I have two skimmers. The suction on both of them is so low that water sits high above the skimmer basket and the skimmer does not pull in the debris from the surface of the water. The debris just floats on by. I installed new weirs a few days ago but this did not noticeably help with the suction, which I desperately need in order to vacuum the dead algae that is currently on the pool floor. I do not believe that there is an obstruction in the skimmer lines since the pump runs fine (no air bubbles in the pump basket) when I close off the main drain and run it using both skimmers together or each skimmer individually. I just replaced the diverter valves and the pump basket lid and o-ring but still no change. Please provide some possible solutions.
Low Skimmer Suction
- Thread starter RGSLAW
- Start date
Can you better explain how your pool is plumbed? Or add pictures.
You are saying that the pump runs fine if only 1 suction line is used at a time?
What is the history of your filter pressure?
I guess I am not really seeing the problem. If you are trying to use 3 different suctions sources at the same time, then yes each skimmer will be fairly weak.
If you are trying to vacuum, then you likely need to force all the suction to the single port where you hook up the vacuum.
You are saying that the pump runs fine if only 1 suction line is used at a time?
What is the history of your filter pressure?
I guess I am not really seeing the problem. If you are trying to use 3 different suctions sources at the same time, then yes each skimmer will be fairly weak.
If you are trying to vacuum, then you likely need to force all the suction to the single port where you hook up the vacuum.
Hi Jason,
I'm sorry for the delay in responding to your questions; work has been so hectic, I haven't had a moment to breathe. I will try to take pictures tomorrow, but in the meantime, I'll attempt to explain the setup. There are four pipes coming out of the ground two are labeled as skimmers, one spa, and the other main drain. These each connect into the run of pipe that goes into the pump. The two skimmers share a diverter valve (allowing for each to be separately turned off). The spa and main drain each have their own diverter valve. There is a run of pipe that goes from the pump into a three-way Jandy valve that controls the flow of water to the filter and waste hose.
The history of the filter pressure is that it generally runs 15 psi with new filters, which we just purchased last pool season. However, the pressure has been consistently between 25 and 30 psi, even though we have repeatedly cleaned the filters. By the way, it seems that if we close the air valve, the top of the filter housing pops off, so we have kept it open. I hope this makes some sense.
When I said that the pump runs "fine" if only one suction line is used at a time, I mean that it does not lose prime or affect the filter pressure. I am not trying to use all three all suction sources at the same time. In fact, I have shut off the far skimmer and the main drains, so that all suction would come from the skimmer closer to the pump only. However, there is still very low suction, not even enough to pull the skimmer basket down.
I'm sorry for the delay in responding to your questions; work has been so hectic, I haven't had a moment to breathe. I will try to take pictures tomorrow, but in the meantime, I'll attempt to explain the setup. There are four pipes coming out of the ground two are labeled as skimmers, one spa, and the other main drain. These each connect into the run of pipe that goes into the pump. The two skimmers share a diverter valve (allowing for each to be separately turned off). The spa and main drain each have their own diverter valve. There is a run of pipe that goes from the pump into a three-way Jandy valve that controls the flow of water to the filter and waste hose.
The history of the filter pressure is that it generally runs 15 psi with new filters, which we just purchased last pool season. However, the pressure has been consistently between 25 and 30 psi, even though we have repeatedly cleaned the filters. By the way, it seems that if we close the air valve, the top of the filter housing pops off, so we have kept it open. I hope this makes some sense.
When I said that the pump runs "fine" if only one suction line is used at a time, I mean that it does not lose prime or affect the filter pressure. I am not trying to use all three all suction sources at the same time. In fact, I have shut off the far skimmer and the main drains, so that all suction would come from the skimmer closer to the pump only. However, there is still very low suction, not even enough to pull the skimmer basket down.
Sounds like you might have more problems than just being able to vacuum.
Are you saying that you have to leave the bleed valve on the filter open at all time or the filter pops open? Is there just air coming out of it constantly? That is not correct.
You pressure is way too high. I am wondering if your cartridges are scaled up or something. After cleaning they should be very near the normal new pressure of 15psi.
I am thinking you must have a massive suction side air leak.
Are you saying that you have to leave the bleed valve on the filter open at all time or the filter pops open? Is there just air coming out of it constantly? That is not correct.
You pressure is way too high. I am wondering if your cartridges are scaled up or something. After cleaning they should be very near the normal new pressure of 15psi.
I am thinking you must have a massive suction side air leak.
Yes, we have left the air bleed valve open since opening the pool a week and a half ago. There is a little air coming out of it but no stream of water. I know this is not normal, but operating it in this state allowed us to SLAM the pool taking the water from brown to clear and getting rid of very high CC.
Yes, we are aware that the pressure is definitely too high. My husband cleaned the filters again today and the pressure dropped initially to 20 psi and then increased to 25 psi. I think we may have to soak the filters in some detergent or TSP, since we have only used them for about four months last season.
Unfortunately, I think you may be right about the massive suction side air leak. We replaced the diverter valves to the skimmers and main drain last week in case the air leak was there. This week, we replaced the pump lid and o-ring. We will try to replace the run of pipe leading into the pump tomorrow, since my husband had smacked on a bunch of putty and glue there about two years ago in an amateur attempt to fix what he believed was a leak at that location. If that is the problem and we can successfully replace that pipe, then maybe that will be the fix. I will report on how that turns out. Thank you for taking the time to help.
Yes, we are aware that the pressure is definitely too high. My husband cleaned the filters again today and the pressure dropped initially to 20 psi and then increased to 25 psi. I think we may have to soak the filters in some detergent or TSP, since we have only used them for about four months last season.
Unfortunately, I think you may be right about the massive suction side air leak. We replaced the diverter valves to the skimmers and main drain last week in case the air leak was there. This week, we replaced the pump lid and o-ring. We will try to replace the run of pipe leading into the pump tomorrow, since my husband had smacked on a bunch of putty and glue there about two years ago in an amateur attempt to fix what he believed was a leak at that location. If that is the problem and we can successfully replace that pipe, then maybe that will be the fix. I will report on how that turns out. Thank you for taking the time to help.
If you leave the air relief valve open and no water ever comes out, odds are you are constantly sucking air on the suction side, which would explain the lack of skimmer action. It sounds like you need to get your potential leak (or whatever is causing you to have to leave the relief valve open) fixed first. Once you have that fixed, you can address the pressure problems, which may go away with your first fix.
Thank you so much. We will work on fixing the leak(s) within the next day or two and let you know if that addresses the low suction and pressure problems.
We had to order a couple of parts, which took a few days. In any event, the pvc pipes were all replaced, but the suction is still low and there is a sound of air being sucked in somewhere around the pressure gauge. Any help you can provide would be greatly appreciated.
Test results as of today:
FC - 6
CC - 0
TA - 80
PH - 7.6
CH - 160
CYA - below 30 (so I just added 10 lbs of CYA)
Salt - 3500
Attached are pictures of the pool plumbing and the current state of the pool (the water is clear but it's hard to tell that from the pictures because it desperately needs to be vacuumed).
Test results as of today:
FC - 6
CC - 0
TA - 80
PH - 7.6
CH - 160
CYA - below 30 (so I just added 10 lbs of CYA)
Salt - 3500
Attached are pictures of the pool plumbing and the current state of the pool (the water is clear but it's hard to tell that from the pictures because it desperately needs to be vacuumed).
With the pump on, air can't be sucked in around the pressure gauge since it is on the pressure side of the pump ... air would have to be going out.
What do you mean by suction is low? Do you have goo flow returning to the pool? What is your filter pressure reading?
Looking at the picture you have all 3 suction lines open, so that is going to result in very low flow from each suction source. How does everything behave if you only have 1 suction line open at a time?
What do you mean by suction is low? Do you have goo flow returning to the pool? What is your filter pressure reading?
Looking at the picture you have all 3 suction lines open, so that is going to result in very low flow from each suction source. How does everything behave if you only have 1 suction line open at a time?
Any reason why air would be going out if the release valve is closed?
Everything is open in the photos but even when the main drain and one of the skimmers are in the off position, there is still very low skimmer suction. What I mean by that is that there is always a lot of water in the skimmer, the skimmer basket floats up, and there is not enough suction to keep the vacuum attached.
The flow returning to the pool appears to be good. There is water moving rapidly through the check valves on both the suction and return side (I don't know what that means). After soaking the cartridge filters for two days in detergent and thoroughly cleaning them, the psi is still goes up to around 20-25 (normal is 15 psi).
Everything is open in the photos but even when the main drain and one of the skimmers are in the off position, there is still very low skimmer suction. What I mean by that is that there is always a lot of water in the skimmer, the skimmer basket floats up, and there is not enough suction to keep the vacuum attached.
The flow returning to the pool appears to be good. There is water moving rapidly through the check valves on both the suction and return side (I don't know what that means). After soaking the cartridge filters for two days in detergent and thoroughly cleaning them, the psi is still goes up to around 20-25 (normal is 15 psi).
Is the same true for just each skimmer or just the floor?
I might suggest that you open up each of the 3-way valves and make sure there's not something stuck somewhere clogging up the suction lines. Although if you replaced all the PVC maybe you would have noticed something.
I might suggest that you open up each of the 3-way valves and make sure there's not something stuck somewhere clogging up the suction lines. Although if you replaced all the PVC maybe you would have noticed something.
Why do you think 15 psi is normal? Perhaps 20 psi is normal and the 15 was artificially low due to suction leaks.
Are there wiers on your skimmers? There should always be a lot of water in the skimmers. But if you don't have wiers then perhaps that is making you think there is not a lot of suction.
You asked, "Is the same true for just each skimmer or just the floor"? I'm sorry but I'm not sure what you mean here.
I will open the valves and check for clogs. We have replaced the diverter valves for the skimmers and main drain a couple of weeks ago but did not think to check for clogs at that time.
I did not mean to say that we had replaced "all" of the pvc pipes, just the run of pipe going into the pump that was a mess, and a part of the pipe going from the pump to the filter using a coupler.
I thought 15 psi was normal because right after we replaced the 4 cartridge filters last year, the reading on the gauge was 15 psi. However, you make a good point about the reading being artificially low if an air leak is present. We believe there have been an air leak or leaks present since we bought this house 5 years ago, because there were always bubbles in the pump basket. As first time pool owners, we just had no idea that they were not normal.
Yes, as I mentioned in the original post, we had very recently installed new weirs (The funny thing is that I didn't even know what they were before a couple of weeks ago, as none were ever in the skimmers when we bought the house. I learned about them on this site).
I will open the valves and check for clogs. We have replaced the diverter valves for the skimmers and main drain a couple of weeks ago but did not think to check for clogs at that time.
I did not mean to say that we had replaced "all" of the pvc pipes, just the run of pipe going into the pump that was a mess, and a part of the pipe going from the pump to the filter using a coupler.
I thought 15 psi was normal because right after we replaced the 4 cartridge filters last year, the reading on the gauge was 15 psi. However, you make a good point about the reading being artificially low if an air leak is present. We believe there have been an air leak or leaks present since we bought this house 5 years ago, because there were always bubbles in the pump basket. As first time pool owners, we just had no idea that they were not normal.
Yes, as I mentioned in the original post, we had very recently installed new weirs (The funny thing is that I didn't even know what they were before a couple of weeks ago, as none were ever in the skimmers when we bought the house. I learned about them on this site).
I meant is the pressure and flow the same if you only have one skimmer open or just the floor open. You mentioned that you tested with only one skimmer open but I wanted to know if everything was the same with just the other skimmer open or with just the floor open.
The pressure and flow are the same regardless of whether I have the floor drain open or one skimmer or both skimmers.
Is it the same with the spa suction only opened? What kind of discharge happens if you close the filter valve and go to waste? You say the air relief is left opened and there's no water. Can you disassemble the air relief, guage assembly from the filter and inspect
Problem Solved!!! Thank you all so much for your help.
Jblizzle: When you said that it seemed as though we had a massive air leak, your were 100% correct! As it turns out, a lot of air was coming from the spa actuator. As we were checking all of the pipes and valves, we heard a rather clear hissing sound of air escaping from below the valve where the actuator sits. We replaced the o-ring and added a silicone sealant all around and voila! Problem solved! The pump basket is free of air bubbles, we have no issues when we close the air release on the filter tank, and the psi went down.
Thanks again, everyone!
Jblizzle: When you said that it seemed as though we had a massive air leak, your were 100% correct! As it turns out, a lot of air was coming from the spa actuator. As we were checking all of the pipes and valves, we heard a rather clear hissing sound of air escaping from below the valve where the actuator sits. We replaced the o-ring and added a silicone sealant all around and voila! Problem solved! The pump basket is free of air bubbles, we have no issues when we close the air release on the filter tank, and the psi went down.
Thanks again, everyone!