cloudy after pool party

[Punchyp]

so i had my pool perfectly clear, holding chlorine fine, free ch was at or near 12, cya at 50, ph 7.0.
8 people got in to play volleyball, one hour later it was a little hazy, i checked the FC it was at 9.5. I went ahead added a quart of liquid ch.
I left for about 6 hours, when i got home, could barely the bottom of 5.5 feet deep pool, i didnt check the FC at midnight, i just dumped a gallon in.
next day (yesterday- sunday) it was clearing up but still not completely clear yet today and i have been keeping it at the slam target of 18 now for almost 2 days. I checked FC this morning, only lost 1.0 to 1.5 overnight it was at 16.5 or 17, but theres gray gunk settling on seams like dead algea.
What the heck is going on? i did have an issue with something eating chlorine but i got it stabilized and it was holding chlorine.
I am confused

 

[Texas Splash]

i did have an issue with something eating chlorine but i got it stabilized and it was holding chlorine.

Was this statement related to before the party? If so, did you do n actual SLAM Process back then?

 

[proavia]

What test kit are you using? Add it to your signature.

You mentioned you lost 1.0 to 1.5 FC overnight. That indicates a SLAM Process is needed.

Post a full set of current test results from one of the recommended test kits. Or enter the numbers in PoolMath and share your logs here.

 

[Punchyp]

so i had my pool perfectly clear, holding chlorine fine, free ch was at or near 12, cya at 50, ph 7.0.
8 people got in to play volleyball, one hour later it was a little hazy, i checked the FC it was at 9.5. I went ahead added a quart of liquid ch.
I left for about 6 hours, when i got home, could barely the bottom of 5.5 feet deep pool, i didnt check the FC at midnight, i just dumped a gallon in.
next day (yesterday- sunday) it was clearing up but still not completely clear yet today and i have been keeping it at the slam target of 18 now for almost 2 days. I checked FC this morning, only lost 1.0 to 1.5 overnight it was at 16.5 or 17, but theres gray gunk settling on seams like dead algea.
What the heck is going on? i did have an issue with something eating chlorine but i got it stabilized and it was holding chlorine.
I am confused

Hey Texas, im using taylor k-2006 kit. The statement you asked about was prior to pool party, and there is more to this story. I did (tried to do) an ascorbic acid stain treatment about a month ago. so i lowered the FC to about 3 before i added the ascorbic acid, and after that i could not keep up with the FC loss for the 2 week no slam period req'd after ascorbic acid and metal flocculant treatment. I did not add algaecide per direction, because i was not letting FC go to zero. pool has no blanket, no cover, snd is in full sun. Water stayed kinda hazy during the 2 week no slam period, water never turned green but i couldn't keep chlorine in it After 2 weeks i slammed to 18 per pool math app. the gray crud started accumulating, but water stayed kinda hazy for a couple days until I went up to 28 on FC, that seemed to clear it and my overnight loss went to 1 or even less on some nights. i though i had it back under control until this weekend. The FC was plenty high before the party, and even when the water was turning hazy again the FC was still at 9.5.
Can algea live in that level of Chlorine or do i have mold or something?
I thought 1.0 ppm overnight loss was ok?
Sorry i'm all over the place, I've been using TFP method for 3 years now, and havent had a problem in the last 2 years.

 

[Texas Splash]

Can algea live in that level of Chlorine or do i have mold or something?
I thought 1.0 ppm overnight loss was ok?

One problem (IMO) is attempting an AA treatment in the summer. Even with a good Polyquat 60 algaecide, which you elected not to use, the water is much more susceptible to algae due to the extremely low FC level in the summer heat. That's what I suspect happened. While the water may have appeared to be good, you had a residual organic level that was a ticking time bomb. You never really completed a SLAM thoroughly passing all 3 SLAM criteria, so you simply slowed any algae. Problem now is if you do a SLAM, it will probably result in stains returning. If I were you I would prepare for a SLAM Process so that you can have clear water. Then as you prepare for closing, or next spring while the water is still cold, do another AA at that time. The cold water will work in your favor to avoid algae. But remember that after an AA treatment the iron is still in the water, so unless you change the water you'll have to use a sequestrant to control it from staining again.

 

[Punchyp]

ahh. some of the the stains are already back, so that part has already happened. the funny thing is i dont where these metals are coming from.
All pvc plumbing, new pump last summer. i am using a couple of older paper filters but i soak in filter cleaner and dry before i cycle them back in.
I took off the winter cover in march and let the spring rains fill it about 4 to 6 inches, the last inch or inch and a half i filled with hose, and have not added any more hose water to this point. I'm on municipal water supply not a well.
I've had this staining issue for the last 2 or 3 years and just cant get rid of it, even after 2 winter pump downs and rain refills.
2 years ago or maybe it was last year, i took the water in to pool store to test for iron, they said there was not enough to cause any staining.
i read somewhere that stains can come from under the liner. This liner is 9 or 10 yrs old and faded badly., but no holes or leaks yet.
I figured if was bleeding thru from underneath the ascorbic would not lift it.

I'll check in tomorrow. when i left this morning, i just added a quart and a half and it was at 16.5 prior to that. That amount was supposed to take it up to 20.
i did use a sequestrant after the ascorbic, called Metal Out, put in 2 cups a week after i added one quart when the stains lifted with the ascorbic acid about a month ago.

I will post my complete test results from this evening and tomorrow morning.

 

[Punchyp]

Test results:
last night at 10:00 pm my FC=21, CC=0, PH=7.0 ALk=40. CYA = 40 or 45, (judgement call on the little black dot test)
this morn at 7:30 am FC=18.5! definitely have something growing in my pool, I dumped another gallon to bring it up to 28. hopefully it will still be above slam target of 18 when i get home tonight.
Hot and sunny today so not sure what will be left by then.

 

[reggiehammond]

Test results:
last night at 10:00 pm my FC=21, CC=0, PH=7.0 ALk=40. CYA = 40 or 45, (judgement call on the little black dot test)
this morn at 7:30 am FC=18.5! definitely have something growing in my pool, I dumped another gallon to bring it up to 28. hopefully it will still be above slam target of 18 when i get home tonight.
Hot and sunny today so not sure what will be left by then.

The worst way to SLAM is haphazardly. If your CYA is 50 (round up from 45) then your SLAM level is 20.
Taking FC to 28 only wastes chlorine; it does nothing for you.

Keep on it - dosing as often and frequently as possible.

 

[HermanTX]

CYA = 40 or 45, (judgement call on the little black dot test)

There are many of us that use a slightly modified process. Rather than looking down the tube while you are squirting the sample this is my recommendation.
Make your mixture as directed. Then pour it to a set known level that is higher then your current CYA. Let’s say it is 80. Pour to the 80 mark and confirm that you can see the dot. Then pour sufficient mixture to the 70 mark. Then look again. If you see the dot, continue by pouring again to the 60 mark. Do this until you do not see the dot. Then use the mark that you last saw the dot as your CYA. This does 2 things. 1 - you only look in the tube after you pour to the next decade mark so you are not constantly looking at the dot. 2- this maintains that you only report your CYA in decade numbers. You do not want to interpret between the decade lines as it is a logarithm scale, therefore not uniform between the decade numbers.

 

[Punchyp]

Well this is just beyond my comprehension. I have kept my Free Chlorine at slam level (20) all weekend thru the daylight hours and I am still losing 3 to 5 ppm over night and the gray crud is still collecting on seams and any depressions on bottom of pool. What the heck is going on in my water? My Ph = 7.4, Alk =60, CYA =50. I have no cover on the pool day or night, and it sits in full sun all day.
I have not taken my wall light out yet to see whats behind there, but i've read that stuff can live in behind the light. is that true?
I'm in week 2 or 3 of this battle and I've gone thru cases of chlorine. The water is clear, this is what i don't understand. i had my overnight loss down to 1.0 two different times and though i had it whipped but it comes right back within one day. What else could be growing in my water? It's Definitely not the pink slime/white mold, i have seen that stuff before, several years ago after a life jacket that had been in the ocean got in the pool.
Also i just put in a brand new paper filter on Thursday evening.
i'm at the end of my rope and about ready to dump 4 gallons in and get to to 100 ppm

 

[reggiehammond]

More FC won't do you any good and can damage your equipment. Bad idea.

You have algae lurking somewhere - there's many many people who've been in the same situation. It just requires time and effort to find it. Lights, drains, skimmers, stairs, ladders, floats, etc can all be a source. Tackle each one, one by one, and see what you can find!

Keep the faith - you'll find it! Post a few photos of your pool from different angles and the experts here can help with ideas.

 

[Punchyp]

ok, tonight the wall light comes out, and the floor drain cover comes off to inspect.
The only other place it could be is behind the in-wall ladder or in the plumbing, my steps are covered by the vinyl liner.
So i should just keep it at 20 for however long it takes?

 

[proavia]

Chances are the in-pool ladder has algae in it.
Remove it, inspect and clean thoroughly (inside and out). Leave it out until after the SLAM Process.

 

[Punchyp]

oh boy, i've never taken that out before, what happens with the liner when i remove ladder?
Will water get behind the liner?

 

[proavia]

Show us a few pics of the ladder and how it's mounted.

 

[Punchyp]

ok sound ggod, i'll take some pics tonight and post tomorrow.
it just a white, plastic, 3 step sidewall ladder. I think its attached to the sidewall with 3 or 4 screws on each side that are behind a little plastic trim cover piece.
It seems that if i took ladder out the edges of liner would be open to get water behind it. I hope i don't have to pump down pool to remove that.

 

[Dirk]

Just to rule it out, suspect your FC test results. Is your chlorine actually the strength it's supposed to be? Chlorine loses its strength over time. Where are you buying chlorine? How old is it? How are you storing it? Etc. Could be your math, too, like if your water volume is off. Could be your test reagents, as well. All of those things can skew test results and dosing and give you false OCLT results. If you are dosing based on FC testing, and then just assuming you are going to be at the intended FC without confirming it, then you might not be aware of one of those issues.

Test your FC after dark. Then dose as per Pool Math while circulating at high speed. Test your water 15-30 minutes later to confirm you have the FC you're supposed to. If not, then you can troubleshoot which of the above list is the culprit. If you have an active algae issue, the second test might be lower than the first, but if it's already 1.0ppm lower, then maybe you don't actually have overnight chlorine loss, but rather some other test-skewing problem.

If you get the FC you're supposed to, then at least you've ruled all that out, and can continue the algae hunt.

 

[Punchyp]

seems that the chlorine strength is as advertised and the dosing seems really close to what pool math is telling me. I have been testing at bedtime and early morning. I have not assumed any FC readings based on pool math calcs. Mostly buying 10% at rural king and also some 12.5% from menards.
Last night at 9:30 it was 21.5 or 22, this morning 19.0. I did not see any gray gunk this morning but sunlight brings it on. I pulled light out and took the floor drain cover off last night, and no signs of anything in either place. I cant believe its behind the ladder, but i may try to take it out tonight, just to be sure. Attached are some pics of pool and ladder. the gray gunk was not bad last night, but wife said it was really bad earlier in the day but she vac'd it out with our battery powered vacuum. In one of the pics you can barely see some of it accumulating along a seam and a small glob nearby the seam.
I put it back up to 20 before i left this morning, cloudy and a bit cool today, so I'll see where it's at this evening, I feel like i might have it now, or i'm really close to beating this Crud.

 

[Punchyp]

More FC won't do you any good and can damage your equipment. Bad idea.

You have algae lurking somewhere - there's many many people who've been in the same situation. It just requires time and effort to find it. Lights, drains, skimmers, stairs, ladders, floats, etc can all be a source. Tackle each one, one by one, and see what you can find!

Keep the faith - you'll find it! Post a few photos of your pool from different angles and the experts here can help with ideas.

I think i finally beat it down and had no FC loss overnight and it even rained some also.
i messed up and replied to myself yesterday, but i did take out light and drain cover on Monday evening, both spots were all clear.
I didn't take out wall ladder, i find it hard to believe its behind there after seeing how clean the light and drain were.
During the daylight hours yesterday only lost 3-4 ppm and had been losing 6 or more per day, and zero loss last night. if this crud comes back when my FC fades back to normal 6 to 8 i'm gonna flip out. That's what happened a month ago.
The second pic you can see a tiny bit of the crud on seam and a small glob next to it. Haven't seen any more of it accumulating since Tuesday morning

 

[reggiehammond]

Most people who successfully SLAM will hold SLAM levels for an additional day or two, just for insurance.
I'd consider doing an OCLT again each night, just to confirm.

The photos you shared seem to show dead algae - so I'd still be a bit worried.