TFP Newbie - Cannot get fc to register

[CincyDools]

Monday
Removed cover mesh safety cover
Water was reddish Brown entire entire bottom was black.
Vacuumed to waste as much as possible.
Added 4 CASES of Maintain Liquid shock FC did not register on AquaChek test strips

Tuesday Evening
Added 5 more Cases Liquid Shock
FC=CY=0 according/to test strips

Wednesday
Pool Store #1 said CY was okay. Assumed really bad algae problem
Suggested Yellow Algaecide Treatment with 4 bags of 65% powdered shock to be followed by liquid shock to raise FC. Added 5 more cases of liquid shock that did not raise FC

Found TFP site and started reading. Ordered TF-100 Test Kit online. Should arrive Monday.

Thursday
Water was cloudy with very little green so I let the pump run all day

Friday morning
A little improvement in water clarity
Got the following test results from Pool Store #2:
FC 0.1
TC 0.49
CC 0.39
pH 6.9
TH 56
TA 88
CY 4
Copper 0
Iron 0
Phosphates 393

They said the Phosphates are why I could not raise FC
Sold me Phosphate remover. Will run pump for 24 hours shut off for 12 hours then vacuum to waste.

I am now done with Pool Stores.

What should my next steps be? I am afraid that if I start adding Clorox, I will still have trouble raising FC. What do I need to do to get FC to Register?

 

[Texas Splash]

I am now done with Pool Stores.

That's the best thing to see on a post like this. Welcome to TFP! You've been through a lot, but now you'll be making progress. No worries. For now though, don't get carried away and don't try to resolve the problems until the TF-100 arrives. You do have a good-sized pool. No reason you couldn't add 1 gallon of regular bleach into the water each day until the kit arrives. It won't make big changes, but might slow down algae growth slightly. When your kit arrives, that's when we'll get really specific.

For now, simply read-up on the SLAM page (link below) and read/bookmark the other vital links below as well. You'll need them. Do not add anything else to your water other than regular bleach. It can be generic, so shop around for a good price. Just make sure it's regular/plain. None of that splashless/scented stuff. Have several gallons of bleach ready (at least 10 or so to start), some muriatic acid (store it away from everything else), and perhaps some granular stabilizer (Wal-Mart of big box stores). You can continue to brush/sweep and remove and debris in the pool for now.

Once your TF-100 arrives, post a full set of numbers. We'll go from there. Great to have you with us.

 

[CincyDools]

Thanks Tex!

Long story, but I had to rewrite this post and forgot o mention that I have my Hayward Chlorinator with Triclor tabs running. Should I turn it off or just leave it on for now. I will be out of town when my test kit arrives and will not be able to start slamming for about 7 days and I don't want things to turn back around during that time.

 

[Texas Splash]

Normally I would say remove the tabs now. They generally don't help with much at this point. Over time, tabs tend to complicate things. However you are leaving, so might as well let "some" FC continue to stay in the water. So if you can't start the process for another week or so, let's just put a place-marker here and start back up when you return. When you get back, post a full set of test results and ensure your signature is updated. We'll start fresh form there okay. Have a safe trip.

 

[CincyDools]

Thx, will report back next. Week. I do have my signature set up but for some reason it is not being appended to my responses. I also have the box checked to display it. I am responding from my iPad now and it looks like it will show up. The thread was created, and my other responses were from my Android tablet. Must be an OS problem. It would not let me create the signature from the Android Tablet.

 

[CincyDools]

Here are my numbers based on Taylor 2006 test kit:

FC 0.8
CC 0.8
CH 90
TA 60
CY 57
PH 7.1

This is my first time using the test kit but the numbers are somewhat in line with the numbers posted above from the pool store last week. Water is now just slightly cloudy with no green. There is currently just a little bit of light green patches on the liner.

- - - Updated - - -

Due to lots of rain while I was away, the water level is at the top of the skimmers so I thought my first action would be to vacuum to waste before adding any chemicals. Your thoughts?

 

[Texas Splash]

Look who's back! Okay Bryan, let's see what we can help you with now that you have a good test kit.

Water is now just slightly cloudy with no green.

I'm glad to hear that because based on your initial description I was a bit worried about metals (iron or copper). Hopefully that won't be an issue. So here's what you need to do to start clearing all the algae out .... follow the SLAM page info (link below). Focus on this for the chemicals:
- Get your water level where you want it so you don't waste chemicals. Vacuuming to waste is a great idea, especially if you have any debris at the bottom.
- Your pH is perfect for a SLAM already, so based on your CYA rounded up to 60, we know your SLAM FC level is "24". That's the number you want to hold as much as possible to do the SLAM. Focus mainly on the FC. No need to test anything else right now other than perhaps CC once in a while. Of course follow all the other info listed on the SLAM page and it should work for you.

Near the end of the SLAM, you may need to do a deep clean of the filter to fluff-up that sand and help with filter efficiency, but we'll come to that later if needed. Good luck!

 

[CincyDools]

My slam is complete with FC at 25 ppm and 0 overnight change and CC at 0.5.

My current numbers are:
FC 25.0
CC 0.5
TA 70
TH 110
PH 8.0
CYA 46

I need to buy a new thermometer but am guessing water temperature to be about 60-65 degrees.

So should I try to get TA up to about 100 and CH up to about 150 and let FC come down before adjusting PH?

 

[Texas Splash]

Congrats! I wouldn't worry about the TA right now. If your pH remains stable, it should be fine. With a vinyl pool there's no need to add calcium (CH), so you can ignore that as well. Now you can simply let the FC drop in its own to the regular daily range as noted on the Chlorine/CYA Chart. Once the FC drops below 10, confirm/adjust your pH and enjoy. Great job!

 

[CincyDools]

Awesome, thanks for your help Tex! I had not noticed the CH thing about not needing to add CH for vinyl lined pools. Sounds like I just need to monitor to make sure it doesn't get too high but not to raise it to a minimum level. That was a big take away from this conversation. Have a great holiday weekend!

 

[CincyDools]

Okay, I thought I was done with my slam as of Sunday morning. As reported above, FC held overnight at 25ppm. SUnday was partly sunny. I did not check FC Sunday night because I have almost depleted all the R-0871 out of my new Taylor Test kit during the slam. I have more on the way but probably won't be here until Wednesday.

Anyway, I was really surprised to see that FC was at 2.8 this morning - CC 0.2, TA 70, PH 7.0 CYA 47.
Water clarity is slightly cloudy but continuing to improve since the slam. I added 1.5 bottles of Chlorox to bring FC to 7.5. Two adults and 3 small children swam today. A 7:00 PM today FC was back down to zero so I added 3 bottles of Chlorox FC hoping to raise FC to 7.0 but it went up to 15. So am I getting false zero reads? Why is my FC dropping like a rock? This is the same problem I had before my slam, but at least then there was still a little bit of visible algae then but none now.

Please help! Getting really tired of dumping bleach in my pool only to see it evaporate!

Update Tuesday morning FC has dropped from 16 to 13.5 - CC is 0.5. Do I need to slam agai? ?

 

[cjpwalker]

I noticed you are reporting chlorine as "x.8"

Feel free to use the 10ml sample size, and a multiplier of 0.5. It is absolutely close enough for your swimming pool, and will save a ton of reagent. Also, you only need enough powder to turn the sample pink, not the 2 scoops per the taylor box lid instructions...

 

[mknauss]

I have a feeling your SLAM never passed the three criteria. You got the 0 CC and OCLT, but did you have crystal clear water? If not, go back to the SLAM.

Good Luck!

 

[CincyDools]

I noticed you are reporting chlorine as "x.8"

Feel free to use the 10ml sample size, and a multiplier of 0.5. It is absolutely close enough for your swimming pool, and will save a ton of reagent. Also, you only need enough powder to turn the sample pink, not the 2 scoops per the taylor box lid instructions...

I did use the 10ml sample size during slam but did the 25ml after I thought I was done just to get a more accurate read. Thanks for the advice about the 2 scoops though. One scoop usually gets it slightly pink but I was putting two in together it more it to a deeper pink. I don't need to do that? Any level of pink is sifficient?

 

[Texas Splash]

Generally the exact amount of powder is not important as long as you see the color change. When I use the 10 ML sample, my one scoop is simply what I would call "generous" or a bit rounded & hefty, and not a level/flat scoop. I seem to get good results that way.

 

[CincyDools]

I have a feeling your SLAM never passed the three criteria. You got the 0 CC and OCLT, but did you have crystal clear water? If not, go back to the SLAM.

Good Luck!

I did not know that water had to be crystal clear to pass OCLT. It is still slightly cloudy so It sounds like I need to slam some more. Problem is I am about to run out of reagent and will not be able to verify FC of 22 until tomorrow when more reagent should arrive. I will add more Chlorox per pool math and hope that I eat it to 22 for today.

thanks for your help!

 

[Texas Splash]

I did not know that water had to be crystal clear to pass OCLT.

Not to pass the OCLT. To pass the SLAM. Clear water is one of the 3 SLAM criteria. The OCLT is generally the very last thing done as clear water is usually the first indication we are getting close to passing.

 

[CincyDools]

Got it, thx Tex! Still SLAMMING although a little blindly until my R-0871 arrives hopefully tomorrow.

My water clarity is almost there - not crystal clear but really close. Just can't imagine what is in the water still that is causing my FC to drop like a rock during the day. I guess I overlooked the water clarity part of exiting the slam because I thought there were other things that could cause the little bit of cloudiness that I have.

 

[CincyDools]

Exited SLAM after 2 nights of zero FC drop, 0.2 CC, and Clear Water. Here are y latest Numbers:

CLARITY: Clear
TEMP.: 73°F


FC: 7.5 ppm
CC: 0.2
CYA: 60 ppm
PH: 7.5
TA: 50 ppm
TH: 40 ppm
SI: -1.2
Acid Demand: 0
Base Demand: 0

So it would appear that I a pretty well set. But I am still losing 4-10 ppm of FC during sunny days with little or no swimming. Is that normal? It seems a little high to me.

The pool store tests show that I don't have any Phosphates or Nitrates. Although I have come to not trust their numbers now that I have a Taylor Test Kit. Their numbers for TA and CYA were off - they said I had zero on both.

So if those daytime FC losses are high, does anyone have suggestions for reducing that? I know that my CYA of 60 is on the highside of the suggested number but was wondering if I should raise it a little to reduce the daytime FC loss. The concern there would b that accordinng to the CYA Chart, the Target FC values would be above recomeneded swimming levels.

All comments are welome - thanks inadvance.


Update - In my original post, I obviously got references to FC and CC swapped.

Bryan

 

[mknauss]

In your past posts you show having a K2006C test kit. But now you are reporting pool store results and using pool store statements such as "Phosphates or Nitrates". Those do not matter. Also what do you mean by CC values above recommended swimming levels? FC can very safely be up to SLAM levels or 40% of CYA and safely swim.

Please use your test kit and quit going to the pool store. You will fall into a trap of believing their numbers and that can lead you to water chemistry mistakes.

Take care.