Calcium Loss? Update: Microbrite ?

[Toxophilite]

When I was handed the keys to pool at end of February, my CH was 140. I strive to keep it at 260-270, and probably need to go higher. For awhile now I only test those numbers about once per month, and each time I see some CH loss from previous. So, my mind has been haunted with a pool leak, but with no water loss other than maybe 1/4" evaporation on average days. Autofill has been off and on to see, and I just can't pin down if there's a big maybe that a small leak could be hidden in that measure. Some days it's even only 1/8" evaporation as the days get shorter.

The CH loss appears to be around 20% over 1.5 months to 2 months, or so. In total, since starting at the 140ppm, in total I have added 24lbs of calcium chloride increaser - let's say 8 months. My fill water is 40ppm. We have had maybe 3 deluges of rain in that period that overflowed, but otherwise we have been completely dry. Pool math says that's a lot for my roughly 16K pool without considering any normal exchanges. I bought a speed-stir and started testing with that yesterday to make sure my testing method was more precise. Same measures. Also, my CYA level does not seem to drop accordingly and holds.

I guess I'm looking for advice as to whether some of the rain exchanges could contribute, other factors (though I know loss it probably only), or, I just need to go much higher and see what happens. Or, if I call the PB and ask for a leak detection when I can't describe losing water to them, just CH loss. Any suggestions?

 

[newdude]

So you get 56.something inches of rain per year which is among the most in the country.

That's nearly a free water exchange each year. But you've been evaporating and the auto fill has been running. Do you have an overflow ? Maybe you're losing all that free water, and between it and the auto fill, you are seeing the CH drop like some folks could only dream theirs would.

 

[HermanTX]

Are you familiar with the bucket test? This accounts for evaporation. Bucket Test

 

[Toxophilite]

So you get 56.something inches of rain per year which is among the most in the country.

That's nearly a free water exchange each year. But you've been evaporating and the auto fill has been running. Do you have an overflow ? Maybe you're losing all that free water, and between it, and the auto fill, you are seeing the CH drop like some folks could only dream theirs would.

Typically, but not this year! We are technically in a drought. For the year, we had a few 1/2" or so rains, nothing great, and only 3 that reached to overflow pipe, one pretty good. I guess I'm looking to ease my mind on loss rate normalcy before I call the PB to check, but the only loss I can explain to them is "about 1/4" per day average", and looking for what I can do on my end to solidify my assessment before calling. A possible leakage just haunts me, but also, by standards, I'm not losing water.

 

[Toxophilite]

Are you familiar with the bucket test? This accounts for evaporation. Bucket Test

Yes, but I guess I've been under the impression that it factored evaporation differential between the two. So, if I had 1/4" evaporation in pool, and 1/8" to none in bucket, could I deduct that there definitely is a leak involved in that differential?? Cuz, where I'm at I'm suspecting if there's a leak, it's hidden in that evaporation measure.Thanks!

 

[newdude]

So, if I had 1/4" evaporation in pool, and 1/8" to none in bucket, could I deduct that there definitely is a leak involved in that differential??

Maybe. The sides of the bucket change the evaporation properties of the bucket due to wind. All those ^^^^^^^^ ripples add up to alot of surface area for evaporation.

 

[Toxophilite]

Maybe. The sides of the bucket change the evaporation properties of the bucket due to wind. All those ^^^^^^^^ ripples add up to alot of surface area for evaporation.

Yeah, and our recent cooling down of nights I now can see a good fog off pool and lake in the mornings. I don't know, as I'm now at the point the pool needs another 8 lbs of increaser from the last one at the first of September. Once a possible pool leak gets in your brain, everything gets magnified on your watch I guess. Maybe I ought to just take it up to 400-500 and see what it does on the relative? Maybe just get the bug out of my brain and move on? I just have no experiece with CH management over a period of time and weather, much less this pool.

To boot, I guess the other inexperience question is could a leak of that small a loss be detected if I wanted to pursue it? I know for fact I'm losing calcium, I just can pin to reason or if just a normal occurrence with swimming and a rain to overflow once during the period.

 

[newdude]

Maybe I ought to just take it up to 400-500 and see what it does on the relative?

If you do, Murphy's will kick in and it will start increasing immediately

Once a possible pool leak gets in your brain, everything gets magnified on your watch

I feel ya. I would have been right there with you with the new pool if I didn't notice the morning steam towards the back of the season. It held water dead on all summer and then BOOM needed two top offs a week.

(Immediately after they finished the patio so I could myself silly). But I trusted what my eyes saw and a month later, it holds water again.

Keep us posted.

 

[Toxophilite]

Keep us posted.

Thanks! Knowing me, this opera ain't finished for a bit till I'm satisfied.

 

[duraleigh]

There are reported extremes of CH on this forum from 100 to 1200 and all seem to be mostly manageable. My point is your CH loss is inconsequential and I would ignore it. Your water leak seems inconsequential, too, and I would ignore it as well.

Are you closing for the winter?

 

[Toxophilite]

There are reported extremes of CH on this forum from 100 to 1200 and all seem to be mostly manageable. My point is your CH loss is inconsequential and I would ignore it. Your water leak seems inconsequential, too, and I would ignore it as well.

Are you closing for the winter?

Thank you!!! No closing for winter. My CH had been one of the least concerns, well, I've actually had none, but until I found that instead of residual or rising CH, I was eventually losing calcium over each adittion to raise it. I honestly think I could talk myself into living with a tiny leakage and the loss of calcium and be grateful I don't have to do drains in the future. I think that's where all this chasing has gotten me. There is or is not a tiny leak, and if there is, nothing I could do anyway, barring it finally showing up in a more defined state. I know it would be on me to pressure test, as the PB is not going to send one out just to test my hypothesis. Just from a peace of mind factor, this really helps!

 

[Toxophilite]

Update: First time since Spring that ground is finally at a saturation level. Came home and small amount of water had come up through paver next to spa, which has never happened. Assume any small leak was just prior absorbed and away. A little DPD powder confirmed my suspicions - positive for chlorine as fresh pool/spa water. Letting all rest in off till drains down enough to see where stops, but greatest suspicion is spa. PB called and will take care of.

 

[Toxophilite]

Spa has been off and slow losing water, hampered a few days by refill from heavy rain, but down about 1/2 way now. As some of head has come off, I'm now seeing occasionally a trail of air bubbles coming from around light in bottom wall. Does that about a minute, and then quits for awhile. Anyways, trying to wrap my head around what seals these Microbrites and where this air equalization might be coming from. I read that leakage is an issue with these lights, and, PB mentioned its probability. How do these things seal and where?

Edited: I actually have Microbrites. Just trying to understand how the light itself can be leaking water, making air bubbles and where water would exit pool. Seems the actual conduit and fitting is no different than a return set up.