Learnings from a TFP follower

[diamonddog]

I thought it would be beneficial for others to hear from someone that was not brand new to TFP and had "some" knowledge of pool chemistry.

The pool industry really does a good job at making you believe things that are not true and that resulted in my stubbornness to accept the ways of TFP/

Keeping Chlorine levels High - Understanding that I had to boost my chorine to compensate for CYA took a while for me to accept.

TA - I thought that keeping TA between 80-120 was ideal. So I tried to keep it at 100. This required me to constantly add baking soda. Knowing now that its OK to keep at 60 (where it settled at), I haven't added any baking Soda .

PH - This is a tough one to accept. Logically you think anything above 7 (neutral) can lead to scale. 7.8 is the top end so I always tried to keep it around 7.5 or so. This required me to constantly add acid. Now that I keep it at 7.8, I barely add acid anymore. Pool seemed to settle in around 7.8. I don't quite understand it and would be lying if I didn't worry that scale may form. But I am adhering to the process.

SLAM - You have to do this exactly. That means buying the test kids and following all the process without omitting anything.

 

[ezchief]

Spread the word to the unwashed. Open their eyes.

 

[reggiehammond]

You got it - it's deceptively simple and easy once it all clicks.

 

[diamonddog]

Could someome explain to me how 7.8 pH doesn't build scale in simple terms? I'm adhering to it even though imdont completely understand it

 

[Newdude]

Could someome explain to me how 7.8 pH doesn't build scale in simple terms? I'm adhering to it even though imdont completely understand it

There are many combos for CSI that are good, and many that are bad.

Running typical pool store #s with a high TA and jacked CH from all that cal-hypo they want you to dump in weekly, a 7.8 PH then puts the CSI into scaling territory and they'll blame the PH.

We adjust the #s as they make sense to, so then the 7.8 ph by itself doesn't cause problems. Usually, lowering the TA to 60 puts the CSI close to 0 again.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

In simple terms, calcium scale forms when water is oversaturated with calcium ions and carbonate ions. The water simply cannot hold onto those ions anymore. It’s similar to how you make rock candy sticks - you dissolve lots and lots of sugar is hot water and then you let it cool. When it cools, the water is supersaturated with sugar but there isn’t anything it can grow on (we call that “nucleation” in science-speak). As soon as you put the wooden stick in solution that you seeded with tiny sugar crystals, the sugar in solution sees all these amazing nucleation sites and the rock candy begins to grow.

In a pool, calcium ions come from all types of places and their concentration can be high enough that the water is oversaturated. Correspondingly, the carbonate ion concentration is pH dependent and when the pH is higher, there is more carbonate in the water. Once the product of the carbonate concentration and calcium ion concentration reaches a certain threshold - boom! - rock candy forms … all over your tile and plaster because it’s full of nucleation sites.

The driving force for this process is temperature dependent, pH dependent and concentration dependent. So, as @Newdude said, you can play with lots of those variables and make it so that the water is not in an oversaturated state and so pH has less of an effect. One way to keep the process from happening is to make sure your TA is low, that way there simply isn’t enough carbonate at any given pH value to make it energetically favorable for the calcium to form scale.

 

[xDom]

It is mind boggling how the ones that work in the industry are the ones that seem to be most misguided.

The pool industry really does a good job at making you believe things that are not true

I'm still undecided on this. Is it a deliberate ploy to sell more chemicals or is it genuine ignorance as to how pool chemistry works?

Understanding that I had to boost my chorine to compensate for CYA

If there was only one fact that the pool shops should learn, this would be it! The CL level drops below the required amount for the given CYA level and this then gives them the green light to sell a whole heap of products.

 

[Newdude]

I'm still undecided on this. Is it a deliberate ploy to sell more chemicals or is it genuine ignorance as to how pool chemistry works?

You can wonder about the Mom and Pop shops if they've been led to believe sketchy industry advice, or are greedy. But one thing is certain. Corporations gonna corporate.

 

[mgtfp]

I'm still undecided on this. Is it a deliberate ploy to sell more chemicals or is it genuine ignorance as to how pool chemistry works?

It's probably a combination.

The big companies producing the stuff should know better, but they probably don't want to know better, so are applying the "put the fingers in your ears and close your eyes" technique.

The pool shops are probably largely influenced by the sales reps and the mother companies they run their franchises for.

 

[EndlessSummerAZ]

It is mind boggling how the ones that work in the industry are the ones that seem to be most misguided.

Just had a pool guy this morning telling my parents that using liquid chlorine would add an abundance of calcium and that tabs should be used.

I’m really happy I opted to care for my pool myself.

 

[mgtfp]

Just had a pool guy this morning telling my parents that using liquid chlorine would add an abundance of calcium and that tabs should be used.

I’m really happy I opted to care for my pool myself.

You really don't know if you should laugh or cry there...