into the pool interior? Or raised?

Then I think maybe no heater and see how it all works out. But then running propane or electric later would be under a huge amount of new concrete.

Now maybe I'll just scrap the whole pool and take another vacation!!!! Analysis paralysis. Give me some help please

 

[HermanTX]

Welcome to TFP.
For sure there are lots of options and it is good that you start with the list that is non-negotiable.
A rectangle pool with a cover can have a sunken spa so everything is covered. However a spa would likely require a heater and a heat pump makes it more challenging. I would go with propane. Have you considered just a pool and purchase a proper spa separately to be put on the porch? Those spas are easier to heat and purchased can be delayed to allow for better cash flow.

With 3 little ones, how do you plan to use the pool? You have not talked max depth but with a slide you may need deeper than shallow. Need to find the local rules for use of a slide and corresponding depth.

For example, we have used out pool & spa at Christmas and New Years as well as swimming in March so a heater is important if you want to do something special on those winter days. We are in Houston area so different from your weather patterns. Where in North Texas - north of Dallas or up in the panhandle? Big difference in temperatures and if you would even use the pool in winter months. Maybe that is when that separate spa becomes more important. If not, then keep it simple for kids to have fun. Kids grow so be sure to consider changes from simply learning to swim to games such as diving deep for rings or Marco Polo or then doing cannonballs to show off to their friends or impress a “friend”

Don’t ever buy a feature because it will help resale. Buy the things that will make you and your family happy and want to swim more. Is the water features really needed? Trade off those for having the slide the kids will enjoy.

I sure others will chime in but do things that will make the pool enjoyable for all.

 

[elleb]

Hi and welcome to TFP! You may have already considered this, but if not, thank me later : my advice is to add a contingency fund into your budget. Put aside at least 15% - 20% of the total build cost or your total budget for things that may crop up during construction. Our build did not call for a retaining wall during design phase, but once we got the gunite in and were getting closer to equipment it was necessary to add one too keep our pool from being flooded with ga clay to the tune of $12k. We did have a contingency fund already in the budget and it gave us peace of mind when we found out we needed it because we had a large enough fund to cover the expense. If you end up not having to use it, great - furnish your pool, throw a party, and invest the rest or put it in savings, but it's better to have one than not have one.

 

[Texas Splash]

Decision decision. Welcome to TFP!

 

[Kaylee34]

Big expense, big responsibility. A pool is like a pet, you can't leave it when you're tired and don't want to deal with it. It's also going to be a permanent one until you sell the house so be ready for that.

What's the purpose of the pool? A family pool, a lap or play pool? A backyard entertainment area for adults? That's where you start. Get the pool part right and most everything else can be added on or changed later. Landscaping, pergolas, additional decking, outdoor kitchens.

Break it down into negotiable and non-negotiable. Necessary and non-necessary. Then start considering options as far as immediate need. You want to incorporate as much into the build as you can. Water features are nice but they're not necessary. They also come with their own set of problems. If you really want it, get it now. Not something to try to add on later. Same with an integrated spa but a standalone might get more actual use year round. Slides are nice but the kids will have just as much fun without one. Keep in mind, kids grow.

Heaters/chillers are great. Look at the options vs your budget. You can always leave the unit itself off for now. It's easier to get it done with the build but you could also plan for it in the future. Make sure there's room at the pad and have everything stubbed out during the build. Budget to add it on next year.

There's a few threads here where people chimed in on what they'd have done different during their builds. Those would be good reading as well.

 

[sadds]

Thanks for the replies so far. I left off a few details from my op.

We are north of Dallas. This will be a sport pool no deeper than 5 or 6' have not decided. Either depth works with the slide and I have already called my insurance and it's good there.

My in laws have a sport pool so we have a good idea that's we would like it. Pool would be for the kids to play, adults to lounge and get in good family time. We are not big entertainers. Would probably have some family pool parties but nothing crazy.

 

[sadds]

Good info. I know to add contingency but wasn't sure how much. I can't believe how expensive pools are.

Edit can't get the quotes to work but this in response to the contingency advice.

 

[sadds]

As to a seperate spa we have thought about. We have an outdoor sauna so I think a seperate hot tub would be redundant. Also don't want water chemistry on a seprate tub to deal with. And I think my wife wants it more as a spot to sit and heat up or relax not as a real heavy duty hot tub use. That's how her parents is used.

Main use of a heater would be to start swimming a little earlier and swim later. I have no interest in swimming when the outside air temperature is cold. I would like the pool to be warm when it's nice outside but not hot enough consistently to have the water warm yet.

Again, my inlaws use their heater this way. They have no cover so as soon as the heater is off the water is cold the next day. Wondering how much a cover mitigates this.

 

[HermanTX]

Main use of a heater would be to start swimming a little earlier and swim later. I have no interest in swimming when the outside air temperature is cold. I would like the pool to be warm when it's nice outside but not hot enough consistently to have the water warm yet.

Again, my inlaws use their heater this way. They have no cover so as soon as the heater is off the water is cold the next day. Wondering how much a cover mitigates this.

A cover will retain heat and a cover is an excellent safety feature. If you plan to heat the pool, then suggest a propane heater over a heat pump. Purchase a 400k BTU unit as bigger is better over the long run. Research the site on usefulness of a cooler. If you plan to add it later, ensure your equipment pad is large enough to place it and also discuss the plumbing aspect as it is a little different to hook up so plan for all of that now.

 

[Hootz]

We bought our current house with an existing pool. I was sceptical of the heat pump but after several seasons I am happy with it. I have to think ahead because the heater is slow but steady to heat the water. Wife likes it around 90 degrees so if the heater is not on I start the day before to get the water up to temp. The last week I have tried leaving the heater on to maintain the temp. I don't run my pump after 8 PM so it kicks on in the morning and the heater runs for about 3 hours. Daytime temps have been mid to upper 90s. Constantly heated water does seem to cause more water loss due to evaporation (a cover would definitely be an advantage). I have an attached spa with separate cover and when the heater hasn't been running takes about 45 minutes to bring to 100 degrees. I don't have any scientific evidence to back it up but after talking to other pool owners with gas heaters I feel that the heat pump is slightly less costly to run.

 

[KevMo]

You can always delay buying equipment like a heater. If you delay have them run the propane/gas line now and plump the bad as though you have the heater. This will make it so much cheaper to add it early on. Do the same for any equipment you delay. My other piece of advice is have them run extra electrical conduit to any places you might want to add something later. Here are some examples that I did:

• 1" or 1-1/2" conduit from the house to the equipment pad for low voltage communication lines
• 3/4" conduit from equipment pad to some places around the outside of the deck for electrical outlets
• 1" conduit from wherever you might put a sound system to future speakers (you don't have to run the conduit all the way to the speaker locations; you can use direct burial wire for the final positions)
• 3/4" or 1" conduit under any sidewalk or deck area where you might want to feed wires later
• 3/4" or 1" conduit from equipment pad to the starts of any landscape lighting starting positions
• 2" schedule 40 PVC plumbing pipe under the deck or sidewalks so you could sleeve in any sprinkler or plumbing lines in the future

The idea is to envision your pool and deck complete and your wish list of things you might want to add in the future that would require digging up your yard or busting up your deck. Then you you put conduit or oversized pipe sleeves. Depending on your ddistances this might add from a few hundred to $1,000 or so, but you will thankful later. I did all of the above and more for pretty long runs - 120' from house to equipment pad and 2,500 sq ft of deck. The plumbing & electrical crew charged around $1,000 for materials and labor. That included heating and bending the electrical conduit. If your builder or crew wants to charge a lot for the add-ons then you can just have them make any extra trenches while they are digging and lay the conduit and pipes yourself between them laying their pipes and backfilliing the trenches. Some water, Gatorade, and snacks for the P&E crews will go along way towards them helping you.

Let me know if you have any questions about how I did anything.

 

[sadds]

You can always delay buying equipment like a heater. If you delay have them run the propane/gas line now and plump the bad as though you have the heater. This will make it so much cheaper to add it early on. Do the same for any equipment you delay. My other piece of advice is have them run extra electrical conduit to any places you might want to add something later. Here are some examples that I did:

• 1" or 1-1/2" conduit from the house to the equipment pad for low voltage communication lines
• 3/4" conduit from equipment pad to some places around the outside of the deck for electrical outlets
• 1" conduit from wherever you might put a sound system to future speakers (you don't have to run the conduit all the way to the speaker locations; you can use direct burial wire for the final positions)
• 3/4" or 1" conduit under any sidewalk or deck area where you might want to feed wires later
• 3/4" or 1" conduit from equipment pad to the starts of any landscape lighting starting positions
• 2" schedule 40 PVC plumbing pipe under the deck or sidewalks so you could sleeve in any sprinkler or plumbing lines in the future

The idea is to envision your pool and deck complete and your wish list of things you might want to add in the future that would require digging up your yard or busting up your deck. Then you you put conduit or oversized pipe sleeves. Depending on your ddistances this might add from a few hundred to $1,000 or so, but you will thankful later. I did all of the above and more for pretty long runs - 120' from house to equipment pad and 2,500 sq ft of deck. The plumbing & electrical crew charged around $1,000 for materials and labor. That included heating and bending the electrical conduit. If your builder or crew wants to charge a lot for the add-ons then you can just have them make any extra trenches while they are digging and lay the conduit and pipes yourself between them laying their pipes and backfilliing the trenches. Some water, Gatorade, and snacks for the P&E crews will go along way towards them helping you.

Let me know if you have any questions about how I did anything.

Sorry for the delay jist got home from vacation.

Thank you for the incredibly detailed response. I will re read this several times if we move forward!

 

[sadds]

Next question. Current design has 3 waterfalls on a raised beam. Bad idea with an autocover? We are in DFW and get some hard freezes. Would I have to open the cover and run the water feature to protect it? Looks like features run off the main pump, fyi.

 

[HermanTX]

Next question. Current design has 3 waterfalls on a raised beam. Bad idea with an autocover? We are in DFW and get some hard freezes. Would I have to open the cover and run the water feature to protect it? Looks like features run off the main pump, fyi.

If all your pipework above ground leading to the waterfalls is protected then you should be fine or if you can drain the water from those pipes. Most water falls I have seen have some exposure on the backside where the pipe comes out of the ground and there may be a valve.
It is very good to consider freezing weather in your designs since you have a cover. You can discuss with your PB to determine how best to protect it.

 

[Time2Relax]

I used to find that people with in-ground spas rarely used them....1) takes a lot of forethought, you need to start the heater and switch the valves well in advance of using, 2) It costs a small fortune.
Better a self-contained spa that stays hot all the time and is ready for use whenever the mood strikes you, like the middle of the night!