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Thread: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

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    Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Hello,

    Unfortunately this year I won't be able to use the TFP method and will be forced to use tablets instead. Any tips for strictly using tablets?

    Any help appreciated!
    Thanks in advance.
    9700 gallon outdoor in-ground 11x26' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed pump; Pentair Clean and Clear Plus cartridge filter;
    Pentair MasterTemp 400 natural gas heater; 2-wheel "The Pool Cleaner"

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    My question would be why are you strictly restricted to tablets? Are you open to automating your chlorine application?
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    My work will dictate I be out of town alot so I won't be able to take care of the daily maintenance. Yes I am open to automated chlorine application. Don't like the idea of using tables at all.
    9700 gallon outdoor in-ground 11x26' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed pump; Pentair Clean and Clear Plus cartridge filter;
    Pentair MasterTemp 400 natural gas heater; 2-wheel "The Pool Cleaner"

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    Killer95Stang's Avatar
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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Rather than use tablets, I would just convert to a salt water pool and use a Salt Water Chlorine Generator. Low maintenance and the cost pretty much balances out with purchasing chlorine. Plus no hassle of lugging jugs every day.
    Pool done!! (backyard = work in progress) 32' x 19' inground freeform with 7' spa, baja step w/ (2) bubblers, stonescapes mini pebble finish, rock waterfall feature, 12" raised bond beam, Intelliflo VS, Whisperflo feature pump, (3) 5G Color LED's, FNS + DE 60, 400K Master Temp, Easytouch 8 w/ remote, Intellichlor IC40, Vision Classic Ceramic Kamado smoker, Margaritaville DM1000!!! Party Coming Soon!!
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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Any particular brand you would recommend? Also, someone told me that due to the heat in Vegas the cell needs to be replaced every 3 years. How true is that?
    9700 gallon outdoor in-ground 11x26' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed pump; Pentair Clean and Clear Plus cartridge filter;
    Pentair MasterTemp 400 natural gas heater; 2-wheel "The Pool Cleaner"

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Just buy a SWG (Salt Water Generator) that's way oversized for your pool and it's no problem. I have a Hayward AquaRite AQR15 that is rated for up to 40k pools, and my first cell lasted 7 1/2 years. You can find a unit like mine online for about $1k. Once installed and dialed in you chlorine cost is just cell replacements. In my case $400/7.5 = $57 per year. Other than testing about the only things I do is empty the skimmers and add a bit of acid to rebalance the pH about once a week.

    It's hotter in Tucson than Las Vegas.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, Hayward H400 & Heliocol Solar heating, A&A infloor system, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Is this something I can install myself? My neighbor is a master electrician if that would help.
    9700 gallon outdoor in-ground 11x26' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed pump; Pentair Clean and Clear Plus cartridge filter;
    Pentair MasterTemp 400 natural gas heater; 2-wheel "The Pool Cleaner"

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Yes you can install, just some PVC cutting and gluing. Wiring is pretty straightforward. You can find the manual online and read up on the installation requirements before purchasing the unit.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, Hayward H400 & Heliocol Solar heating, A&A infloor system, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Thanks! Will do research on the entire process, but do have a quick question. So basically you just pour a specified amount of salt in your pool and the generator takes care of the rest?
    9700 gallon outdoor in-ground 11x26' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed pump; Pentair Clean and Clear Plus cartridge filter;
    Pentair MasterTemp 400 natural gas heater; 2-wheel "The Pool Cleaner"

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    The SWG breaks down the salt, releasing free chlorine which (after its done its job sanitizing your water) recombines back into salt in the water and the process is then repeated. No salt is used up, so no additional salt is needed. The only cost (after the original unit) is the replacement cells that are depleted after several years, and a bit of electricity to power the electrolysis process. Each cell will only produce a given amount of chlorine before it is depleted and must be replaced, that is how you pay for chlorine when using a SWG system. The higher rated cells will produce more chlorine in a day and much more total chlorine before replacement is needed. So it's always more economical to buy the bigger capacity cell. In the case of the Hayward AquaRite that's the T-15 cell.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, Hayward H400 & Heliocol Solar heating, A&A infloor system, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    The salt dissociates into sodium and chloride ions as soon as it dissloves. The chloride ion has 8 electrons in the outer shell. As the chloride ion goes through the cell, one electron is pulled off by the charged plates. This creates elemental
    chlorine. Two chlorine atoms combine to make chlorine gas, which dissolves into the water to make hypochlorous acid and hypochlorite ions. The chlorine in hypochlorous acid or hypochlorite has 6 electrons in the outer valence shell.
    When chlorine oxidizes something, it pulls two electrons from whatever it's oxidizing and becomes chloride again with 8 electrons in the outer shell.

    There's almost no actual salt in the water other than very small amounts in equilibrium with the sodium and chloride ions.

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    If you do find yourself in a position where you need to use trichlor pucks then there are just a couple of things to keep an eye on. Pucks are fairly acidic so keep an extra eye on your PH. And the main issue is that they add CYA so once you get up to 50 or 60 ppm of CYA you either need to stop using pucks or be prepared to do partial drain and refill of your water to reduce the CYA level. Like at say 80 ppm or so you will want to do about a 25-30% water change to lower it back to around 60 ppm. Be sure to maintain your FC level based on your current CYA level and the Chlorine CYA Chart.
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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Thanks! I may not be in a position to implement the SWG this year due to the short time I'm dealing with. How much time would I need once the SWG is installed? If I must use pucks I can easily drain my pool if necessary and have to every couple of years anyways because of the hardness of the water out here in Vegas.
    9700 gallon outdoor in-ground 11x26' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed pump; Pentair Clean and Clear Plus cartridge filter;
    Pentair MasterTemp 400 natural gas heater; 2-wheel "The Pool Cleaner"

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    If I'm forced to use tablets this year will it do any damage to the pool if chemicals are properly maintained?
    9700 gallon outdoor in-ground 11x26' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed pump; Pentair Clean and Clear Plus cartridge filter;
    Pentair MasterTemp 400 natural gas heater; 2-wheel "The Pool Cleaner"

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Quote Originally Posted by badgerwooz View Post
    If I'm forced to use tablets this year will it do any damage to the pool if chemicals are properly maintained?
    They won't damage your pool. The concern with tri-chlor tablets is that they add CYA (aka stabilizer) to the water. When the CYA level gets too high (70ppm+), it renders the chlorine ineffective, which will lead to algae. If you keep a close eye on your CYA level and replace water when it gets out of range, then the tablets are fine.

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    As an SWG owner.......I'd vote for that. I test water once a week when open. And unlike others with SWG once I get my TA in range at opening I don't have an issue with PH rise. Love it. No need to feed the pool.
    18*36*23 true "L" vinyl IG 29,000 gallons. SWG. TF-100 test kit.
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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    3 Questions regarding SWGs.
    1. Since my pool is only 9700 gallons would the Hayward AQR9 be good (25000 gallons) or would it be better to buck up and get the AQR15 (40000 gallons)?
    2. Does the SWG need to be hooked up to a timer or does it only work when water is flowing through it?
    3. Can you shock at a lower CYA level and bring it up to the 60-80 range after?
    9700 gallon outdoor in-ground 11x26' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed pump; Pentair Clean and Clear Plus cartridge filter;
    Pentair MasterTemp 400 natural gas heater; 2-wheel "The Pool Cleaner"

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Hi badger

    I can't answer the first question.

    On the second question, the SWG should be wired to the same power supply as your pump. So if pump is on SWG is on. In our case that is the timer. The SWG is on when the pump is on. We can control the percent of time the SWG is actually producing chlorine via the SWG settings in 20% increments.......meaning is it producing chlorine 20% of the time it's on (with pump running) or producing 40%, 60%, 80 or 100% of the time. That is an adjustment you'd want to make along with your pump run time.

    Third question.......yes. You can shock (SLAM) at lower cya. It is easier to do so as a matter of fact.

    As and SWG owner I can tell you that when SLAM is in order, I usually shut the SWG off and manually add chlorine. But for regular maintenance once cleared, the SWG is nice.
    18*36*23 true "L" vinyl IG 29,000 gallons. SWG. TF-100 test kit.
    http://tftestkits.net/splash-page.html

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    Thanks everyone for your help! 1 last question for now. Based on the picture below any ideas on how I would put the SWG after the heater and before the return T-Valve. Not alot of pipe to work with as you can see.

    IMG_0026.jpg
    9700 gallon outdoor in-ground 11x26' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed pump; Pentair Clean and Clear Plus cartridge filter;
    Pentair MasterTemp 400 natural gas heater; 2-wheel "The Pool Cleaner"

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    Re: Unable to use TFP method this year ... help!

    I hope somebody else can chime in on this one. I don't know about placement with a heater. You can see our setup in the pic. The water hits the SWG after filter on way back to returns.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    18*36*23 true "L" vinyl IG 29,000 gallons. SWG. TF-100 test kit.
    http://tftestkits.net/splash-page.html

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