Shared Equipment Plumbing Question

MARV19

Member
Aug 25, 2018
24
Wesley Chapel/ FL
Greetings All:
My pool dig is around the corner. I want to educate myself on hydraulics as much as I can. On this journey, I created a 2D plumbing schematic for my pool. Please refer the attached PDF document. Here are some details:
Integrated infinity SPA (360 deg. spill over) 12" raised from pool (will sit on next to shallow end sun shelf) of 8' X 8'
6 therapy jets
Dedicated Main drain
2 Floor Returns
QUESTIONS:
When I'm in pool mode, I assume water is delivered to SPA for spill over. How do I do the plumbing for this ?.
At present I connected the 2 SPA floor returns to the 2 Pool floor returns. Is this correct?.
Is my Check Valve placement on IC60SWCG is right?.
Am I missing anything else?
Did I make any mistake in the plumbing connections?
Rain Fall Water Feature:
I've a dedicated pump for this feature with appropriate suction line.
However, when I'm in SPA mode I want to run all the 5 LED Bubblers to come on. So, I made a plumbing connection to this pump. My question is do I need to have one more Main drain at the pool or the 2 side suction is sufficient enough for Rain fall water feature as well as 5 bubbler actions?.
Equipment: ALL PENT AIR EQUIPMENT
Both Pumps: Intelliflow XF/VSF
Filter : DE 60
IC60 SWCG
400K BTU NG Heater
Automation:
INTELLI CENTER I10PS PERSANOLITY KIT with Load Center
Your feed back, suggestions are much appreciated.
 

Attachments

  • Pool_Spa_04232021.pdf
    435.8 KB · Views: 23

HermanTX

Gold Supporter
May 20, 2020
1,942
Katy TX
Pool Size
14600
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Liquid Chlorine
When I'm in pool mode, I assume water is delivered to SPA for spill over. How do I do the plumbing for this ?.
When in Pool Mode, you want to set up a spillover bypass. This allows you to either push water to the spa or turn it off and only circulate back to the pool return. There are many threads on this in the forum - here is one link that has a graphic

At present I connected the 2 SPA floor returns to the 2 Pool floor returns.
Not sure this is best to do but if you put a valve that you can selectively turn on or turn off each then that provides you necessary control. Your normal circulation would be to the wall returns in Pool Mode and you can selectively also return to the pool floor returns as well.

Suggest you use unions on the inlet and outlet to the pumps. Also put unions on the SWCG.
I see you only have 1 skimmer which is doable but you should seriously consider a second skimmer - it would be located on the opposite side on the right end.
However, when I'm in SPA mode I want to run all the 5 LED Bubblers to come on. So, I made a plumbing connection to this pump. My question is do I need to have one more Main drain at the pool or the 2 side suction is sufficient enough for Rain fall water feature as well as 5 bubbler actions?.
You may need to have your water features on a separate pump if you want your water feature and pool bubblers to be on when in Spa Mode. When in Spa Mode you normally want suction from the spa and return to the spa. This way you can heat up your spa quickly and keep it heated. If you want to see your other water features that flow back to the pool then you need a separate pump with suction from the pool to operate those features.
 

ajw22

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jul 21, 2013
26,309
Northern NJ
Pool Size
35000
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
You should have two skimmers. With one skimmer if you have a problem without your pool is shutdown. With 2 skimmers you can take one skimmer out of service and still use the pool.

Your SPA-Check Valve should be on the SPA-R line after the 3 way.

You don't need a check valve between the heater and the SWG. The SWG does not create any acidic water that requires the heater be protected with a CV.

You don't want to run your spillover all the time you are in POOL mode. The aeration from the spillover will cause your pool pH to rapidly rise.

Your IntelliCenter has a SPILLOVER mode and you schedule to run the spillover two or three times a day for 15-30 minutes to refresh the spa water.

The SPA returns and the POOL returns should operate independently based on the mode the POOL/SPA is in.

I prefer having a separate pump for the spa jets.
 

MARV19

Member
Aug 25, 2018
24
Wesley Chapel/ FL
When in Pool Mode, you want to set up a spillover bypass. This allows you to either push water to the spa or turn it off and only circulate back to the pool return. There are many threads on this in the forum - here is one link that has a graphic


Not sure this is best to do but if you put a valve that you can selectively turn on or turn off each then that provides you necessary control. Your normal circulation would be to the wall returns in Pool Mode and you can selectively also return to the pool floor returns as well.

Suggest you use unions on the inlet and outlet to the pumps. Also put unions on the SWCG.
I see you only have 1 skimmer which is doable but you should seriously consider a second skimmer - it would be located on the opposite side on the right end.

You may need to have your water features on a separate pump if you want your water feature and pool bubblers to be on when in Spa Mode. When in Spa Mode you normally want suction from the spa and return to the spa. This way you can heat up your spa quickly and keep it heated. If you want to see your other water features that flow back to the pool then you need a separate pump with suction from the pool to operate those features.
Hi
Thank you for your time to reply to my questions, appreciate that. I hope I've better understanding of SPA spill over when Pool mode now. As suggested by other member, I moved the check valve to POOL return side immediately after 3way MAV . Now, all I need to make sure is that the plumbing for the check valve is to the SPA side wall. Am I correct on this understanding?. If you agree with me, do I need plumbing line on all 4 wall sides, because this is 360 deg infinity SPA?.
Thanks for your advise on using Unions wherever applicable.
Regarding 2nd skimmer, I'll have one story pool cage and there are not big trees or debris that would concern me. But, will think about it.
 

MARV19

Member
Aug 25, 2018
24
Wesley Chapel/ FL
You should have two skimmers. With one skimmer if you have a problem without your pool is shutdown. With 2 skimmers you can take one skimmer out of service and still use the pool.

Your SPA-Check Valve should be on the SPA-R line after the 3 way.

You don't need a check valve between the heater and the SWG. The SWG does not create any acidic water that requires the heater be protected with a CV.

You don't want to run your spillover all the time you are in POOL mode. The aeration from the spillover will cause your pool pH to rapidly rise.

Your IntelliCenter has a SPILLOVER mode and you schedule to run the spillover two or three times a day for 15-30 minutes to refresh the spa water.

The SPA returns and the POOL returns should operate independently based on the mode the POOL/SPA is in.

I prefer having a separate pump for the spa jets.
Appreciate your time to respond to my post, Thank you!.
You should have two skimmers. With one skimmer if you have a problem without your pool is shutdown. With 2 skimmers you can take one skimmer out of service and still use the pool.
I'll have one story screen enclosure with 20/20 mesh. Also, my pool will face against a pond. But, will think about 2nd skimmer.
Your SPA-Check Valve should be on the SPA-R line after the 3 way.
I'm little confused on this one. Please educate me. If I put the Check Valve on SPA return side, how this will get water in pool mode?. I thought that entire SPA return side will be off. I thought I should put the check valve on pool return side, but the valve should get plumbing from SPA side. Am I wrong on this?. Am I misunderstanding this concept. I'll have 360 degree spill over or infinity spa. Does this mean I should have 4 (all FOUR sides of the wall) line connected to the check valve?.
You don't need a check valve between the heater and the SWG. The SWG does not create any acidic water that requires the heater be protected with a CV.
Thank you, got it.
I prefer having a separate pump for the spa jets.
I've a separate pump for rain fall water feature. But, I assume you are suggesting to have ONE more dedicated pump for SPA jets. How do I connect this pump to SPA JETS. What do I need interims of Plumbing?. Do I need a VS pump or one speed or two speed pump is sufficient. I would appreciate your reply.
 

HermanTX

Gold Supporter
May 20, 2020
1,942
Katy TX
Pool Size
14600
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Liquid Chlorine
Now, all I need to make sure is that the plumbing for the check valve is to the SPA side wall. Am I correct on this understanding?. If you agree with me, do I need plumbing line on all 4 wall sides, because this is 360 deg infinity SPA?.
Several points need clarifying. Thanks for clarifying that you have a screen enclosure as that does help keep debris out of the pool. If you feel can get by with only 1 skimmer than that is fine and may work for your set up. Just ensure you skimmer basket is kept clean and the skimmer door (called the weir) is kept functional.

You have 2 return systems going to the spa - one is the standard pipes which are floor returns and the other are the therapy jets. The purpose of the dedicated pump for the therapy jets is to maximize the efficiency of those jets. It is your choice.
The position of therapy jets is not as important as ensuring the spa is LEVEL to create the 360 degree spillover. If it is not level then it really doesn't really matter from what direction the water is coming from.

Also remember, if in SPA mode, and you want to run the bubblers then they must be connected to the dedicated pump for your water feature as well. You will want to have a valve between those 2 systems such that you can run only the water feature or only run the bubblers or run both simultaneously. If you wish to only run some of the bubblers then you also need more pipes to hook those up independently. You will need 2" or larger suction pipe coming from the pool to feed all of those water features. Look at the requirements of the waterfall feature first to ensure you have sufficient volume requirements. Your PB should be able to help you with this.
 

ajw22

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jul 21, 2013
26,309
Northern NJ
Pool Size
35000
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Your SPA-Check Valve should be on the SPA-R line after the 3 way.
I'm little confused on this one. Please educate me. If I put the Check Valve on SPA return side, how this will get water in pool mode?. I thought that entire SPA return side will be off. I thought I should put the check valve on pool return side, but the valve should get plumbing from SPA side. Am I wrong on this?. Am I misunderstanding this concept. I'll have 360 degree spill over or infinity spa. Does this mean I should have 4 (all FOUR sides of the wall) line connected to the check valve?.

The spa check valve on the return is there to prevent water from backflowing from the spa to the pool when the pump is off. That only happens if the return valve is partially open to the spa when in POOL mode, or when there is a spa makeup line to feed the spa and spillover when in POOL mode.

If the return valve is totally closed to the spa when in POOL mode and you use SPILLOVER mode to refresh the spa water, then the check valve is not necessary.

Either way the check valve goes on the spa side of the POOL/SPA return valve.

I do not understand why you have lines that connect between your SPA-FR lines and your P-FR lines. They should operate independently.

I prefer having a separate pump for the spa jets.
I've a separate pump for rain fall water feature. But, I assume you are suggesting to have ONE more dedicated pump for SPA jets. How do I connect this pump to SPA JETS. What do I need interims of Plumbing?. Do I need a VS pump or one speed or two speed pump is sufficient. I would appreciate your reply.
I have two returns in the spa for water from the shared filter/heater and spillover.

I then have a dedicated spa jet pump that takes in water from the spa and feeds it out the 8 jets. No filter or heater on that water loop,

Basically there are two independent water loops in the spa.

Below shows the setup of my spa.

full
 

MARV19

Member
Aug 25, 2018
24
Wesley Chapel/ FL
The spa check valve on the return is there to prevent water from backflowing from the spa to the pool when the pump is off. That only happens if the return valve is partially open to the spa when in POOL mode, or when there is a spa makeup line to feed the spa and spillover when in POOL mode.

If the return valve is totally closed to the spa when in POOL mode and you use SPILLOVER mode to refresh the spa water, then the check valve is not necessary.

Either way the check valve goes on the spa side of the POOL/SPA return valve.

I do not understand why you have lines that connect between your SPA-FR lines and your P-FR lines. They should operate independently.


I have two returns in the spa for water from the shared filter/heater and spillover.

I then have a dedicated spa jet pump that takes in water from the spa and feeds it out the 8 jets. No filter or heater on that water loop,

Basically there are two independent water loops in the spa.

Below shows the setup of my spa.

full
Greetings!.
Thanks for educating me and sharing your beautiful SPA picture. I hope, more or less I understood the spill over concept. Here it is, please correct me, if I'm wrong:
PENTAIR INTELLICENTER AUTOMATION has "Spill Over" mode apart from more familiar "Pool & Spa" mode, am I right?. If true, In such a scenario, in pool mode small amount of water is delivered either to floor or to wall return, depending upon what type of return one has. In this case, I don't need check valve, right?.
Note: I hope this is a great feature for people like me, who has very limited knowledge on how mechanical aspects of pool works.
I do not understand why you have lines that connect between your SPA-FR lines and your P-FR lines. They should operate independently.
You are right. It was my poor understanding and hence made that mistake. I removed the joint connection now. They will run independently.
I have two returns in the spa for water from the shared filter/heater and spillover.
Do the spill over occurs on both wall returns?.
I see that you have TWO suctions per pump. I assume, the second one is for backup, if one goes bad, am I right?. If my understanding is correct, each pump need it's own suction line ( at least one/pump). My pool builder is offering me "Eclipse" main drain by Blue Square. I'll definitely ask him TWO for pool side. One for pool & spa pump, the other one for water feature pump. For spa currently he is offering one Eclipse main drain. But, I want to future proof it for dedicated spa pump. Do I need to ask him to provide one more Eclipse for spa.
I then have a dedicated spa jet pump that takes in water from the spa and feeds it out the 8 jets. No filter or heater on that water loop,
Do u get heated and filtered water through the spa jets?. If my understanding is correct, you will run your pool& Spa pump in Spa mode just to filter and heat the spa water. At the same time you run your dedicated spa jet pump to take this water through the separate suction lines and return only to spa jets. Am I correct?.
I would appreciate your reply, once gain thanks for your time.
 

MARV19

Member
Aug 25, 2018
24
Wesley Chapel/ FL
Several points need clarifying. Thanks for clarifying that you have a screen enclosure as that does help keep debris out of the pool. If you feel can get by with only 1 skimmer than that is fine and may work for your set up. Just ensure you skimmer basket is kept clean and the skimmer door (called the weir) is kept functional.

You have 2 return systems going to the spa - one is the standard pipes which are floor returns and the other are the therapy jets. The purpose of the dedicated pump for the therapy jets is to maximize the efficiency of those jets. It is your choice.
The position of therapy jets is not as important as ensuring the spa is LEVEL to create the 360 degree spillover. If it is not level then it really doesn't really matter from what direction the water is coming from.

Also remember, if in SPA mode, and you want to run the bubblers then they must be connected to the dedicated pump for your water feature as well. You will want to have a valve between those 2 systems such that you can run only the water feature or only run the bubblers or run both simultaneously. If you wish to only run some of the bubblers then you also need more pipes to hook those up independently. You will need 2" or larger suction pipe coming from the pool to feed all of those water features. Look at the requirements of the waterfall feature first to ensure you have sufficient volume requirements. Your PB should be able to help you with this.
Hi
Once again thanks for your time to engage and educate me on my first time pool build journey. Thanks for your suggestion to have a dedicated pump for spa jets. You made a great point that I should make sure that the spa is level for therapy jets to work efficiently. May be I read your mind in advance that I bought 4' leveler from LOWES on this past Saturday. What is your opinion or suggestion for floor returns vs wall returns for spillover effect.
Currently my plumbing diagram that I shared with you has the following connections:
Dedicated water feature pump with separate suction line from pool. Since this pump can run independently, I don't need to worry about pool mode spa mode of the primary pump. Am I right?.
I've made the 5 LED Bubblers (3 in SE & 2 DE) plumbed to the primary pump (Pool & Spa). But, if I'm in SPA mode, I can not run the 5 LED Bubblers, right?. But, if I make or extend the plumbing connection to the second water feature pump, I should be able to run these bubblers in SPA mode right?. Here is how I want to operate the water feature pump:
Rain fall water feature will run always (irrespective of pool mode or spa mode of the primary pump).
In spa mode I want to run both water feature as well as 5 LED bubblers. Where do I put the 3 WAY motorized actuator valve?.
Please let me know.
 

HermanTX

Gold Supporter
May 20, 2020
1,942
Katy TX
Pool Size
14600
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Liquid Chlorine
You made a great point that I should make sure that the spa is level for therapy jets to work efficiently. May be I read your mind in advance that I bought 4' leveler from LOWES on this past Saturday. What is your opinion or suggestion for floor returns vs wall returns for spillover effect.
So lets get some terminology defined. The Therapy Jets are just dedicated returns to the spa. Their purpose is to provide you a high pressure stream to massage the body. As you have discussed with @ajw22 above, it would be best to have these on a separate pump (with its own suction from the spa). It does not need to go through the filter and heater. This way you can turn off these jets even if you are in Spa Mode and just want the warm water to circulate. The Therapy jets do not cause the spa to spillover into the pool. It just circulates the spa water through these dedicated jets.

The standard returns to the spa which also have its own suction but it is tied to the main filter pump. So when in Spa Mode the water is sucked from the other spa drains through the main filter pump, through the filter and heater and back to the spa. The returns to the spa can be on the floor or on the side. In this mode, the spa should not overflow to the pool because you want to keep the hot water in the spa. When in SPA mode, you cannot operate other water features that return to the pool unless they are on a dedicated pump and circulation system. More on that later.

Now for spillover mode. One of your standard spa floor returns will also be connected to one of your pool return lines but it will be controlled by a valve. You will need to be in Pool Mode - where the suction is from the pool, to the main filter pump, through the filter, through the heater (does not need to be on) and back to the pool via the returns you have set up. To go into spillover mode, you open this valve what diverts some of the return flow now to the spa (in addition to the main pool). The spa starts to fill but since there is no suction in the spa open (you are in Pool Mode) then the water level will rise until it spills over into the pool. The spa has to be level to create the 360 degree effect or water will flow only to the lowest spot - i.e. water takes the path of least resistance. So the spa return tied to the pool return creates the water necessary to fill the spa. How fast you push water through this will also determine how the spa cascades over the edge. When you close the spillover valve you shutoff flow to the spa so the water will just be idle. As indicated by others, it is best to program to go to spillover mode a couple times a day to ensure your spa has fresh chlorinated water in it.
 

Enjoying this content?

Support TFP with a donation.

Give Support

HermanTX

Gold Supporter
May 20, 2020
1,942
Katy TX
Pool Size
14600
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Liquid Chlorine
Dedicated water feature pump with separate suction line from pool. Since this pump can run independently, I don't need to worry about pool mode spa mode of the primary pump. Am I right?.
I've made the 5 LED Bubblers (3 in SE & 2 DE) plumbed to the primary pump (Pool & Spa). But, if I'm in SPA mode, I can not run the 5 LED Bubblers, right?. But, if I make or extend the plumbing connection to the second water feature pump, I should be able to run these bubblers in SPA mode right?. Here is how I want to operate the water feature pump:
Rain fall water feature will run always (irrespective of pool mode or spa mode of the primary pump).
In spa mode I want to run both water feature as well as 5 LED bubblers. Where do I put the 3 WAY motorized actuator valve?.
So right now we have defined 2 pumps - 1 is the main filter pump and the second is the dedicated pump for your Therapy Jets if you so choose to set that up. Now we can define the 3rd pump which is your water feature pump. All water features flow back to the pool (the rainfall and the 5 bubblers) so if you wish to operate these in either Pool Mode or Spa Mode then these should also be set up with a dedicated water feature pump with its own suction from the pool. As with the Therapy Jet circulation system, the water feature circulation does NOT need to go through the filter or the heater plumbing. It will be a common suction to this 3rd water feature pump and the return will have 3 separate lines. The main line will be the rainfall water feature (there is no valve on this line) so when you turn on the water feature pump you get rainfall regardless if in Spa Mode or Pool Mode. The other 2 lines will have a valve on them (at the equipment pad). One line will go to 3 bubblers and the other line will go to the 2 bubblers. You can selectively turn all on or just 1 or the other bubbler set based on which valves you open or close on these lines. As an option, you can tie all 5 bubblers to 1 line therefore you only need 2 lines coming from the dedicated water feature pump - one for the rainfall and the other for the 5 bubblers. The line to the bubblers would have a valve to either turn them all on or all off. This water feature pump may be best to be a Variable Speed pump because you may need to control the flow when in rainfall mode vs having all the features run at the same time. Since all of these lines are on its own circulation path then it does not matter if your main system is in Pool Mode or Spa Mode. However, it would be good to run these occasionally to keep the lines fresh with chlorinated water.

Now be aware that if you run the rainfall water feature constantly then you will slowly increase your pH over time. So you need to be prepared to test often and add muriatic acid as needed.
 

ajw22

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jul 21, 2013
26,309
Northern NJ
Pool Size
35000
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Greetings!.
Thanks for educating me and sharing your beautiful SPA picture. I hope, more or less I understood the spill over concept. Here it is, please correct me, if I'm wrong:
PENTAIR INTELLICENTER AUTOMATION has "Spill Over" mode apart from more familiar "Pool & Spa" mode, am I right?. If true, In such a scenario, in pool mode small amount of water is delivered either to floor or to wall return, depending upon what type of return one has. In this case, I don't need check valve, right?.

We can have a separate discussion about the pros and cons of floor and wall returns.

You do not need a checkvalve if the valve to your spa return will be closed when your pump is off.


Note: I hope this is a great feature for people like me, who has very limited knowledge on how mechanical aspects of pool works.

What is a great feature?

I do not understand why you have lines that connect between your SPA-FR lines and your P-FR lines. They should operate independently.
You are right. It was my poor understanding and hence made that mistake. I removed the joint connection now. They will run independently.

Good.

I have two returns in the spa for water from the shared filter/heater and spillover.
Do the spill over occurs on both wall returns?.

Water comes out of the two lower returns in two modes.

In SPA mode that is the outlet for the filtered and heated water.

In SPILLOVER mode water is suctioned from the pool skimmers and returns through t \he two spa returns and then spillsover into the pool for circulation between the spa and the pool.

I see that you have TWO suctions per pump. I assume, the second one is for backup, if one goes bad, am I right?

No, two suction inlets spread apart form a VGBA entraption proof safety drain. Two inlest are plumbed into one suction pipe to it's pump. See Safety Drains VGBA - Further Reading


. If my understanding is correct, each pump need it's own suction line ( at least one/pump).

Correct.

My pool builder is offering me "Eclipse" main drain by Blue Square. I'll definitely ask him TWO for pool side.

There are various designs for safety drains. Some that use one large inlet and others use two smaller ones.

One for pool & spa pump, the other one for water feature pump.

In the pool you have skimmers plus a main drain for your filter pump suction.

In the pool you also have a suction drain, often placed on a side wall, for the water feature pump.

For spa currently he is offering one Eclipse main drain. But, I want to future proof it for dedicated spa pump. Do I need to ask him to provide one more Eclipse for spa.

In the spa you have a suction drain in the floor for the filter pump when in SPA mode.

Then you need a second suction drain if you want the jets on a separate dedicated jet pump.

I then have a dedicated spa jet pump that takes in water from the spa and feeds it out the 8 jets. No filter or heater on that water loop,
Do u get heated and filtered water through the spa jets?.

The dedicated spa jet pump gets whatever temperature water is in the spa and circulates it back out the jets.

If my understanding is correct, you will run your pool& Spa pump in Spa mode just to filter and heat the spa water.

SPA mode heats and filters the spa water and keeps it at the desired temperature. We can have a calm soak in the spa without the jets on.

At the same time you run your dedicated spa jet pump to take this water through the separate suction lines and return only to spa jets. Am I correct?.

We can then turn on the spa jets and/or the air blower for bubbles in the spa when we want.
 

ajw22

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jul 21, 2013
26,309
Northern NJ
Pool Size
35000
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Let's discuss your infinity edge spa. It looks really cool in design and pictures but I think it is a pain to live with.

If you run the spa spillover all the time to keep the infinity edge flowing over the spa you will have a constantly rising pH problem. And you will need to add acid almost every day to keep the pH in the 7's.

When you want to use the spa and heat it you are not going to run the spillover and infinity edge as you would lose the water you are heating.

So you might run the spa infinity edge once in a while to show it off to friends when you party.

In addition spillover areas often have waterline scale buildup problems depending on the materials used and your environment. A 360 degree spillover can end up being a maintenance problem keeping it clean.

You see the 360 degree spillovers in commercial pool and they have dedicated people maintaining it and don't care about the maintenance cost.

People have enough problems with their spillovers. I want to make sure you understand what you are signing up for with an infinity edge 360 degree design.

And as Herman has pointed out the construction of the edge must be perfect for the infinity edge to have the effect. We have seen ones with uneven flow. You need to get msona nd tile folsk who are true craftsmen and understand what they are building. Those skills are rare.
 

MARV19

Member
Aug 25, 2018
24
Wesley Chapel/ FL
Let's discuss your infinity edge spa. It looks really cool in design and pictures but I think it is a pain to live with.

If you run the spa spillover all the time to keep the infinity edge flowing over the spa you will have a constantly rising pH problem. And you will need to add acid almost every day to keep the pH in the 7's.

When you want to use the spa and heat it you are not going to run the spillover and infinity edge as you would lose the water you are heating.

So you might run the spa infinity edge once in a while to show it off to friends when you party.

In addition spillover areas often have waterline scale buildup problems depending on the materials used and your environment. A 360 degree spillover can end up being a maintenance problem keeping it clean.

You see the 360 degree spillovers in commercial pool and they have dedicated people maintaining it and don't care about the maintenance cost.

People have enough problems with their spillovers. I want to make sure you understand what you are signing up for with an infinity edge 360 degree design.

And as Herman has pointed out the construction of the edge must be perfect for the infinity edge to have the effect. We have seen ones with uneven flow. You need to get msona nd tile folsk who are true craftsmen and understand what they are building. Those skills are rare.
Thank you for your valuable suggestions. I’ll keep an eye on the maintenance related issues. Unfortunately I can not sacrifice this feature, because my wife wants it. More work for me. In any case thanks for your time to explain pros and cons of infinity SPA.
 

MARV19

Member
Aug 25, 2018
24
Wesley Chapel/ FL
We can have a separate discussion about the pros and cons of floor and wall returns.

You do not need a checkvalve if the valve to your spa return will be closed when your pump is off.




What is a great feature?



Good.



Water comes out of the two lower returns in two modes.

In SPA mode that is the outlet for the filtered and heated water.

In SPILLOVER mode water is suctioned from the pool skimmers and returns through t \he two spa returns and then spillsover into the pool for circulation between the spa and the pool.



No, two suction inlets spread apart form a VGBA entraption proof safety drain. Two inlest are plumbed into one suction pipe to it's pump. See Safety Drains VGBA - Further Reading




Correct.



There are various designs for safety drains. Some that use one large inlet and others use two smaller ones.



In the pool you have skimmers plus a main drain for your filter pump suction.

In the pool you also have a suction drain, often placed on a side wall, for the water feature pump.



In the spa you have a suction drain in the floor for the filter pump when in SPA mode.

Then you need a second suction drain if you want the jets on a separate dedicated jet pump.



The dedicated spa jet pump gets whatever temperature water is in the spa and circulates it back out the jets.



SPA mode heats and filters the spa water and keeps it at the desired temperature. We can have a calm soak in the spa without the jets on.



We can then turn on the spa jets and/or the air blower for bubbles in the spa when we want.
Great. Thank you for your detailed reply. Just on more doubt:
For spillover mode, no special plumbing or connection is needed between pool and spa. All I need is an appropriate automation tool which has spillover mode as one of its function, plus proper return line in the SPA ( floor or wall return does not matter). Did I inderstand correctly?. OR I’m still a clueless person on the mechanics of spillover function?.
If my understanding is correct, when in spillover mode, the motorized actuator rotates 45 degree angle or halfway between pool & SPA return side, therefore allowing both Pool and Spa return lines to open for water delivery, right?.
 

mknauss

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
Bronze Supporter
May 3, 2014
41,648
Laughlin, NV
Pool Size
6000
Surface
Fiberglass
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
If my understanding is correct, when in spillover mode, the motorized actuator rotates 45 degree angle or halfway between pool & SPA return side, therefore allowing both Pool and Spa return lines to open for water delivery, right?.
During spillover, suction is from the pool and return is to the spa. The return side valve will be turned to full spa during spillover.
 

MARV19

Member
Aug 25, 2018
24
Wesley Chapel/ FL
So lets get some terminology defined. The Therapy Jets are just dedicated returns to the spa. Their purpose is to provide you a high pressure stream to massage the body. As you have discussed with @ajw22 above, it would be best to have these on a separate pump (with its own suction from the spa). It does not need to go through the filter and heater. This way you can turn off these jets even if you are in Spa Mode and just want the warm water to circulate. The Therapy jets do not cause the spa to spillover into the pool. It just circulates the spa water through these dedicated jets.

The standard returns to the spa which also have its own suction but it is tied to the main filter pump. So when in Spa Mode the water is sucked from the other spa drains through the main filter pump, through the filter and heater and back to the spa. The returns to the spa can be on the floor or on the side. In this mode, the spa should not overflow to the pool because you want to keep the hot water in the spa. When in SPA mode, you cannot operate other water features that return to the pool unless they are on a dedicated pump and circulation system. More on that later.

Now for spillover mode. One of your standard spa floor returns will also be connected to one of your pool return lines but it will be controlled by a valve. You will need to be in Pool Mode - where the suction is from the pool, to the main filter pump, through the filter, through the heater (does not need to be on) and back to the pool via the returns you have set up. To go into spillover mode, you open this valve what diverts some of the return flow now to the spa (in addition to the main pool). The spa starts to fill but since there is no suction in the spa open (you are in Pool Mode) then the water level will rise until it spills over into the pool. The spa has to be level to create the 360 degree effect or water will flow only to the lowest spot - i.e. water takes the path of least resistance. So the spa return tied to the pool return creates the water necessary to fill the spa. How fast you push water through this will also determine how the spa cascades over the edge. When you close the spillover valve you shutoff flow to the spa so the water will just be idle. As indicated by others, it is best to program to go to spillover mode a couple times a day to ensure your spa has fresh chlorinated water in it.
Hi
Thank for your time with great detailed explanation of how spillover mode works. Your explanation really helped me understand better now. However, I’ve one question, Do I need to make a physical connection between SPA return line and pool return line. I’m lost here. I thought that the automation will take care of this one. So, I don’t need any special connection between Pool and SPA for spillover to work. My assumption is, the MAV will turn halfway between pool & spa during spillover mode. Thereby allowing both pool returns and SPA returns to open for water delivery. During this process water is taken out only from Pool main drain and or skimmer with SPA main drain is CLOSED. Did I misunderstand this?.
Thanks
 

MARV19

Member
Aug 25, 2018
24
Wesley Chapel/ FL
During spillover, suction is from the pool and return is to the spa. The return side valve will be turned to full spa during spillover.
Thank you. Yes, I r right. Why would pool return open for SPA spillover. Why didn’t I think about that. In any case thanks for correcting my misstatement.
 
Thread Status
Hello , There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.