Instant salinity reads correctly after Startup, then Drops to 0000

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SonVolt

0
Mar 21, 2016
27
Athens, Alabama
I'm trying to troubleshoot our Aquarite SWG. I replaced the thermistor early this spring and it was working great up until recently. Now there seems to be another problem with the LEDs not staying lit (they turn off after a few minutes post-startup) and the unit isn't generating chlorine. I also just noticed that after a startup, the instant salinity reading will settle in after the click, but after about 60 seconds the reading will drop to 0000. Is that normal? Or should it always display the salinity level?

I'm honestly not sure if my problem is the thermistor, the flow switch or the T-cell. I didn't see any visible cracks on the thermistor. I replaced the T-15 cell back in 2012.
 
6 years seems to be a good run for your T-15. But maybe you can squeeze more life out of it.
I think we need more detailed descriptions of the events taking place to better understand the problem. So if you can fill us in that would be great.

Here's what I would do;
1. Turn off power to the SWCG
2. With the pump running at high speed, power on the SWCG
3. Power light ON = Yes or No
4. No Flow Blinking = Yes or No
5. Take note of the Diagnostic before the 20-25 secs initialization period expires and post
>after 20-25 secs initialization period;
6. No Flow OFF = Yes or No
7. Power ON = Yes or No
8. Generating ON = Yes or No
9. Did you hear a click = Yes or No
Again take note of the Diagnostic reading and post
 
Meadow said:
6 years seems to be a good run for your T-15. But maybe you can squeeze more life out of it.
I think we need more detailed descriptions of the events taking place to better understand the problem. So if you can fill us in that would be great.

Here's what I would do;
1. Turn off power to the SWCG
2. With the pump running at high speed, power on the SWCG
3. Power light ON = Yes or No
4. No Flow Blinking = Yes or No
5. Take note of the Diagnostic before the 20-25 secs initialization period expires and post
>after 20-25 secs initialization period;
6. No Flow OFF = Yes or No
7. Power ON = Yes or No
8. Generating ON = Yes or No
9. Did you hear a click = Yes or No
Again take note of the Diagnostic reading and post
Click to expand...


I will try and get these tonight, thank you. One question - for diagnostics, are those the numbers displayed each time you click the "diagnostic" button?
 
SonVolt said:
I will try and get these tonight, thank you. One question - for diagnostics, are those the numbers displayed each time you click the "diagnostic" button?
Click to expand...
Yes, and it goes like this in the following order;
Average Salinity =
Temperature =
Volts =
Amps =
Output % =
Instant salinity =
Equipment ID =
Software ver =
Cell type =

Hope you have access to a multimeter for later use in troubleshooting.
 
Meadow said:
That was quick! Thank you for the update.

If you have access to a multimeter, you can verify the resistance of the old thermistor. I will not hold my breath if it reads 2 ohms.
Also, your instant salinity is on the low side. How do you test the salt level in your pool?

Anyway, if it works for you then that's all it matters. Good job!

Here's the Hayward Aquarite Troubleshooting Guidelines for future reference.
Click to expand...


I'm not an electronics guru so will something like this work for a Multimeter?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01ISAMUA6/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Can you explain what the multimeter is doing and how it pertains to the thermistor? What am I checking for, what's it telling me etc?

Yep, the salt is low. I've been feeding it chlorine pucks the last month while the SWG has been out of commision. I dumped some more bags in last night.
 
The instant salinity is close to the shutdown level of 2,300 ppm. That could have been the problem. Check instant salinity in both polarities and check actual salinity in the water with a K-1766 salt test kit.
 
JamesW said:
The instant salinity is close to the shutdown level of 2,300 ppm. That could have been the problem. Check instant salinity in both polarities and check actual salinity in the water with a K-1766 salt test kit.
Click to expand...

Can you explain what you mean "check instant salinity in both polarities"?

AFAIK, the salinity was adequate when the SWG started having issues. I haven't added salt in over a month and just now got around to replacing the thermistor and turning it back on, so the salt is reading low as expected.
 
Yeah, that should work. I think Harbor Freight and other electronic parts store also sell those inexpensive multimeters. They measure electrical voltages, capacitance, resistance, and among other things that human eyes can't see. A must have when troubleshooting electrical or electronic circuits.

You need a more reliable salt test kit like the Taylor K-1766. It is known that as the cell gets older, the instant salinity reading gets lower. You don't want to overshoot salt in your water and partially drain later for the new cell to work. Everything you need to know with regards to your SWCG is in the link I posted above.
 

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Meadow said:
Yeah, that should work. I think Harbor Freight and other electronic parts store also sell those inexpensive multimeters. They measure electrical voltages, capacitance, resistance, and among other things that human eyes can't see. A must have when troubleshooting electrical or electronic circuits.

You need a more reliable salt test kit like the Taylor K-1766. It is known that as the cell gets older, the instant salinity reading gets lower. You don't want to overshoot salt in your water and partially drain later for the new cell to work. Everything you need to know with regards to your SWCG is in the link I posted above.
Click to expand...


Thanks, I will check out the Taylor K-1766. I also printed the SWCG guide in your link, thanks for all the help! Btw, once I get my multi-meter in tomorrow, what am I checking the thermistor for? Or what values should I be hoping it reads?
 
The thermistor starts at 2 ohms but drops to close to 0 when it heats up. So, it should read 2 ohms cold. Even if it reads correctly at low temperatures, it doesn't necessarily mean that it will sustain a current. You would need to put a current of about 8 amps through it to see if it maintains continuity.

If the resistance shows open line right away, that means that the thermistor is bad, but a reading of 2 ohms doesn't necessarily mean that it is good.

The maximum steady state current rating is 25 amps. At that current, the temperature can reach up to 428 Fahrenheit (220 Celsius).

You could heat up the thermistor with a heat gun to see if the resistance drops to 0 when hot.

If resistance increases with heat, the thermistor is bad.
 
Open line is infinite resistance. 0 ohms means no resistance. I wouldn't worry about testing the old thermistor.

Check instant salinity in both polarities and check actual salinity with a K-1766 test kit.
 
JamesW said:
but a reading of 2 ohms doesn't necessarily mean that it is good.
Click to expand...
James, no disrespect but if you can provide proven facts or concrete evidence to support the above statement then that would be great (no pun intended).

Testimonial: We have been using 2x AS32 2R025 in series with the 240 Vac and was tagged as a controlled item by the Organization. Each failure analysis is properly documented and submitted to the Feds regulatory commission for evaluation. For the past 2 decades, our field techs are replacing them by the hundreds per day Worldwide and we have never seen a single Thermistor behaves the way you described. For those who travel in and out of the country by all means or had walked in and out of any Feds offices or military installations must have gone through one of these machines, at least. But that’s all I can tell for confidentiality reasons.

You might help the Feds regulatory commission to look into this if I can provide them on your behalf mandated facts and solid evidences beyond any reasonable doubt. Let me know if you are willing to discuss this privately.

Sorry OP, please ignore this post. Just thought this is very important for security reasons!
 
The unit has a 180 minute cycle time. If the percentage is set to 50%, the unit runs for 90 minutes and then it rests for 90 minutes (not generating even though the "generating" light is on).

Then, it reverses polarity and begins a new cycle. The polarity reversal helps reduce calcium carbonate scaling in the cell.

To make the box reverse polarity, move the switch to off for a minute or two and then back to auto.

The instant salinity in both polarities should be close to the same number.

Regarding the 2 ohm reading: 2 ohms is the cold reading. Once current begins flowing, the thermistor heats up and the resistance should drop. In certain failures, you might get 2 ohms cold but the connection might not be good enough to sustain actual current. I'm assuming that the thermistor probably expands when hot. When expanded, the connection might open.

If the thermistor is bad, it probably won't measure 2 ohms. If it measures 2 ohms, it's probably good.

But, I don't think that you can say that just measuring 2 ohms confirms that the thermistor is definitely good.

To confirm that the thermistor is definitely good, I think that you would need to put through at least 8 amps to prove that it will sustain the current.

To verify that the thermistor is good, you would also want to verify that the resistance drops according to the published curve.

I would refer you to the manufacturer for actual engineering data or test requirements.

Inrush Current Limiters - Thermistors | Ametherm
 
Ah ok, thanks for clearing that up.

Btw - is it just expected that a new thermistor needs to be installed every summer, or even multiple times per season? Is this a design flaw in the AquaRite SWG? Is there any known ways to fix it? Maybe a small CPU cooling fan or something? Would putting my SWG box in the shade help?
 
I have heard that the latest version does not have a thermistor but I can't confirm it.

The Prologic doesn't use a thermistor and I don't think that other manufacturers use one either. So, it can be eliminated by using a different design.

In my opinion, it was probably never necessary. At a minimum, it should have been a plug-in component so that it could be easily replaced.

I don't know that the thermistor that was just replaced was bad. I suspect that it was probably ok.
 

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