Why Salt

[genlee]

Our "pool guy" is planting seeds to convert our salt pool back to chlorine. Some of his reasons are: salt is corrosive, salt requires more expensive equipment, etc.
What are your thoughts?

 

[mknauss]

SWG How It Works - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

You will find nearly everyone on this forum with a SWCG would not have a pool without a SWCG. Pool maintenance people tend to not like them because you essentially do not need them with one. Unless you are not at your pool for very extended periods. You still must test the pool water chemistry often and maintain proper pH and FC.

The salinity in a SWCG pool is not corrosive. Low pH is corrosive. The SWCG itself is like buying the chlorine all at once. Overall the cost is essentially the same, especially if you factor in the cost of getting liquid chlorine, storing it, and adding it EVERY DAY. Trichlor pucks are not sustainable unless you are willing to drain and replace with fresh water your pool volume quite often.

 

[Newdude]

Have him come spew his nonesense here but make sure to put your flame suit on first, cuz it’s gonna get HOT.

 

[JamesW]

Our "pool guy" is planting seeds to convert our salt pool back to chlorine.

A salt pool is a chlorine pool. Maybe time to consider converting the pool guy into an ex-pool guy.

How much confidence do you have in this person?

 

[Newdude]

I’m sorry. While funny, and only a joke, my comment was not very TFP of me. *nicely invite* him to come learn with the rest of us.

 

[ajw22]

More on salt...

Salt - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

What form of chlorine does your "Pool Guy" propose to use? Liquid chlorine? TriChlor tablets that will continuously add CYA and require periodic draining to keep CYA levels under control?

Note that if liquid chlorine is used for every 3 ppm of chlorine you will be adding 5 ppm of salt. Such pools become "salt pools" over time if water is not drained.

 

[mguzzy]

I like how you put "pool guy" in quotes.. ... what does planting seeds mean, I mean? Cause if you go to using some other form of Cl instead of an SWG there are no seeds to plant. You just turn off the switch on the SWG and start dumping in Chlorine in whatever form you are going to use. My SWG pool becomes a non SWG pool every winter because the water gets too cold to generate Chl.. but its a Chlorine pool all the time, I just get CL from a different source.

So what is the real question.. is it: Should I fire my "Pool Guy"?

 

[Dirk]

Our "pool guy" is planting seeds to convert our salt pool back to chlorine. Some of his reasons are: salt is corrosive, salt requires more expensive equipment, etc.
What are your thoughts?

Hi, and welcome to TFP!

Oh, you are soooo much better off than I was when I bought my "new to me house with first time pool." Because you already have an SWG, and you've already found TFP! Did you inherit the pool guy with the house (was he the previous owner's pool guy)? That's what I did. Short version: my guy didn't know what he was doing, had been ruining the pool way before I bought it, and ended up completely destroying it. I'm not suggesting that is your situation, but what I am saying is that when I finally took the plunge, I found TFP and fired the guy. That was the best thing I ever did for my pool!

It was all a mystery to me at first, but after reading through Pool School, and asking for help, here at TFP, I quickly became my own "pool guy." Right away my water was cleaner, it looked and felt better, and I now know it won't cause the damage to my plaster that was occurring before I took over. It turns out, by using the methods taught here at TFP, taking care of a pool is waaaay easier than I thought it would be. Crazy simple. And I'm saving myself at least $1500 a year!!

Stick around, do some reading in Pool School, and before you know it, you'll be your own pool expert! Even if you want to keep a pool guy to do "the dirty work," you'll still be better off making your own decisions about your pool care, and keeping an eye on what the pool guy is doing.

 

[YippeeSkippy]

Does this pool guy have some sort of business in the sale of chlorine tablets or chemicals? Perhaps he wants you to need to buy a lot more chemicals than we ever would suggest.

My salt pool costs no more than $150 per YEAR for all the testing reagents and chemicals we need. Because I have a salt water chlorine generator ("SWG" in TFP lingo) I can go on vacations to Europe yearly and still come home to a pristine clear, clean pool. I've never once had algae in 9 years of ownership. I'd say that speaks for itself, huh?

As for equipment, we bought the SWG once, and the cell lasted 8 years. We bought a generic replacement cell for about $300 and its working well so far. Pro-rate that expense over the years of service and it really isn't very expensive at all. How much is your convenience worth to you on top of that??

Tell us more about your pool now. Like, how is it chlorinated? How and Who does the testing? Any problems??

Maddie

 

[genlee]

THANK Y'ALL for the convincing facts. My goal is to learn the basics and as suggested become my own pool guy.
Again I appreciate the responses. You will hear from me again.

 

[carnivalday]

I just put in a pool, and it never occurred to me NOT to put in a SWG. I think having to lug chlorine gallons over and over and over would take some of the fun out of said pool. Pool builder said with salt Id have to lug bags of salt. Well, after reading here, I realized I might have to lug a bag or two of salt a year, as opposed to gallons and gallons and gallons of bleach monthly.

 

[Dirk]

Oh what tangled webs they weave...

 

[wireform]

I've converted quite a few pools in the last few seasons. When I recommend the SWCG I get the same speech and only from the misinformed which is most everyone that doesn't have it yet. I just send them one reference from a previous conversion and they're sold solid. As it has been said many times here that pool builders and pool stores don't recommend them for many selfish reasons which are mostly false. If you equate the cost over the lifetime of the cell it will be close to what chlorine would cost you for the same duration with one major difference, same pool with a better water feel and much easier care once you get the hang of it, more time to enjoy the back yard and less time here on the forum getting advice of why the water went green. There are members on this forum that haven't seen a green pool in years since going over to SWCG.

 

[Newdude]

Some people dont like the feel of a salt pool, you can't please all of the people all of the time. For everybody else i think @Jimrahbe said it best a while ago (paraphrasing) when i get out of a chlorine pool i feel like i need a shower, when i get out of a salt pool i feel like i took a shower.

And as a person with 2 girls and a Mrs with thick hair, they still get knots and tangles, but it is far less. Their hair was like razor wire when we went to the neighbors chlorine pool all the time prior. We even had to have special shampoo designed for 'pool hair'.

 

[Dirk]

Just want to point out... the terms TFP uses are: "SWCG Pool" and "Non-SWCG Pool" not "chlorine pool" and "salt pool." See here. And that's because an SWCG Pool is a chlorine pool. The difference is whether the SWCG adds the chlorine, or you do.

What might be the reason folks are liking the feel of their SWCG Pools better is: you can generally cut back on the amount of chlorine in the water.

There's a few reasons for that. Here's two:
(1)
From that link above:

Most saltwater chlorine generator (SWCG) pools appear to remain algae-free at a lower minimum FC level compared with the minimum FC column for manually dosed pools. This may be due to the high chlorine level within the cell.

(2)
An SWCG dispenses chlorine about every hour, for most of the day, every day. The FC level is virtually constant, and only at the level you need to maintain your water. When manually dosing, to cut down on the lugging, most folks tend to pour in a bunch of chlorine, goosing the FC level higher than is needed, to extend the days between dosing. So the chlorine level is high for a day or two, then about right for a while, then low just before it's time for another dose. Or worse, to make sure their FC level isn't too low at the end of the cycle, folks will goose the FC even higher at the beginning of the cycle, which means for a lot of the days, the chlorine level is much higher than it needs to be. And that generally equates to that yucky "chlorine feel" that folks want to shower off.

I was uncomfortable after swimming for the few days following the pool guys visit. I know he was adding both a lot of chlorine and a lot of acid, so the pool would be "OK" until his next visit. But I would still get patches of algae on the walls. So not only was I not liking the water, but it wasn't all that safe towards the end of the week. Since adding an SWG and following TFP practices, I no longer get that skin irritation, and I haven't seen a spec of algae, ever.

Not to get too deep on ya... I liked the idea of this even-steven FC level all day every day so much, I added a second gizmo that dispenses my muriatic acid in much the same way (skin irritation is more often incorrect pH than FC). So that also contributes to the comfort of my water, because I no longer pour in a bunch of acid on Monday to get through the week, it gets metered out in very small amounts using the same schedule my SWG uses, so both my FC and pH are very stable/constant 24/7. But more on that when you're ready. First things first...

 

[YippeeSkippy]

And as a person with 2 girls and a Mrs with thick hair, they still get knots and tangles, but it is far less. Their hair was like razor wire when we went to the neighbors chlorine pool all the time prior. We even had to have special shampoo designed for 'pool hair'.

That's how I feel also. When swimming in the past, in public pools, my hair would be limp and *had* to get washed after swimming. Nothing of the sort happens with my SWG. My hair feels soft actually and I often don't bother to worrying about shampooing after swimming. I can't explain what makes it so different but its a pleasure.

 

[genlee]

Just want to point out... the terms TFP uses are: "SWCG Pool" and "Non-SWCG Pool" not "chlorine pool" and "salt pool." See here. And that's because an SWCG Pool is a chlorine pool. The difference is whether the SWCG adds the chlorine, or you do.

What might be the reason folks are liking the feel of their SWCG Pools better is: you can generally cut back on the amount of chlorine in the water.

There's a few reasons for that. Here's two:
(1)
From that link above:

(2)
An SWCG dispenses chlorine about every hour, for most of the day, every day. The FC level is virtually constant, and only at the level you need to maintain your water. When manually dosing, to cut down on the lugging, most folks tend to pour in a bunch of chlorine, goosing the FC level higher than is needed, to extend the days between dosing. So the chlorine level is high for a day or two, then about right for a while, then low just before it's time for another dose. Or worse, to make sure their FC level isn't too low at the end of the cycle, folks will goose the FC even higher at the beginning of the cycle, which means for a lot of the days, the chlorine level is much higher than it needs to be. And that generally equates to that yucky "chlorine feel" that folks want to shower off.

I was uncomfortable after swimming for the few days following the pool guys visit. I know he was adding both a lot of chlorine and a lot of acid, so the pool would be "OK" until his next visit. But I would still get patches of algae on the walls. So not only was I not liking the water, but it wasn't all that safe towards the end of the week. Since adding an SWG and following TFP practices, I no longer get that skin irritation, and I haven't seen a spec of algae, ever.

Not to get too deep on ya... I liked the idea of this even-steven FC level all day every day so much, I added a second gizmo that dispenses my muriatic acid in much the same way (skin irritation is more often incorrect pH than FC). So that also contributes to the comfort of my water, because I no longer pour in a bunch of acid on Monday to get through the week, it gets metered out in very small amounts using the same schedule my SWG uses, so both my FC and pH are very stable/constant 24/7. But more on that when you're ready. First things first...

Thank you Dirk. I will try to use the TFP lingo in the future. Also I appreciate the additional information.

 

[mguzzy]

@Newdude and @YippeeSkippy ... Yeah I concur. My daughter has very sensitive skin, eczema, special creams etc. the whole thing. She got a job at the local pool teaching swimming lessons but had to quit because the water was to hard on her skin. She has no issues with swimming in our SWG pool since we converted. And the cadre of neighborhood kids that rotate from one pool to another for swim overs, say our pool is the best one, least irritating, best feeling, of all the pools in the area. We are the only one with an SWG. I'll admit there is not much science in the survey, but I'll take it!

@genlee if you read around the SWG related threads you find explanations for why SWG pools have a slightly different chemistry to create that effect. the thing that sold me on an SWG generator was the amount of time I saved managing my pool. I wasn't expecting that the constant creation of CL would make all the other pool chemistry more stable and easier to manage. If I calculate the amount of time I saved into that equation, I paid for the SWG in the first year. (I bill hourly so I know!)

 

[PoolGate]

@Newdude and @YippeeSkippy ... Yeah I concur. My daughter has very sensitive skin, eczema, special creams etc. the whole thing. She got a job at the local pool teaching swimming lessons but had to quit because the water was to hard on her skin. She has no issues with swimming in our SWG pool since we converted. And the cadre of neighborhood kids that rotate from one pool to another for swim overs, say our pool is the best one, least irritating, best feeling, of all the pools in the area. We are the only one with an SWG. I'll admit there is not much science in the survey, but I'll take it!

@genlee if you read around the SWG related threads you find explanations for why SWG pools have a slightly different chemistry to create that effect. the thing that sold me on an SWG generator was the amount of time I saved managing my pool. I wasn't expecting that the constant creation of CL would make all the other pool chemistry more stable and easier to manage. If I calculate the amount of time I saved into that equation, I paid for the SWG in the first year. (I bill hourly so I know!)

Water feel is more a function of CYA. Improper amounts of CYA (too little) can make the water very harsh. Commercial pools have different regulations regarding CYA amounts and I have seen some where that amount is too low.

 

[bmoreswim]

People shower during swim season?