Thanks. So it sounds like most people here are in favor of the bypass. My only concern outside of the additional $1,000 is that this builder doesn't typically install these so I hope they will install it correctly and is there enough room on the pad to add it. I know the SWG needs to be at least 3 feet from the heater output and it's currently just over 3 feet today.
Equipment for New Build
- Thread starter DSMinAtlanta
- Start date
Thanks. So it sounds like most people here are in favor of the bypass. My only concern outside of the additional $1,000 is that this builder doesn't typically install these so I hope they will install it correctly and is there enough room on the pad to add it. I know the SWG needs to be at least 3 feet from the heater output and it's currently just over 3 feet today.
- Jul 21, 2013
- 55,419
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
There is plenty of room to install the heater bypass if they are creative.
The SWG can be installed in a vertical loop which creates lots more space.
The SWG can be installed in a vertical loop which creates lots more space.
Update:
They installed the bypass last week. Prior to that, they were having issues getting the heater to ignite and had to call a Pentair rep to help. When the bypass was installed, supposedly the Pentair rep helped troubleshoot the heater and the builder says it was just "air in the gas line" and that "everything works now". So today we decided to test the heater and bypass to make sure it's all working and I'm really confused.
According to the install guide for the Pentair bypass, the IntelliValve positions should be at 0 and 7 when the heater is to the left of the valve: https://www.pentair.com/content/dam...heater_auto_bypass_valve_replacement _kit.pdf
However, it seems that they set it up as if the heater is to the right of the valve (positions 24 and 17). When I fired up the heater, the IntelliValve did change positions and the heater ignited just fine but I didn't see much water flow through the check valve. There was some water going through as my wife said the water was warm coming into the pool. So I decided to follow the instructions and change the positions to 0 and 7. When I turned the heater back on via IntelliCenter, there was much more water flow through that check valve but after the heater fired up, there was a knocking sound (sounded almost like marbles inside the heater) and it shut off. I've got to get the builder back out here but before I do, I wanted to get the expert opinions of those here so I can present them with a plan to get this fixed the right way. Here is a picture of the equipment pad with the bypass installed. Can someone please help me figure out the CORRECT IntelliValve configuration for our pool?
In other news, I did jump into the pool for the first time after getting frustrated with all these equipment issues and it was amazing.
They installed the bypass last week. Prior to that, they were having issues getting the heater to ignite and had to call a Pentair rep to help. When the bypass was installed, supposedly the Pentair rep helped troubleshoot the heater and the builder says it was just "air in the gas line" and that "everything works now". So today we decided to test the heater and bypass to make sure it's all working and I'm really confused.
According to the install guide for the Pentair bypass, the IntelliValve positions should be at 0 and 7 when the heater is to the left of the valve: https://www.pentair.com/content/dam...heater_auto_bypass_valve_replacement _kit.pdf
However, it seems that they set it up as if the heater is to the right of the valve (positions 24 and 17). When I fired up the heater, the IntelliValve did change positions and the heater ignited just fine but I didn't see much water flow through the check valve. There was some water going through as my wife said the water was warm coming into the pool. So I decided to follow the instructions and change the positions to 0 and 7. When I turned the heater back on via IntelliCenter, there was much more water flow through that check valve but after the heater fired up, there was a knocking sound (sounded almost like marbles inside the heater) and it shut off. I've got to get the builder back out here but before I do, I wanted to get the expert opinions of those here so I can present them with a plan to get this fixed the right way. Here is a picture of the equipment pad with the bypass installed. Can someone please help me figure out the CORRECT IntelliValve configuration for our pool?
In other news, I did jump into the pool for the first time after getting frustrated with all these equipment issues and it was amazing.
- Jul 21, 2013
- 55,419
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
24 & 17 settings are correct.
24 when the heater is on and 17 when the heater is bypassed.
24 when the heater is on and 17 when the heater is bypassed.
Then are the Pentair instructions incorrect? In the manual I linked to, it says the settings should be 0 and 7 when the heater is to the left of the valve. Plus, you can barely see any water flowing through that check valve when running the heater and the flap in the check valve is only partially open. If all of the water is flowing through the heater when it’s on then I would expect that check valve to be filled with water.
- Jul 21, 2013
- 55,419
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
24 & 17 are correct.
See the pic below.
24 places the diverter blocking the bypass line as shown by the red line for when the heater is running.
17 allows water to flow through the heater and bypass, with most water going through the bypass, as shown by the green line when the heater is off.
The writer of the Pentair installation document made it overly confusing with the left/right when the bypass can be done in many different orientations.
See the pic below.
24 places the diverter blocking the bypass line as shown by the red line for when the heater is running.
17 allows water to flow through the heater and bypass, with most water going through the bypass, as shown by the green line when the heater is off.
The writer of the Pentair installation document made it overly confusing with the left/right when the bypass can be done in many different orientations.
Thank you!
Edit: I think I'm confusing myself here. The red LEDs indicate how much flow is restricted based on their position? Is that the best way to think of it?
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- Jul 21, 2013
- 55,419
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
The red LED indicated the diverter position that is blocking flow in that direction.
You place the red LED on the pipe you do NOT want flow through.
You place the red LED on the pipe you do NOT want flow through.
Ah that makes a LOT more sense now that I look at my picture and your explanation. Thanks for taking the time to explain all of this!
What you describe here is what occurs when there is not enough water flow to the heater. Sending all the water to the heater will resolve this issue.
So the PB came out this morning to do somewhat of a final walkthrough and the equipment installer was there so I could ask him a few final questions about the equipment. Yesterday everything was working great. When I left for work today, the installer told me he wanted to "tidy up the wires and do a few more tests" before he leaves so I headed to work. I just got home and now the IntelliValve for the bypass has no lights turned on. I texted the installer and he said "it turns on when the heater is on" which makes no sense. My understanding is the IntelliValve should always display the current position of the valve, correct? Also, when I turned off the 'pool' via the IntelliCenter, the pump did not power off. I have no idea what changed between yesterday and today but this is beyond frustrating.
Another note on the above. It looks like they connected the IntelliValve directly to the MasterTemp heater instead of connecting it to the IntelliCenter. When I turn on the heat function, the power to the IntelliValve is enabled (lights turn on), but as soon as the heater turns off the power is killed to the IntelliValve. It did not do this yesterday. The IntellliValve had power regardless of whether the heater was turned on.
Edit: I posted in this thread as it seems others experienced similar issues: IntelliCenter and MasterTemp 400 Communication
Edit: I posted in this thread as it seems others experienced similar issues: IntelliCenter and MasterTemp 400 Communication
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We just had a new pool build completed and I had the PB install a heater bypass based on the recommendations here. I have a MasterTemp 400 and an IntelliValve bypass which has been connected directly to the heater rather than to the IntelliCenter panel. Before today, everything appeared to work fine. The IntelliValve was powered on all the time and I adjusted the set points to those recommended by Pentair (17 and 24). Today the PB came out to "do some final testing of the equipment" and he mentioned something about freeze protection and heater cooldown settings. I have no idea what he changed.
Now the IntelliValve ONLY has power when the heater is turned on which means it does not return to a bypass position when the heater turns off. I texted the PB installer and he said "the IntelliValve only has power when the heater is on" which I know is not correct. It sounds like others have encountered similar behavior in this thread. Is there something the PB could have changed today that has led to the IntelliValve losing power when the heater turns off? I wish he hadn't touched it today as it was working great yesterday.
Now the IntelliValve ONLY has power when the heater is turned on which means it does not return to a bypass position when the heater turns off. I texted the PB installer and he said "the IntelliValve only has power when the heater is on" which I know is not correct. It sounds like others have encountered similar behavior in this thread. Is there something the PB could have changed today that has led to the IntelliValve losing power when the heater turns off? I wish he hadn't touched it today as it was working great yesterday.
Ahultin
Bronze Supporter
- Aug 19, 2021
- 1,431
- Pool Size
- 17700
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Sounds like he moved a "connected" heater from rs485 with constant power to the fireman's switch. Per pentair the connected heaters are to get constant power
I asked him via text what he changed on the heater and he said "nothing" which I don't believe. He said something about testing the heater cooldown before I left for work today so I know he was messing around with the heater. The heater has always only had power when enabling heat via IntelliCenter and that's what I see now. The only difference I'm seeing is the fact that the IntelliValve has no power without the heater. How would I check to see if it's a "connected" heater?
Ahultin
Bronze Supporter
- Aug 19, 2021
- 1,431
- Pool Size
- 17700
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Connected heater will have the 6 button keypad, in addition, in the home app it will show as mastertemp (menu - settings - advanced settings - heaters)
In the IntelliCenter2 app, I only see a heater listed under Settings > Other Equipment > Heaters. All it says is 'Gas Heater' with a Cooldown Delay of 5 minutes.
- Jul 21, 2013
- 55,419
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Gas heater indicates it is connected by the 2 wire firemans switch to the heater relay. That turns power on and off the heater.
If the MasterTemp is connected to the IntelliCenter using RS-485 then settings: system configuration: other equipment: heaters and set the heater type to "MasterTemp". When you save it the Heater Name will become MasterTemp and the Heater Type will become Connected Gas.
For more read Pentair Automation Systems - Further Reading
When the heater is connected by RS-485 it will always be powered and the actuator will have power to display the LED status.
If the gas heater connection is used then the bypass valve actuator should be controlled by the IntelliCenter
If the RS-485 heater control is used then the bypass actuator can be controlled by the heater or the IntelliCenter.
Thanks for that link! Is there an easy way for me to easily determine which connection type is being used by looking at the heater and/or IntelliCenter? The PB installer texted me back and said he would need to contact Pentair on Monday since he has no idea what's going on. I'd rather figure this out on my own before I contact him again and tell him how to fix it. I'll take a look at the IntelliCenter control panel tomorrow when it's daylight again. What puzzles me is why the IntelliValve had power all week long and worked fine and today it doesn't after he was 'testing' things. I know he tested the freeze protection because the IntelliCenter app shows a temperature drop to under 30 degrees this morning while he was here. I don't know what else he did and he claims he didn't change anything on the heater.
Oh, and which of these two connection types is the preferred one? Sounds like the RS-485 connection is what I need given the current setup with the bypass.
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- Jul 21, 2013
- 55,419
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Follow the wire connection the heater to the IntelliCenter.
One end in the Mastertemp will be connected as below...
The other end will be connected to the IntelliCenter board J2...
You want to disconnect that wire at both ends and you must restore the jumper connecting the two firemans switch connections in the MasterTemp. When you get in there post a pic of what you find if you don't know what to do.
Then run a RS-485 cable between the heater and IntelliCenter as described below:
