TWO Stenner Pumps pulling acid from ONE Tank

AJB1234

Gold Supporter
Dec 5, 2015
136
Newport Beach, CA
Hi TFP Experts,

Is it possible to combine two stenner pump feeder tubes to one tube ('Y' splitter)? I want to have two stenner pumps pull liquid from one pentair acid tank (there isnt two holes in the tank for a 2nd tube). Any ideas of how to make this work? Trying to avoid drilling another hole in the pentair tank but maybe that is the best solution.

Thanks,

AJ
 

ajw22

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TFP Guide
Jul 21, 2013
22,290
Northern NJ
Pool Size
35000
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
You should discuss this with @Dirk
 

Dirk

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Nov 12, 2017
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Can you describe what you're trying to do, and why you need two pumps to do it?

That asked, this seems doable. The IpH (IntellipH) injector has some sort of one way valve in it. A check valve of sorts that allows the fluid to flow into the pool's plumbing system, but blocks the pressurized water of the pool plumbing from flowing back up the IpH's injector and tube into the IpH's pump and tank. I believe that's called a duck-bill valve, or something like that. You'd want two of those at the "Y" you're suggesting, located so neither Stenner pump could draw from the other, only from the IpH tank. You might even be able to modify two of the IpH injectors for that purpose, or find a similarly-functioning one-way valve that can be affixed to the tubes you're going to use to connect the Y to each Stenner. This might work, though I can't quite see in the pic if you can connect both ends to 1/4" tubing. Or this might be better.

The other thing you might have to address is the volume. You'd have to figure out a few things. What is the volume one Stenner needs to pull, and then if the IpH's feeder tube and "exit" port can deliver that volume of fluid. If the Stenner uses 1/4" tubing, then you're probably good there. Then double that, to determine if the IpH's "exit" can deliver enough volume for two Stenner pumps drawing at the same time. If the IpH tank can't deliver enough volume as is, you could solve that in two ways: either schedule the two Stenners to never pump at the same time (if that works for your purpose), or replace the Iph's feeder tube and "exit" port with parts of a larger diameter. 3/8" tubing and fittings would be able to deliver more than twice that of 1/4". See here for why that is (though you'll need to do some proportional math to use the chart from that page).

Of course, I don't have any direct experience with any of that, probably no one does, but those are my thoughts on it...
 
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Bama Rambler

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Jun 22, 2009
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What you're wanting to do amounts to a suction side manifold. It's not a problem at all to do that. Unless you have two massively rated pumps the ¼" tubing will handle the flow fine. Just use compatible tubing and fittings for the acid and you'll be fine.

I'd probably use an all plastic quick connect (push in) tee or Y (2-way diverter).
 

Dirk

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Nov 12, 2017
8,456
Central California
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SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Well, you're starting to get a consensus on the tubing size, so that's good.

I'm not sure why Stenner is shying away from using a Y, unless they're thinking that you're thinking of using a barbed connector, then I would agree. Don't use one of those. You are increasing the number of connections, so that technically increases the risk of leaks/failures, but a typical acid injector system has several such connections. The mini-check-valves I suggested add four more connections. So there's that.

And while the plumbing world is moving more and more to shark-bite type push/quick connectors, I don't trust them myself because there is an o-ring involved, and I've had them pop off on me. I would use compression fittings throughout, because that's what the IntellipH system uses (and Stenner, too, I believe) and if tightened correctly they won't leak or pop off. The Pentair mini-check I suggested appears to have compression connectors as well.

Something like the following, although I would want to see some spec's on whatever fittings I use that speak to their resistance to whatever fluid you're pumping. Pentair uses the term "Corrosion Resistant." The Pentair mini-check I suggested is "Corrosion Resistant" but that part might be intended for chlorine, so I can't speak to how it will do with acid.


Respectfully, I don't agree with Dave's other comment either: "What you're wanting to do amounts to a suction side manifold." It's not that. A suction-side manifold uses one pump to draw liquid from multiple pipes. What you want to build is two pumps drawing from a single pipe, and that adds some complexity, namely the two pumps drawing from both the source and each other. Which is why I suggested the check valves in front of each pump. If the Stenner pumps you want to use are peristaltic, then I suppose they might supply the anti-backflow capability that the mini-check valves will. I'm not sure of that. I'd probably use those mini-checks either way, and as close to the tee as possible, especially if the distance between the tee and the pumps is more than a few inches.

Again, just spit-balling with you, as I don't think anyone here has actually tried this before. We're still waiting to hear what you're trying to do with this rig. If you're pumping into a pool, I'd be tempted to try this out with water first (NOT pool water), before connecting the injectors to a pool plumbing pipe and before adding the acid (or whatever fluid you're pumping), just to see how it will all work, specifically if the injectors' output is satisfactory for your purpose. That would also be a good way to measure and determine the flow rate: how much each injector outputs per minute of pump runtime: some numbers that might come in handy later on when computing your dosing.
 

Bama Rambler

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We've used multiple metering pumps on a single vessel for years in the industrial environment. It's very common for all types of chemicals.

Stenner only makes peristaltic pumps, and by nature of their design check valves aren't needed and just complicate the installation, while also adding more possible leak points.

Polypropylene is compatible with hydrochloric acid so if you want to use the Parker fittings you could. Just make sure that whatever fittings you use doesn't have nylon in them.
 
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Dirk

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Thanks Dave, I stand corrected on the check valves, as I wasn't sure how well a peristaltic pump could serve that purpose. Sounds like the OP has a way to go now. Still very curious about what he's trying to do...
 

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mguzzy

Gold Supporter
Jul 8, 2015
2,562
OV, CA
Maybe he wants a second Stenner pump as a failover... I can't imagine a 14K pool would require that much acid that fast.
 

AJB1234

Gold Supporter
Dec 5, 2015
136
Newport Beach, CA
Wow! Thanks everyone for all of your input, ideas and suggestions. I really appreciate it and truly value TFP. I am currently using a stenner pump and a pentair acid tank for a water fountain. I have a second fountain that I want to have acid automatically added but no space for a 2nd pentair tank. It sounds like the safest/easiest option might be to just drill a hole in the pentair acid tank and have two stenner pumps each with their own feeder tubes accessing the tank. Thoughts and thanks!
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
8,456
Central California
Pool Size
12300
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Funny you should mention that. I had the exact same thought. After I posted, I went out and stared at my tank for a while this afternoon. It's got the feeder tube on one side, and the air vent on the other side. If you can get a hold of another feeder tube assembly, maybe directly from Pentair, I bet it'll fit in the hole where the air vent is now. And then work exactly how you just suggested. But you still need that air vent. I think you could put that just about anywhere else in the top half of the tank, just drill the right-sized hole in a spot that has enough clearance behind it, and bolt the air vent in there. No Ys or Ts or extra connections, no backflow issues. Done.

The original "tee" idea would also work, but having two totally independent systems seems like the more reliable way to go. If one fails, it won't bring down the other.
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
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Nov 12, 2017
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Central California
Pool Size
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Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
I can get you close, but I can't seem to find the whole assembly. Part #521508 is the Suction Fitting (Black) but I don't think that comes with the tube that goes down to the bottom of that tank. There's also the filter at the bottom of that tube, and the threaded nuts that hold it to the tank and attach the exterior tube . There's probably some sort of washer or o-ring in there, too, that seals the Suction Fitting airtight to the tank.

Here's a place to start, and/or call Pentair support.


Here's part of what you need, but also missing the rest:


When I first installed my IpH, I found that they had crimped the lid's o-ring. I called Pentair, and they shipped me a new one pronto. Maybe they have the entire selection of parts you need, if you can figure out what to ask for.

Or take out your feeder assembly, take a picture of the whole thing, and send that to Pentair and ask for the whole thing.
 
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Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
8,456
Central California
Pool Size
12300
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
If you're going to extract the feeder assembly for a picture, and you're feeling adventurous, you could see if that assembly fits on the other side, in the air vent hole. Then you'll know before ordering anything that the idea is going to work...
 
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