South Florida Pool & Outdoor Living - STARTUP PHASE

JoyfulNoise

TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
May 23, 2015
17,444
Tucson, AZ
Pool Size
16000
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
If all you have is one pump, then yes, the spa spillover is robbing a huge amount of water flow.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Jimrahbe

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 7, 2014
19,813
Bedford, TX
Re: South Florida Pool & Outdoor Living - STARTUP PHASE

Before:


After:
So, it appears to me that the valve that switches between the "Pool Return" and "Fountains (Bubblers)" is directing all the water to the bubblers.. but.. the valve before that is set to send about 70% of the water to your Spa Returns only leaving about 30% for your bubblers. And it also appear that there is another automated valve under the other two.. I can't see enough to know what that valve does.

Just for fun you can close off the Spa return and that should direct all the water to the bubblers. See how they look then.. (Although, I think they look fine the way they are...)

Jim R.
 

grumpiebk

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2016
901
FL
South Florida Pool & Outdoor Living - STARTUP PHASE

Doh! I thought you wanted to see how much the valves opened. Here is an older photo that shows the final plumbing setup:



As for the spa spillover, I will play with that and see. You are right, it looks fine for "show mode" but having some more height and water movement will be a blast for the little ones. I think of Twinkies' shelf and bubblers as a reference point. I know her kids love it!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Agd38

Well-known member
Mar 14, 2014
107
Tampa
Good idea. I wasn't thinking about covers but it makes sense.

What about metal framed furniture (i.e. Wrapped in resin wicker)? Will rust be a problem with the salt water if they remain on the deck?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Just make sure you have no metal feet touching the deck, they will rust and stain the travertine...
 

grumpiebk

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2016
901
FL
I've switched my testing to after the kids go to bed as I have been running short on time before work with brushing added to our morning routine. Here are tonight's results:

Ph: 7.8
TA: 90
CH: 225
FC: 7
CC: 0.5
CYA: 40

I think everything is heading in the right direction (?) and chlorine has dropped significantly from the extremely high startup level. Where should I expect to be about 72 hours from initial startup? I still need to do some reading about the CYA test and what that means. I am expecting our startup guy to come back early next week, so I'd like to be well prepared to share my results and what I (we) think should be adjusted.

I am still seeing a considerable amount of dust/dirt when I brush the pool (most notably on the floor) and there appears to be almost a white plastic like flaking coming up in the spa when I brush it. It doesn't look like plaster does it? Any ideas? I'll try to snap a clear pic of the dust/dirt when I brush tomorrow.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

JoyfulNoise

TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
May 23, 2015
17,444
Tucson, AZ
Pool Size
16000
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
You should only do the CYA test in bright, indirect sunlight at noon. The brighter the day, the better. Indoor lighting is not good enough and low lighting will cause a false reading. Redo the test tomorrow...it'll be a good excuse to tell the boss that you need to go home for lunch -

[BRIAN] - "Gee boss, I just spent gobs and gobs of money on this awesome new pool and outdoor living space and I totally need to get home and do some pool water testing. I'm going to knock off early today and head home. Sounds good to you?"

[BRIAN'S BOSS] - "Why yes, Brain, it does! That is very conscientious of you and shows that you care about getting details right. I find your dedication to your home to be an inspiration to all of the other employees. Looks like someone is trying to get promoted for the boss's job, eh...hehehe! Have a great weekend!!"

[BRIAN] - "Thanks boss! See ya Monday."

[BRIAN'S BOSS] - "Don't forget to crack open a cold one when you're sitting out on the porch tonight!!"

AM I right?? Totally how I see that going for you....
 

grumpiebk

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2016
901
FL
Or: [BRIAN'S BOSS] - "haven't you taken enough time off for this swimming pool??? Can't you just pay someone to take care of it???"


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

grumpiebk

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2016
901
FL
Thanks, Matt. I'll retest this weekend. Thinking about the test, inevitably won't the CYA reading be lower in outdoor sunlight than indoor lighting at night? That would only be a more favorable reading, no?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

JoyfulNoise

TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
May 23, 2015
17,444
Tucson, AZ
Pool Size
16000
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Thanks, Matt. I'll retest this weekend. Thinking about the test, inevitably won't the CYA reading be lower in outdoor sunlight than indoor lighting at night? That would only be a more favorable reading, no?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It's counterintuitive but no, lower light will give a false low reading to a certain extent. Bright light leads to more off-axis light scattering which occluds the black disc more.

I typically keep my CYA at 80-90ppm in the summer. If I take the test sample and read it out in bright sunlight, I get 80ppm. If I take that same sample and walk under my side door awning to shade myself, the test will read 60ppm or lower.

Bright, indirect light. Put your back to the sun, hold the sample tube waist high so that your fingers are not in anyway blocking the sidewalls and look at the tube with both eyes open. Do not strain to see the dot. Fill the tube in 10ppm increments and look at the dot. The act of looking away with each fill of 10ppm will let your pupils and eye rest enough to not over-focus on the dot.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

grumpiebk

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2016
901
FL
South Florida Pool & Outdoor Living - STARTUP PHASE

Ok will try that approach and see what I get.

Here is the dust kicking up during brushing. It's more white than beige/brown, so I'm guessing it's plaster dust. It is mostly on the floor, very little on the walls.



I have some el cheapo vacuum included in our "supplies kit" that I will check out. If it is a brush style I may take a stab at getting as much dust up as possible. As I understand from other threads, this is ok so long as the vacuum doesn't have wheels that could damage the plaster?

Also, for the filter I recall seeing something about it needing to be cleaned once a 25% increase in pressure has been reached. Our initial pressure reading was 11psi. A 25% increase is just under 14psi. The dial marker on our gauge suggests to clean it at 25psi. Which is the more appropriate level to trigger cleaning? For reference, I have the Pentair CC420.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Jimrahbe

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 7, 2014
19,813
Bedford, TX
Brian,

We have similar sized pools and filters. I clean my filter only twice a year. Because I run my pump at about 1,200 RPM most of the time my filter pressure is only about 2 or 3 PSI.

Once you get all the initial debris and dust out of your pool I don't think it will be necessary for you to rigidly adhere to the 25% rule.

I would suggest, that no matter what the pressure, after you are done with this initial clean up, that you disassemble and clean the filter cartridges.

Thanks,

Jim R.
 

Rokihunter

Bronze Supporter
May 20, 2016
73
North Augusta, SC
I was looking at your equipment pad and notice that your signature says you have the cc420 filter, I thought that filter has a bigger diameter then the one you have, yours looks more like a 200. Or is there a difference between the clean and clear and the clean and clear plus?
 

grumpiebk

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2016
901
FL
I was looking at your equipment pad and notice that your signature says you have the cc420 filter, I thought that filter has a bigger diameter then the one you have, yours looks more like a 200. Or is there a difference between the clean and clear and the clean and clear plus?
Great question and eye! That pic of the pad was when they installed the wrong filter! They replaced it the next day with the 420 after I caught their error. You can see the post swap pics a few pages back in this thread.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

grumpiebk

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2016
901
FL
South Florida Pool & Outdoor Living - STARTUP PHASE

The kiddos had us up at 545 this morning. They must be excited for their party today.

I tested early and here's the results:

FC: 0.5
CC: 0.5
PH: 8.2
TA: 80
CH: 250
CYA: 40

Comparing to the last couple of days, PH has risen from 7.8, chlorine has dropped considerably, and CH has steadily risen. From what I've read, it is common for PH to increase and be at high levels for new plaster pools, but I've also been told that PH under 7.6 is ideal for the first 30 days of plaster. Also, we've been running the spa spillover 24/7 with the pump, so aeration is probably keeping it high. Should I turn it off? I'm guessing it was set that way to clear out all of the plaster dust. Is our level high enough to reach out to our startup guy or should I give it another day? I think he is scheduled to come back Monday.

Also, is it normal for FC to drop so significantly in 3-4 days (from 44 to 0.5)?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

txnole

LifeTime Supporter
Aug 18, 2014
544
Amelia Island, FL
Re: South Florida Pool & Outdoor Living - STARTUP PHASE

Pool looks awesome. On the tests, use acid today (early) to drop ph to 7.4. This will offset aeration for a few days (this will be a weekly battle with your spillover & bubblers, but well worth it). Increase CYA to 70-80 now and try to hold it there for life. I would increase with bleach slightly this AM for your party. Levels should be right in line within an hour or so.

- - - Updated - - -

One more thing for the bubblers, have your guy come out with you and tweak settings. I rather suspect it is going to be a combination of valve flow and pump speed changes to get exactly what you want. I would suggest you set two settings in your easy touch for your preferred bubblers: (1) old faithful geyser and (2) gentle kids playing.