They need to patch whatever is on the other side of that crack. The water needs to be prevented from getting passed the waterproof barrier and into the concrete structure.
Leak in Pool
- Thread starter Deltadog
- Start date
- Dec 13, 2020
- 798
- Pool Size
- 19600
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
Fwiw, in my 20k gal pool (4.5' avg depth), 3/16" would be about 80 gallons. A pretty good-sized puddle.
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Latest response from PB: “I have received calls back from three different swimming pool subcontractors, one Shotcrete crew and two separate plaster crews. I simply asked all three separately. What was the best method to correct the issue with the water seeping out of the back of the wall at your pool and include pics or they were there on site. All 3 had the same response with same or very similar corrective action. Since the hairline/check, crack is so small and hard to see in the front or water side of the pool, we need to chip out quite a good bit of material from the back fill with expansion swimming pool, specific epoxy and then layer with hydraulic cement.”
I too I discussed issue with a premium pool builder and suggestions are as you described? With this being a new pool the repairs need to be corrected from the inside to pool then replaster .. thought ? Suggestions
If the plaster surface is compromised (it is if it’s leaking) then patching the back side is a temporary bandaid. They can put as much epoxy and hydraulic cement as they want on the back and it’ll just leak again. Then they’ll have do the repair again the right way. Seems like a waste of time and money.
It needs to be patched from the water side of the pool wall.
- May 23, 2015
- 24,645
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
That's a vertical crack in a structural wall. It has to be repaired from the inside of the pool because you have no idea how far down that crack goes. From the inside of the pool, that crack could run all the way down the wall, along the floor, and then up the other side. There's no way to know without chipping out the plaster and inspecting. If it's just that section of wall, then they can notch the crack, add structural staples and fill with epoxy and hydraulic cement and then redo the plaster.
What you have is potentially a major amount of structural reworking. It expensive but the shell should be under warranty from the gunite company that did the work as well as the PB's insurance. This is not on you. But you may want to negotiate with the PB to see what is covered under their warranty and what you might be willing to pay for out of pocket.
The solution you want is for the crack to be fixed from the inside, not the outside. How you arrive at that preferred solution with the builder will take negotiating.
@AQUA~HOLICS might have more insight.
What you have is potentially a major amount of structural reworking. It expensive but the shell should be under warranty from the gunite company that did the work as well as the PB's insurance. This is not on you. But you may want to negotiate with the PB to see what is covered under their warranty and what you might be willing to pay for out of pocket.
The solution you want is for the crack to be fixed from the inside, not the outside. How you arrive at that preferred solution with the builder will take negotiating.
@AQUA~HOLICS might have more insight.
Water is getting from the inside of the pool and exiting though the outer shell, it also has a good chance that the water is coming in contact with the rebar cage, this over time will have detrimental impact on the overall strength of the shell, this is my main concern if only patched from the outside of the structure. The only way to find out exactly where the water is coming from is to expose the inside of the shell, then water may leak back into the pool from a crack.
The least expensive repair is from the outside surface, but not a permanent solution.
The least expensive repair is from the outside surface, but not a permanent solution.
Thank you for your response and expertise. Interesting comment on water coming in contact with rebar, has you see the below photos of the water color for the water coming from pool, looks rusty. Could also be coming from the gravel they packed in the bottom before shot Crete
Attachments
Thank you for your response . This entire repair is on the PB, as this is a new pool. Leaked slightly right after they completed, the PB brushed off ad condensation veneer stone on exterior wall, it has just gotten worse.
- May 23, 2015
- 24,645
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Was there any soil analysis done by a geotechnical engineer before installing the pool??
Was your pool built on virgin, undisturbed ground?
Can you show a layout of the pool design and where the crack is relative to the shallow and deep ends and if there are any slopes or transitions near it?
If the crack does run further down the wall or reaches the floor, then you may have a settling issue. If the ground under and around the pool is not stable then there could be a much larger problem that needs to be remediated.
Was your pool built on virgin, undisturbed ground?
Can you show a layout of the pool design and where the crack is relative to the shallow and deep ends and if there are any slopes or transitions near it?
If the crack does run further down the wall or reaches the floor, then you may have a settling issue. If the ground under and around the pool is not stable then there could be a much larger problem that needs to be remediated.
Attachments
- May 23, 2015
- 24,645
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Hmmm. Perhaps the deep end settled a bit after fill and then the crack happened.
Your property sits on a lake front. I would have wanted an analysis done. Too many possibilities that could cause movement. Also, structural retaining walls like the raised wall you have, need to be over-engineered to withstand not only water forces but also possible soil movements. I have rarely seen contractors do a thorough job in this respect.
In any event, the pool needs to be drained and the plaster chipped out all around that crack. If it extended further down the wall or along the floor, the pool has structural issues that need to be fixed. If that is the case, the PB has got a lot of work on his hands and your pool will be a total loss to him profit-wise. So you can expect them to push back a lot and only do the most minimal amount of discovery work.
Keep us posted.
Your property sits on a lake front. I would have wanted an analysis done. Too many possibilities that could cause movement. Also, structural retaining walls like the raised wall you have, need to be over-engineered to withstand not only water forces but also possible soil movements. I have rarely seen contractors do a thorough job in this respect.
In any event, the pool needs to be drained and the plaster chipped out all around that crack. If it extended further down the wall or along the floor, the pool has structural issues that need to be fixed. If that is the case, the PB has got a lot of work on his hands and your pool will be a total loss to him profit-wise. So you can expect them to push back a lot and only do the most minimal amount of discovery work.
Keep us posted.
Thanks for assistance. They feeling I get is when the plaster is chipped around the crack area, they will not be able to match the plaster color correctly and will have to chip out entire pool and replaster.. thoughts?? I added a photo of the rebar work before they shotctete. And just for an opinion take a look at that skimmer, looks to me like it’s about 4” to low.
Attachments
- May 23, 2015
- 24,645
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Yep. That skimmer installation is wrong if the water line is such that there is exposed plaster. The plaster should always be submerged.
Yes, the plaster will have to be chipped out and the area fixed. Then a plaster patch will be reapplied. It won’t match. It will blend in over time over the years but you will always notice it. Chipping out the entire pool will allow you to inspect for other defects but the builder will probably not want to do that and will not want to pay for the replaster.
Can’t really tell much from the rebar photos as I would need to see a lot more detail but my guess is still that the structure of the pool was built but it may not be adequate for the soil that the structure was placed in. Every 10,000 gallons of water weighs 83,400 pounds or nearly 38 tons. A full pool is a massive amount of weight that needs to be supported by the surrounding earth. If it’s not engineered correctly to take into account the soil conditions, you’ll get structural problems that will worsen over time.
This is potentially a big remediation job. You may want to start getting second opinions. And you definitely want to read your contract and see what the warranty entails.
Yes, the plaster will have to be chipped out and the area fixed. Then a plaster patch will be reapplied. It won’t match. It will blend in over time over the years but you will always notice it. Chipping out the entire pool will allow you to inspect for other defects but the builder will probably not want to do that and will not want to pay for the replaster.
Can’t really tell much from the rebar photos as I would need to see a lot more detail but my guess is still that the structure of the pool was built but it may not be adequate for the soil that the structure was placed in. Every 10,000 gallons of water weighs 83,400 pounds or nearly 38 tons. A full pool is a massive amount of weight that needs to be supported by the surrounding earth. If it’s not engineered correctly to take into account the soil conditions, you’ll get structural problems that will worsen over time.
This is potentially a big remediation job. You may want to start getting second opinions. And you definitely want to read your contract and see what the warranty entails.
No exposed plaster, I just have water dropped some exploring the crack on the other side of pool. Just thought it was installed to low.
Being that this potential leak, which wasn’t has noticeable as it is today was brought to attention of PB within 1 month of completed project, I have to believe he is totally responsible.
Being that this potential leak, which wasn’t has noticeable as it is today was brought to attention of PB within 1 month of completed project, I have to believe he is totally responsible.
The trouble with your skimmer is that when you fill it back up to the midpoint of the tile, the skimmer opening is totally submerged and then no longer works.
Yes, BPerry, when filled back up the water sits about 3/4 up the skimmer. I knew it wasn’t right but didn’t figure it was worth the fight with PB before, now it may be…
- May 23, 2015
- 24,645
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Yes , we are all tempted to believe that … what actually happens is another matter entirely. You may luck out and get a builder who is honorable and has a strong sense of work ethic, workmanship, and dedication to a customer … and you might also win the Powerball lottery tomorrow while having a flying unicorn visit your backyard.
Be prepared and know your rights under the contract you signed.
As for the skimmer, yes it was set too low and will not function properly if the water level reaches the top of the weir door. It should have been raised but, from the construction photos, it looks like it is encased in concrete and covered by the pool deck …. also not a simple fix.
In the photo it looks like the skimmer would be completely submerged once the water gets halfway up the tile. Maybe the picture is deceiving?
