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Thread: Pool place gave up?>?????

  1. Back To Top    #1

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    Angry Pool place gave up?>?????

    Hello,

    I have a problem the pool place has been trying to fix for over 3 weeks. They finally told me to get a new pool??

    Here is the problem in as much detail as possible. First time I have ever used internet to ask for help so please be kind.

    Pool= 12,000 gallon
    Pump = Everbuilt 1.5 HP 1.10 SQ
    Filter = American Products Titan SS 24 SQ FT DE

    Problem = Moved into home and the water was clear but the bottom of pool had patches of algae near main drain and other areas. Stirred up the algae and shocked pool. Chlorine level is purple on stick. I also tested chlorine and PH level with a tester using 5 drops. It is extremely high as the pool store sent me home with 25 lbs of shock and told me to dump it all in. It seemed like a lot of shock for 12,000 gallons based on what I have read? The real problem is I am unable to run my DE filter longer then 10 - 15 minutes as the pressure rises to 25-30 psi. If I backwash/rinse/backwash/rinse it drops the pressure to 18 psi and then clogs in the same amount of time 10-15 minutes.

    The pool place told me once I shock let it sit for 1 hour and then vacuum to waste. I did this and a lot of green algae came out. It looked like a ninja turtle exploded on my lawn.

    I took DE filter apart and cleaned each grid and put everything back together. The top filter I noticed collapsed in on itself so I bought a new one and installed it.(little screen filter at top of manifold) When I turned unit on the pressure was at 15 psi. 10-15 minutes later the pressure is 28 psi quickly climbing. I pulled the lid back off and DE is evenly coated on grids. Not green with algae. The top screen on manifold is collapsed again.

    For testing I took the filter assembly and grids out of tank to see what the pressure would do. It maintained 15 psi for over 1 hour. This would tell me something is clogging the grids? Is it normal for a DE filter to clog every 10-15 minutes depending what is floating in water?

    Is it safe to assume I don't have a suction side air leak as the filter maintains normal pressure when grid assembly is out of tank?

    I am adding 1 pound of DE for every 10 sq ft. 2.4 lbs of DE for my 24 sq ft filter. Is that correct?

    The grids I purchased a week ago. They are Pleatco 18 inch grids.

    Any help would be greatly appreciated.

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Hello and welcome. Well, you have a couple things going on (algae & filter), but first thing's first - we need to keep you out of the pool store. Horrible advice and we're not surprised to hear it. For your algae, you need to Pool School - SLAM - Shock Level And Maintain. Read this page, stock-up on regular liquid bleach (generic is fine) and get ready to treat. Do you have a TF-100 or Taylor K-2006 test kit? If not, you need one and can get it from TFTestkits.net. I would recommend the TF-100 (XL size) because it has Taylor reagents but in larger quantities - better value. Also ask for the Speed Stir. Do NOT put anything else in your water other than what you see on the Pool School - Recommended Levels listing. Since you have algae, perhaps add about 1/2 gallon of bleach a day until your kit arrives. As for the filter, please see THIS THREAD for some great info. Let us know if you still have some questions.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

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    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    To answer your question. Yes, what you are experiencing with your DE filter is normal. DE filters are extremely efficient and if you get algae, they clog very quickly. And a 24 sq ft filter is a relatively small one, so .....

    Now for the rest of the story,
    Study up on how to SLAM as Texas Splash mentions. I suspect with having added so much shock, and your source of chlorine from past regimen, that your CYA may be too high anyway. If it is, you need to remedy that before trying to clean up the algae problem.

    Once your CYA is checked out and corrected if required,I would recommend to set your filter valve to recirculate so it doesnt clog up so quickly. Then vacuum to waster now and then until you get to a point where your filter can take over and not clog so quickly.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    You will be thankful the pool store gave up in the end. You can take care of your pool MUCH better and cheaper than they can.

    You are on the right track:

    -found TFP-done

    -Ask question-done

    -get good test kit-hoping an order will be made today (please)

    -vacuum stuff off of the bottom to waste-should do

    -take picture of water looking down at the steps to watch progress-once a day

    Let us know when your test kit gets there please.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    WOW - Never expected so many responses. THIS SITE gives me hope.... There are actually people who won't give up on me!!!! I just ordered test kit with speedstir. TF-100 Test Kit XL option w/speedstir w/xl option

    I noticed a lot of particulates floating on top of water. Is there anything I can do while waiting on test kit to clear that out? Like a floc to make it drop and vacuum to waste?

    How much bleach are you all thinking I need to stock? 10-20 gallons?

    When my test kit arrives what numbers do you need from it to diagnose my water chem?

    Is the kit easy to use? Never really used a kit like that before.

    Thank you everyone for helping with my problem. Outstanding response time. Sheesh!

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    Casey's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    That DE filter is going to need more supervision than a 2 year old wired on Fun Dip.

    Get a TF100 and read up n we can help you get this cleared. What type of pool do you have?

    As for how much bleach, double what you think you may need n keep it in a cool, dark place like a basement. Stay out of the pool store n stop thinking you need their products! You're here now. Listen to us and give your pool only what it needs. You don't need anything but chlorine.
    I'd bet you my bikini you'll never get TFP water from a pool store!

    24' Sharkline Venture De Filter

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    on the test kit. You'll be pleasantly amazed. As for the floc, I wouldn't use it right now. Best we wait until you can post a full suite of test results and give the TFP method a chance to resolve your issue. Another consideration as noted earlier is your unknown CYA (Stabilizer) level. If it's too high, you may need to replace some water which is the only way to lower CYA - something the pool store never tells you when they are selling you tablets that raise CYA. As for bleach, a bit of a guess right now, but perhaps think about 10-15 initially. After a day or two in the SLAM you'll know how much more to get. The kit is easy to use with great instructions inside. If at any time you have a question, just ask us and we'll help clarify. Until the kit arrives, just add that 1/2 gallon of bleach per day which is only to help try keep the algae from getting worse. The SLAM treatment will begin once you get the kit. When you receive yout TF-100, we'll be looking for the following:
    FC
    CC
    pH
    TA
    CH
    CYA

    Hope this helps.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Oh, and keep this product handy: Pool School - Chlorine / CYA Chart. It is "key" to ensuring a well-balanced chlorine/stabilizer level for your water. You'll understand more when you kit comes in.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  8. Back To Top    #8

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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Casey - I am ready to listen as I have given up hope. Test kit on the way. I will go get 10 gallons of bleach and store in dark place.

    I have an in ground pool 12,000 gallon. built in 1989. Has been resurfaced in 2002. *Supposedly* I feel like Tom Hanks in money pit.

    The pool place sold me 25 lbs of shock for 12,000 gallons. Sometimes when your so focused on an outcome you don't think about the steps and just buy anything someone puts in front of you.

    Anyways - I will respond back when test kit comes in. Any idea what I should be doing with pool currently? Should I leave it on recirculate with all that shock in there? Or just leave it off?

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    LOL you can breath now..........We have you covered.

    Take a picture of your pool and share it here so we can see what we are dealing with. You can use photobucket or such to upload it.

    I am going to share a link with you. It will show you what we use in our pools. You do NOT want to go out and buy any of it yet. You will notice floc or such is NOT on the list.

    Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals

    You have the best test kit there is AND the magic stirrer! WAY to go!

    10 gals will get you started. It all depends on so many things. You might go through that in one day or it might take a week to use it up. It all depends on what we are working with. That is why a picture will be helpful.

    A little housekeeping please: lets get your signature set up........go to "settings" (upper right hand), "edit signature" (left hand side)......put in pool size, equipment-filter type, pump size, pool type, features, ect.

    While you are waiting for your test kit to get there you should do a little reading. It will seem a little overwhelming BUT if you take it a bite at a time you will get it. It will take several reads for it all to sink in and when you go to do the test and such it will all fall into place. These links will show the hows and whys of TFP

    Print these out:

    Pool School - Recommended Levels

    Pool School - Basic Pool Care Schedule

    Book mark these:

    Pool School - ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry

    http://www.troublefreepool.com/calc.html

    https://www.youtube.com/user/tf100te...e=results_main

    As you can see we have it all covered AND we LOVE to help so ask any and all questions you might have.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Our goal is to keep you out of the pool store (except for toys) and enjoy the fruits of your investment. With your test results, you'll be amazed how easy water management can be. That TF-100 was the first step. Keep all of these links handy on your desktop:
    Pool School - ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry
    Pool School - Chlorine / CYA Chart
    Poolmath calculator
    Pool School - Recommended Levels
    Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Quote Originally Posted by blenheimfire View Post
    WOW - Never expected so many responses. THIS SITE gives me hope.... There are actually people who won't give up on me!!!! I just ordered test kit with speedstir. TF-100 Test Kit XL option w/speedstir w/xl option

    I noticed a lot of particulates floating on top of water. Is there anything I can do while waiting on test kit to clear that out? Like a floc to make it drop and vacuum to waste?

    How much bleach are you all thinking I need to stock? 10-20 gallons?

    When my test kit arrives what numbers do you need from it to diagnose my water chem?

    Is the kit easy to use? Never really used a kit like that before.

    Thank you everyone for helping with my problem. Outstanding response time. Sheesh!
    First things first; Welcome to TFP!!

    Folks have given you great advice so far. I know you are excited, but you need to understand it will all work out. Excitement needs to be saved for things like the Adventurers Club and Pleasure Island closing; what the heck is a "Disney Springs" anyway - but I digress-

    We base our pool care system on accurate testing and only adding what the pool needs, when it needs it. To do that you need your own accurate test kit. You have that on order, great! I will tell you, it didn't turn green overnight and it will take time to clear. But, we can teach you how to get it sparkling and keep it that was for a lot less money than the pool store.

    Pat has already given you a link to the SLAM Process we follow to clear a pool, but now it's time to read. Start with these:
    ABCs of Water Chemistry
    Recommended Pool Chemicals
    How to Chlorinate Your Pool

    As you read, ask questions. We want you to understand it.

    When you are out and about find your source for chlorine. Concentrated bleach is 8.25%, but many pool stores in Florida stock 10% or 12.5%, many times in refillable 2.5 gallon "carboys". So, compare costs and find out which is least expensive. Bad at math like me? Well, one of our members put together this "Liquid Chlorine Calculator" that makes it easy. If you do go into the pool store for chlorine, ignore everything they say. If not, you need to understand their methods for giving advice - But, I notice you store gave advice not on the wheel, "new pool"



    So, welcome to TFP!!
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Okay signature updated. Thank you
    Pictures of pool: http://i910.photobucket.com/albums/a...23_resized.jpg http://i910.photobucket.com/albums/a...30_resized.jpg

    Should I let my pool recirculate now with all the shock in there?
    In ground 12,000 Gallon(ish) 1.5 HP Everbuilt pump, American Products Titan SS DE filter, Pleatco grids purchased 1 week ago.

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Quote Originally Posted by blenheimfire View Post
    Okay signature updated. Thank you
    Pictures of pool: http://i910.photobucket.com/albums/a...23_resized.jpg http://i910.photobucket.com/albums/a...30_resized.jpg

    Should I let my pool recirculate now with all the shock in there?
    Yes, I would
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Quote Originally Posted by blenheimfire View Post
    I noticed a lot of particulates floating on top of water. Is there anything I can do while waiting on test kit to clear that out? Like a floc to make it drop and vacuum to waste?
    Your best friend for floating "stuff," which is often organic matter like pollen is a skimmer sock. Cheap, effective, and helps the filter do its job.

    Quote Originally Posted by blenheimfire View Post
    How much bleach are you all thinking I need to stock? 10-20 gallons?
    Generally speaking, stocking up on bleach is not a good idea (it has a half life), but in your situation, 10 gallons wouldn't be unreasonable. In your area, it may be more cost effective to buy "liquid chlorine" at the pool store. Here is a calculator aid to help sort it out: http://poncatechsquad.com/Dan/Chlorine/

    Quote Originally Posted by blenheimfire View Post
    When my test kit arrives what numbers do you need from it to diagnose my water chem?
    A resounding, "Yes!"

    Quote Originally Posted by blenheimfire View Post
    Is the kit easy to use? Never really used a kit like that before.
    Simply follow the instructions and it is very easy.

  15. Back To Top    #15
    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Hey y'all look! This will be an easy one once he gets his test kit! It is not a swamp! Happy day!

    For right now:

    -run pump 24/7

    -clean filter when it is 25% over clean pressure (clean pressure is what it is at right after you clean it)

    -Do not add any more bleach/chlorine for right now.

    -read and read some more all of the links you have been given (did you notice we all gave the same links LOL)

    -brush about 3 times a day to get any of the stuff up and into the water so the bleach can kill it

    Pool store said get a new pool? OH MY! Please tell me you will NEVER go there again except to get liquid chlorine or pool toys!

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

  16. Back To Top    #16

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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Kim,

    I can't run pump 24/7 the DE filter goes up in pressure within 10-15 minutes.(30 - 32 psi) Backwashing/rinsing drops it back down for the same amount of time. I assume this is normal? I have almost gone through a 20lb bag of DE in 4 hours. Something doesn't seem right.

    Currently I am running pump in recirculate mode. I can't just keep flushing money down the toilet with the DE filter. Any suggestions? The grids are new only a week old.

    Not only am I never going there again I am waiting on a call back from the owner to discuss the lousy service and horrid recommendations. The shock they sold me was 59 dollars. 25 lbs. According to this site that is wayyyyy too much shock.

    I have received more help from this site in the 2 hours my post has been live then I did from the pool store in 3 weeks. I think I scored a win signing up here

    Question: what is SWG? I was reading the Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals and it mentions SWG.. Not sure what that is?
    In ground 12,000 Gallon(ish) 1.5 HP Everbuilt pump, American Products Titan SS DE filter, Pleatco grids purchased 1 week ago.

  17. Back To Top    #17
    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Quote Originally Posted by blenheimfire View Post
    Question: what is SWG? I was reading the Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals and it mentions SWG.. Not sure what that is?
    That is a Salt Water Chlorine Generator. It is a method of adding chlorine to the pool automatically.

    I forgot about your issues with teh DE filter. With your pressure rise you are correct not to leave it running in filter mode unattended.

    Is all of the shock you added dissolved, of can you even see the bottom at this point? If it is all dissolved and well mixed then no need to run the pump 24/7 until you start the SLAM.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

  18. Back To Top    #18
    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    SWG = Salt Water Generator. That pool store shock is more trouble than it's worth. If it's unopened, see if you can convince them to return it or at least get store credit for something else. As for the DE, stick with recirculate for now. Always remember, no amount of filtering will clear algae. Only sanitation (chlorine/bleach) will do that. The filter simply picks-up the residual dead organic material.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  19. Back To Top    #19

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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Tim,

    I posted pictures of pool to help give you a visual(Above in another post). I can't see the bottom of pool. Lots of particulates floating on top of the water. Not sure if what is floating on top of water is the shock? Dead algae? Whatever it is I am sure its partly responsible for clogging up the DE filter.

    Pump is currently recirculating the water. If I get water tested at new pool store will that give you all the numbers you need to see?

    Thanks again for all the replies and help guys/gals!
    In ground 12,000 Gallon(ish) 1.5 HP Everbuilt pump, American Products Titan SS DE filter, Pleatco grids purchased 1 week ago.

  20. Back To Top    #20
    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Pool place gave up?>?????

    Don't bother with another pool store. If you have read around here much you have probably seen that not much credence is given to pool store testing. While you would think that a "professional" would be the best, unfortunately in most cases it is quite the opposite. Between employees who blindly trust the word of chemical sales representatives and high school kids working in the pool store for the summer you end up with poor results from their testing. In my case two different pool stores told me my CYA was "fine", around 70 or 80. When I tested myself I found it over 200.

    Your kit will be here soon enough.

    There are a great group of folks here willing to help. As I said before, relax and we will get you there.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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