Water aeration question

Yaeugd

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2017
84
Long Island, NY
I been at it for 3 days. My Ta is high been reducing it with acid. But also need to bring my ph up. Pointed my jets up, turned on deck jets. Made a sprinkler Type of adapter for one of my jets. Been running my pool at high for for a few hours and at 2500 rpms for the rest of the time However the ph is moving gradually up. I have a 32k pool. Even tried to run my 8 gallon air compressor for about 2 houses a day and see a marginal increase in ph. Any advice. I don’t want to use soda ash because it also brings up the TA as well as why I need to bring it down.
I been thinking of trying to use the cyclone to cause Turbulence to help increase the ph Anyone try the cyclone or should I keep running everything as is until it goes up. The problem is I still have to bring down the TA. But if it takes this long to get the PH up am I doing something wrong.
 

Msch99

Gold Supporter
Bronze Supporter
Jun 11, 2018
908
Verona, MO
What is your TA? Many of us get wrapped up trying to get things perfect. Usually TA is fine just lowering with acid when PH rises.
Maybe post full set tests and let the experts take a look?
 

mknauss

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
Bronze Supporter
May 3, 2014
33,905
Laughlin, NV
What is your current test results? TA is the least important parameter of your pool water chemistry. Going to extraordinary lengths to reduce it are only if you have a high scaling potential or rapidly rising pH.
 

Yaeugd

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2017
84
Long Island, NY
Ta 160
Ph 7.3
I was getting spots of algae that kept coming back no matter how much I shocked it or added chlorine. Tried algaecide it didn’t resolve it. My phosphate were high 1409 when i opened it. Confirmed by the pool store. Used some phosfree resolved got it under 500. Now it’s much better able to keep more chlorine in the pool but just wanted to get the TA lower.
Just want to get the ph up more so i can get the TA under 120
Wonder about how the cyclone would do to increase the PH
 

Richard320

TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jan 6, 2010
23,932
San Dimas, CA (LA County)
Ta 160
Ph 7.3
I was getting spots of algae that kept coming back no matter how much I shocked it or added chlorine. Tried algaecide it didn’t resolve it. My phosphate were high 1409 when i opened it. Confirmed by the pool store. Used some phosfree resolved got it under 500. Now it’s much better able to keep more chlorine in the pool but just wanted to get the TA lower.
TA has nothing to do with algae. Or water clarity.

The test results that point to an algae problem are FC, CC, and CYA.
 
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Yaeugd

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2017
84
Long Island, NY
Fc 2
Cc 3
Cya 60
I understand that it doesn’t affect algae I just don’t want to loose chlorine too fast. Before I stated the process of lowering it I was loosing chlorine rapidly. My pool is crystal clear and just want to lower the TA more. I know it will eventually drop on it’s own but want to I’ll increase the ph more. To resolve the process
 

Yaeugd

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2017
84
Long Island, NY
I’m way past the slam process. My Pool’s been open for over a month. And mostly have had a clear pool. And now able to keep more chlorine in my pool since lowering the TA. Without talking about the slam process I just want to keep increasing my ph so I can drop the TA more with acid. Besides what I already tried can has anyone once increased there PH via aeration with a cyclone? Because I tried to do all of the above and it’s still increased marginally.
 

Richard320

TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jan 6, 2010
23,932
San Dimas, CA (LA County)
Fc 2
Cc 3
Cya 60
I understand that it doesn’t affect algae I just don’t want to loose chlorine too fast. Before I stated the process of lowering it I was loosing chlorine rapidly. My pool is crystal clear and just want to lower the TA more. I know it will eventually drop on it’s own but want to I’ll increase the ph more. To resolve the process
You're losing chlorine fast because you've got something organic (algae) in your water turning FC into CC. TA has nothing to do with FC losses. In a perfect world, you would have a minimum of 5 FC to go with your 60 CYA and zero CC. You have low FC therefore you developed algae. And as the algae grows it eats more and more FC. What you need to do is get enough chlorine in the pool to kill the algae faster than it can reproduce and keep it at that high level long enough to kill all the algae. We call it SLAM Process FWIW, the SLAM works best at a lower pH, about where you are right now.

If you prefer the movie to the book


I see your latest update. And I see I'm wasting time. No, I haven't used a cyclone. I have no idea what one is.
 

Yaeugd

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2017
84
Long Island, NY
There’s no point in getting upset or frustrated. I’m just asking about how to naturally increase my ph without soda ash and Or Borate. I understand the slam process and have used and use liquid chlorine when I don’t use tricolor. I am not loosing the chlorine as fast And do not currently have algae. My pool is crystal. since I started to drop the TA and dropped my phosphates down.
I totally understand the slam process. I don’t have a algae issue now but would like to keep it that way that’s why i started to started to reduce the TA and my PH Down lower. But would like to get the TA down More. My question is about aeration. Has anyone used the cyclone that we close our pools with to do the aeration process to cause enough surface Turbulence to increase PH because the other way is that I have written about or taking way too long. I’m on day 3 and only raised it Marginally.
 
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Yaeugd

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2017
84
Long Island, NY
The ozoneator is not in use it adds a Extra oxogen to the water to Help sterilize the pool thus lowering the need for chlorine. Honestly it was a waste of money because the cells fail yearly and don’t want to spend another 500 on it. Honestly feel but it would not help in this case because it’s pH neutral
 

Msch99

Gold Supporter
Bronze Supporter
Jun 11, 2018
908
Verona, MO
I don't know anything about the cyclone. Any aeration will raise the PH but usually not very fast, especially if you are impatient.

Their point is, I think, that you do have an algae issue. And you are concerned about a measurement that doesn't matter at this point.
Your CC is higher than your FC.
"mostly clear" pool in one statement.
FC of 2 with a CYA of 60, wide open for algae. Minimum for 60 is 5 FC, target is 8.

Good luck on your mission! :)
 
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Yaeugd

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2017
84
Long Island, NY
Thanks. the pool is fine now. I been keeping the chlorine at 2-3. Not 5 because of the health risks for the kids. Everything I read don’t go swimming over 3. I didn’t know how long to bring back the ph. This is the first time with the aeration process. I’m on day 3 and know that 7.3/7.4 is fine but want to bring it up higher to drop both down. That was the purpose of the post.
 

Paxcou

Well-known member
Feb 10, 2020
98
NJ (shore)
The problem as two of us explained you is that your CYA being 60 you cannot be below 5 FC.
So you should add more chlorine.
If you really want to have a lower concentration of chlorine, you need to lower your CYA by draining water and adding some at the same time (drain from the bottom and add from the too trying to move as minimum the water during the process). But again going for 5ppm of chlorine is the recommended action. After slamming as your combined chlorine is really high.

It seems like everyone with a bit of experience will tell you the same thing, forget about the TA focus.on the FC and CC.
 

Mdragger88

Bronze Supporter
Jun 1, 2018
1,475
Hernando, Ms
As to answer your aeration question- anything you do to cause turbulence in the water will raise your ph - it may take hours or days depending on your pool & methods. Most are able to point their jets up or add a water feature as you have done & accomplish this. It’s not a quick process. It definitely takes patience.

As for your fc level-
The recommendations of not going over 3ppm of free chlorine is based on old science that ignores the fc/cya relationship & assumes that all 3ppm are active.
That is why the FC/CYA Chart was developed as most people have some amount of cya in their pool hindering the amount of active chlorine thus rendering some of it ineffective against pathogens & lastly algae.
The recommendations given on TFP to adhere to the FC/CYA Chart are for your safety to mitigate health risks & keep your water sanitary. You cannot see viruses & bacteria in a clear pool but that doesn’t mean they aren’t there.
As many others have said alkalinity has no effect on chlorine loss.
Your elevated cc’s are concerning & indicative of organics in your water which can be eradicated by following the SLAM Process & then maintaining the appropriate fc level for your cya henceforth.
It seems you may have missed the point of what we’re about here & that’s helping people achieve safe, enjoyable pool ownership by sharing science based information.
Here’s some reading for you
 
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Yaeugd

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2017
84
Long Island, NY
Just to follow up, dumped out about a foot of water from the deep end, resolved the cya down to 30 and alkalinity issues down to 100, aerated my pool with a my sump pump 1.2 HP I use to drain water down when I close the pool with the hose about 10 inches above the water and running deck jets, took 4 days run running for 12 hours a day with the normal usage of the pool pump to get the PH up to 7.6. thanks for your help.
 
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