How important is the rubber washer for the retaining screw of the impeller for a Pentair Intelliflo 4 160?

[basketballhouse]

Hi everyone,

I just replaced the shaft seal of a leaking Pentair Intelliflo 4 160 variable speed pump.

When I put it back together, the pump worked better than before (no little bubbles in the pump lid, still a couple large bubbles). However, there was a consistent drip of water under the motor housing at the gap between motor and seal plate.

I realized after that I didn’t replace the washer of the retainer bolt for the impeller. This part:

075713 - Pump Impeller Rubber Washer - Pentair

This is a Pump Impeller Screw Rubber Washer for various Pentair pool pumps. It is used on the Pentair WhisperFlo pumps, the IntelliFlo pumps, IntelliPro, and the C-Series pool pumps.

www.poolweb.com

Could this be the cause of the leak?
I’m pretty sure I put in the shaft seal correctly on both the seal plate and impeller (US seal PS1000).

I’m looking for some reassurance before I take apart the pump again. Not sure if I should stem my losses and get a new pump at this point.

 

[ajw22]

Welcome to TFP.

Rubber washers are often used to seal.

All you can do is take the pump apart, replace the washer, and see if that fixed the leak.

 

[JamesW]

They wouldn't have it if it wasn't important.

 

[kimkats]

Believe me no company would put on something that costs even $.01 unless it was needed. Time to take it apart and put the seal part in. Much easier and cheaper than buying a whole new pump.

 

[basketballhouse]

does this impeller look like it has a rubber washer in it already? I can’t seem to take it out so not sure if I should put a new one in over it.

I never removed a rubber washer when I disassembled the first time.

Also, when I took the impeller off, the white ceramic seal now has a black / gray ring around it. That seems problematic. Any thoughts / tips?

 

[1poolman1]

does this impeller look like it has a rubber washer in it already? I can’t seem to take it out so not sure if I should put a new one in over it.

I never removed a rubber washer when I disassembled the first time.

Also, when I took the impeller off, the white ceramic seal now has a black / gray ring around it. That seems problematic. Any thoughts / tips?View attachment 468383

Your impeller-screw gasket is missing. The rubber cup is replaced along with the ceramic portion of a seal.

 

[basketballhouse]

Your impeller-screw gasket is missing. The rubber cup is replaced along with the ceramic portion of a seal

I actually just took a closer look and realized that the old screw rubber gasket melted into the impeller. I used a tiny screwdriver to pry it out. See the photo of the melted impeller-screw gasket.

I should add that the pump ran dry for some time (could be days or weeks) which is why I’ve replaced the shaft seals.

Any though on the color of the the white ceramic face? Why is there a ring?

 

[1poolman1]

I actually just took a closer look and realized that the old screw rubber gasket melted into the impeller. I used a tiny screwdriver to pry it out. See the photo of the melted impeller-screw gasket.

I should add that the pump ran dry for some time (could be days or weeks) which is why I’ve replaced the shaft seals.

Any though on the color of the the white ceramic face? Why is there a ring?

Normal looking seal ceramic after use for a while. Entire seal needs to be replaced, PS-1000 (though you'll get a lot of disagreement on using a regular 1000 seal) virtually every time you open a pump that far, its just safer. Inspect the impeller closely for heat damage. If there is any, replace it as it will continue to leak after reassembly.

You should get a new gasket if possible. If not, put silicone sealant in the impeller, put the old gasket back, put more sealant in the gasket and install the screw after tightening the impeller on the shaft. Not ideal, but will work. Even with a new gasket I always use a bit of silicone sealant to be sure.

 

[basketballhouse]

Got it. Thank you @1poolman1


1) the shaft seal was just replaced. I ran the pump for at most 2 hours in aggregate since it was replaced. But I reopened it because the pump was running well but still leaking. Hoping the leak was due to the impeller screw gasket. Fingers crossed.

2) I do have a new impeller screw gasket. I was planning on using Magic Lube II on it. You’re suggesting using silicone sealant on the gasket?

 

[1poolman1]

Got it. Thank you @1poolman1


1) the shaft seal was just replaced. I ran the pump for at most 2 hours in aggregate since it was replaced. But I reopened it because the pump was running well but still leaking. Hoping the leak was due to the impeller screw gasket. Fingers crossed.

2) I do have a new impeller screw gasket. I was planning on using Magic Lube II on it. You’re suggesting using silicone sealant on the gasket?

I have always used a silicone sealant on those as opposed to grease. Just personal preference.

 

[basketballhouse]

I have always used a silicone sealant on those as opposed to grease. Just personal preference.

Got it, thank you.

I used sealant on the seal plate side of the shaft seal. But just soapy water on the impeller side. I’m planning on sticking with Magic Lube II on the impeller screw gasket. Let me know if anyone feels strongly that I should use sealant instead to resolve my leak issue.

I did notice a hairline crack on the seal plate just now upon closer examination. I applied some silicone sealant on that crack just in case it’s the cause of the leak.

Will wait 24 hours before putting it all back together. Let me know if you all notice anything else I should be doing.

 

[basketballhouse]

I'm happy to share that my Pentair Intelliflo 4x160 is working again with no leaks (for the 2nd day now). Thank you @1poolman1 for the advice on using sealant on the impeller retainer screw washer. I didn't plan on using silicone sealant but ended up using it.

Still not 100% certain that it was necessary but I did it because when I put the washer in (with Magic Lube II) and then the screw in, I realized that the screw was not centered in the impeller. The impeller may have some heat damage which widened the hole just so slightly. So I put sealant after the impeller retainer screw washer and the the screw.

Changing out the impeller retainer screw rubber washer seems to be crucial though. If anyone reads this in the future, make sure you take out the old rubber washer. I didn't even see it in there because it melted into the impeller.

Other notes for posterity:
1. I did use 70% isopropyl alcohol to wipe down the shaft seals faces again before I put it back together just in case. The grey color on the white ceramic face of the seal (on the impeller side) did not come off.
2. The screw holding the bonding wire clip broke off (corroded). I drilled it out and re-tapped a bigger hole 10/32" and used a stainless steel screw to hold in the bonding wire clip.
3. I used Rustoleum Almond spray paint to spray over the corroded metal from the previous leak.
4. While the pump is primed and running, I do see 3 medium sized air bubbles from the lid cover. This is much better than before when I got 1 massive bubble and lots of micro bubbles. I'm not super worried about this but let me know if anyone has any advice.

 

[1poolman1]

I'm happy to share that my Pentair Intelliflo 4x160 is working again with no leaks (for the 2nd day now). Thank you @1poolman1 for the advice on using sealant on the impeller retainer screw washer. I didn't plan on using silicone sealant but ended up using it.

Still not 100% certain that it was necessary but I did it because when I put the washer in (with Magic Lube II) and then the screw in, I realized that the screw was not centered in the impeller. The impeller may have some heat damage which widened the hole just so slightly. So I put sealant after the impeller retainer screw washer and the the screw.

Changing out the impeller retainer screw rubber washer seems to be crucial though. If anyone reads this in the future, make sure you take out the old rubber washer. I didn't even see it in there because it melted into the impeller.

Other notes for posterity:
1. I did use 70% isopropyl alcohol to wipe down the shaft seals faces again before I put it back together just in case. The grey color on the white ceramic face of the seal (on the impeller side) did not come off.
2. The screw holding the bonding wire clip broke off (corroded). I drilled it out and re-tapped a bigger hole 10/32" and used a stainless steel screw to hold in the bonding wire clip.
3. I used Rustoleum Almond spray paint to spray over the corroded metal from the previous leak.
4. While the pump is primed and running, I do see 3 medium sized air bubbles from the lid cover. This is much better than before when I got 1 massive bubble and lots of micro bubbles. I'm not super worried about this but let me know if anyone has any advice.

Be prepared for that crack to get worse and there to be a leak. It may not show up as a big one at first, but water will travel along the motor shaft and ruin the bearings

To be sure, it is a pain to have to redo your work, but you really should look into a new sealplate. You've gone this far.

This kit is an aftermarket one that is better than OEM, and much less expensive. CMP makes good stuff.

https://www.amazon.com/CMP-074564-Pentair-whisperflo-ps-1000/dp/B06WWD9XV8

 

[basketballhouse]

Be prepared for that crack to get worse and there to be a leak. It may not show up as a big one at first, but water will travel along the motor shaft and ruin the bearings

To be sure, it is a pain to have to redo your work, but you really should look into a new sealplate. You've gone this far.

This kit is an aftermarket one that is better than OEM, and much less expensive. CMP makes good stuff.

https://www.amazon.com/CMP-074564-Pentair-whisperflo-ps-1000/dp/B06WWD9XV8

Agreed. At this point, I’m more willing to do a replacement knowing it will work. does anyone sell a kit with the seal plate and impeller together with the shaft seals already in?

 

[1poolman1]

Agreed. At this point, I’m more willing to do a replacement knowing it will work. does anyone sell a kit with the seal plate and impeller together with the shaft seals already in?

All newer (after Pentair bought Purex) Whisperflow (and most Intellflow) pumps use the same sealplate, gasket, shaft seal type. The PS-1000 seal is most common and comes in the CMP sealplate kit along with the gasket. Some may want to use a different seal type (Viton, etc.) and the impellers range from 1/2hp up and are usually not in need of replacement. So, a universal kit would be impractical

 

[basketballhouse]

To close out this thread: I did replace the cracked seal plate per the recommendation above by @1poolman1 . When I replaced it, the crack was a little bit more noticeable than before so good thing I did. The 3 air bubbles that are visible at the pump lid are much smaller now but still there.

 

[1poolman1]

Good to hear the job is complete. If the air on the pump doesn't increase, or even does a little, it won't cause issues. If there are no suction leaks it could be a dirty filter not allowing enough flow so the air is cleared from the pump. If the RPM aren't high enough it could be the same. At lower speeds many VSP have air in the pot.