Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Results 1 to 20 of 20

Thread: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

  1. Back To Top    #1

    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Hudson
    Posts
    16

    Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    The summary of the tests from the pool center were:
    FAC:0
    TAC:0
    CH:60
    CYA:0
    TA:100
    pH:8
    Copper:0
    Iron:0
    TDS:300
    Pho:300

    4600 gallon pool (15'*42"), vinyl, above ground

    These results are after a 96% refill without any chemicals being added

    Question being:

    Was told to do the following steps:
    1.) add 4fl oz of liquid muriatic acid to adjust the pH
    2.) wait 4 hours
    3.) add 3oz of Power Powder to adjust the FAC
    4.) wait 4 hours
    5.) add 2 caps of PHOSFree +
    6.) wait three days then add 1/2 gallon of Leslie's Conditioner for CYA
    7.) wait another 3 days
    8.) add 11 pounds of soda ash for CH

    Does this all sound correct and if not what do I do?

    Also I will retest after adding each chemical, but what should be adjusted first and then what? I have a Taylor testing kit too

    Also I have an Hayward CL200 inline, when do I add tabs to that and what setting?

    Also when to shock?


    Would also like to know when I can jump in...

    Best,
    ~Allen

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,981

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Allen, take a moment to read similar posts on this site and you'll see the same reply ..... stay away from pool store testing or products. Read the simple starter links below in my signature and most importantly, make a one-time investment if the TF-100 test kit as noted below to do your own testing. We simply cannot trust the testing from pools stores. They are notoriously inaccurate.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Do not add any powdered shock, phosphate products, or anything like that. The 3 things you will need in yore arsenal (besides the test kit) right now are, 1) Liquid "regular" bleach; 2) Muriatic Acid; 3) Granule Stabilizer. You can get the acid and granule stabilizer from the pool store if you want, but the bleach from anywhere at a good price.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  3. Back To Top    #3

    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Hudson
    Posts
    16

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    My testing came up with the following:
    Test 1 all new water 5/27

    Chlorine:
    10ml sample
    -After adding R-0870 sample turned ever so slight pink
    -2 drops of r-0871 to turn clear
    - .5*2 drops is 1ppm free chlorine
    - after adding 5 drops of r-0003 almost not present pink
    - 1 drop of r-0871 x .5 = .5ppm combined chlorine

    PH test:
    7.8
    Acid demand test took 1 drop to bring to 7.4

    Total Alkalinity:
    -took 8 Drops of r-0009 to turn red
    -8 drops x 10 = 80ppm total alkalinity as calcium carbonate

    Calcium Hardness:
    -after adding 5 drops sample turned pink
    -after adding 4 drops sample turned blue
    -4 drops x 10 = 40ppm calcium hardness as calcium carbonate

    Cyanuric Acid:
    10ish

  4. Back To Top    #4
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,981

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    You can use the POOL SCHOOL, Recommended Levels, and Calculator links in my signature to assist you. First order of business to protect your water is to add some liquid bleach to give you some FC (free chlorine) and granule stabilizer to give you some CYA (protects your chlorine). See the recommended levels and use the calculator to get you started. If you have questions, please ask. Others will chime-in as well for you.

    PS ~ Can you confirm which Taylor test kit you are using?
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  5. Back To Top    #5

    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Hudson
    Posts
    16

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    The test kit is Taylor K-2006

  6. Back To Top    #6
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,981

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Very good. So you should be able to get accurate free chlorine (FC) and other readings. With a vinyl pool, your FC should be 3-7. Don't let it drop below 3ppm. You never want CC to be over .5. Start adding some stabilizer (in a sock hung by your skimmer) to slowly bring your CYA up to about 30-50. Take it slow since once that stuff dissolves in your water it still takes about a week to get an accurate reading. You can use the Pool Calculator to tell you how much stabilizer to add, as well as acid to add to lower your PH to 7.5-7.8. The acid should also lower your TA to the recommended 70-90 range.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  7. Back To Top    #7
    poolnoob.ca's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Georgetown, ON, Canada
    Posts
    277

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    not sure why they say to wait so long before each addition, i thought 1/2 hour was enough to allow each chemical to be distributed evenly in the pool. and why the 3 day waits? your CYA will be 0 if you havent added any stabilizer yet. and the CYA will lower your pH itself so you may not even need any muriatic acid.

    in confusing pool store recommendation fashion, they want you to lower the pH with acid, then 6 days later raise it with soda ash? and it doesnt raise calcium hardness anyway. according to pool math, 11 lbs of soda ash will raise your pH by 8.3 and raise TA by 271. anyhow, if you want to raise TA you can use baking soda, which won't affect the pH nearly as much.

    so would you all agree, getting the chlorine level established with liquid chlorine and putting granular CYA in a sock to dissolve would be a good start?
    32,000L Fibreglass Leisure Pools IG 12.5'x23'x5' Pump: AstralPools BX1 1.0HP
    Filter: AstralPools ZX-310 SWCG: AstralPools VX7T
    Heater: Hayward H250FDN Test Kit: TF-100

  8. Back To Top    #8
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,981

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Very good points poolnoob.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  9. Back To Top    #9

    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Hudson
    Posts
    16

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Ok so I'll go get some liquid chlorine add that as recommended by the pool calculator then since I don't have granular CYA , I'll use the liquid conditioner that they sold me?

    Then tomorrow after a run of 12 hours or so I'll retest everything to see where it stands.

    Also when do I shock and use the pucks that I got for the inline chlorinator (bought 50# bucket so guess I should use them)...

    And during the process I'll add the PhosFree stuff?

  10. Back To Top    #10

    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Hudson
    Posts
    16

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Wait just re-read the statements...stay away from the PhosFree **** for now and work on the chlorine , CYA and pH...

    And those steps use liquid chlorine, then the conditioner and then to keep it kinda balanced use the 3" tabs using the inline. Also use the pool calculator to figure out what to do with the pH after fixing the FAC and TAC, with CYA?

  11. Back To Top    #11
    Scuba_Steve's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Pooler, GA
    Posts
    311

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    If I understand right, the liquid conditioner is just a much more expensive version of granular CYA. PoolMath will tell you how much liquid CYA to add. CYA will lower your pH. Start messing with your pH a few days after you add your CYA.

    As for the 3" tabs, return them, throw them away, or give them away to your worst enemy. They are no good. They contain CYA as well as chlorine. Once you get your CYA in line, using the hockey pucks will just add additional unwanted CYA to your pool. Stick to just adding bleach.
    6425g Intex Ultraframe 18'x48" AG
    Stock 1500gph cartridge filter / Intex SWG CG-28669 with E.C.O.
    Install date: 5/26/2015
    TF-100
    Helpful Links

  12. Back To Top    #12

    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Hudson
    Posts
    16

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Update #1:
    -added 27oz of 8.25% Bleach at 9:30pm
    -added 64oz of instant conditioner @ 10:10pm

    Will retest for everything in the morning filter being run overnight, and will repost results...

  13. Back To Top    #13

    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Hudson
    Posts
    16

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Here are the results and what I did to achieve them and after:

    5/27 9:30pm added 28oz of 8.25% bleach
    5/27 10:00pm added 64oz instant conditioner

    5/28 7:15am
    AquaChek dipstick method
    pH: 8ish
    FC: 3-4
    Alk: 80-90
    CYA: 30-50

    Taylor K-2006 method
    pH: 8

    Chlorine:
    -7.5 drops = 3.75ppm FC
    -1 drop = .5ppm CC

    TA:
    -10.5 drops = 105ppm

    CH:
    -5.5 drops = 55ppm

    CYA:
    40ppm

    5/28 @ 7:45am
    -after testing added 6oz of 31.45% muriatic acid to bring down pH


    5/28 @ 10:53am
    pH: 7.5
    FC: 7 drops * .5 = 3.5ppm
    CC: 1 drop * .5 = .5ppm

    5/28 @ 10:55
    -added 1/2 cap of pool perfect + PhosFree

    Questions being now:
    1.) Is it safe to swim in?
    2.) When do I shock the pool?
    3.) just need to follow the following guide and I should be good correct?

    Test When Range

    pH Daily 7.2 - 7.6
    Free Available Chlorine Daily 2.0 - 4.0 ppm
    Total Chlorine Daily 2.0 - 4.0 ppm
    Total Alkalinity Weekly 80 - 120 ppm *
    Calcium Hardness Weekly 200 - 400 ppm *
    Stabilizer (Cyanuric Acid) Monthly 30 - 50 ppm

    Thank you all in advance and previously for all the help!
    ~Allen

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also is it true I do not need to do anything or test for calcium as its an above ground with vinyl?

  14. Back To Top    #14
    Scuba_Steve's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Pooler, GA
    Posts
    311

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    If I remember right, CH is 1 drop for 25ppm, not 1 drop for 10ppm and doesn't matter for a vinyl pool.

    With that being said, how in the heck do you use a half of a drop? Are you doubling test volume and using 2 drops to correspond to 1?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, I didn't reread, but why do you think you need to shock the pool? If there is no algae issues you do not need to shock or slam the pool.
    6425g Intex Ultraframe 18'x48" AG
    Stock 1500gph cartridge filter / Intex SWG CG-28669 with E.C.O.
    Install date: 5/26/2015
    TF-100
    Helpful Links

  15. Back To Top    #15

    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Hudson
    Posts
    16

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    I got the "half drop" by it was pretty darn clear at 5 and really clear at 6 so I average the number...

    - - - Updated - - -

    For the shocking just thought is was the thing to do every so often to keep it at bay...

  16. Back To Top    #16

    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Central Illinois
    Posts
    41

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Count all the drops till adding another does nothing. Don't count the drop that has no effect.
    Viking Maui 2300g fiberglass in ground pool in a screened room with polycarbonate roof. 45gpm pump with sand filter manually chlorinated. Entire pool water can cycle in 51 minutes. Jacuzzi 336g hot tub with ozonator, manually chlorinated. TF 100 test kit with speed stir. Fungi pronounced Fun Guy, I'm Jim

  17. Back To Top    #17

    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Hope Mills, NC
    Posts
    556

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Just remember that if you keep your chlorine level above the recommended level based on your CYA numbers, you will NEVER need to shock.

    Oh, and consider the price of the tabs as a penalty for going to the pool store and just move on.
    16 x 32 17500 gallons
    Vinyl in-ground
    Hayward 250# Sand Filter
    1 HP Pump
    Hayward SWG

  18. Back To Top    #18
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,981

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Allen, try to remember this too ..... whenever you hear most people say "shock" your pool, they may not be talking about the same thing. "Shock can be a noun (the Chlor-brite bags at the store), or can be a verb to "over-chlorinate" your pool. TFP doesn't use the term shock because new members get confused. We use SLAM because you are not only incorporating a higher level of chlorine, but you are doing it for a specific amount of time - might be 2 days, might be 7 or more. Depends on the condition of the water and how bad it was. As for the tabs .. they're a gonner. Don't use them. I just dumped a new bottle of PoolPerfect in the trash I had stored in my cupboard for almost two years that I knew I would never use after learning TFP. Whenever all the numbers get confusing, just go back to the link in my signature for your "Recommended Levels" based on your pool type. If anything specific needs to be adjusted, there are links to tell you what to do, or just ask us again. As for chlorine, you know what to use .... regular bleach. Never let your FC drop below that recommended level.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  19. Back To Top    #19

    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Hudson
    Posts
    16

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    I have returned the tabs and chlorinator for said tabs! And as you wrote don't need to slam because my water is just added and looking great!

    So all I need to do until something looks off is keep the chlorine and pH inline daily (using the good ole bleach)

    And just need one confirmation that the pool is ready to be swam in...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Actually according. To the chart need to boost my chlorine to 5-6, but right now it's at minimum...

  20. Back To Top    #20
    Scuba_Steve's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Pooler, GA
    Posts
    311

    Re: Rough start and maybe overthinking?

    Quote Originally Posted by Figmentor View Post
    And just need one confirmation that the pool is ready to be swam in...
    Your all good, swim away!
    6425g Intex Ultraframe 18'x48" AG
    Stock 1500gph cartridge filter / Intex SWG CG-28669 with E.C.O.
    Install date: 5/26/2015
    TF-100
    Helpful Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •